How to make a Jacket picture for DVD

[Joe Justa]

You've just pointed back to the same message which I quoted. All that message says is to make the MPEG file 1 GOP in length by using 15 files of the same image.

How??? TMPGEnc expects a _single_ input file, not 15. How are those 15 files used by TMPGEnc to create an MPEG file???

[FOO]

Avisynth will make a clip with the same picture in every frame,
which you can serve to TMPgenc.

ImageReader("whatever.bmp", 0 , 1800 , 30)	#

That makes a 1 minute clip at 30 fps

But... I think all you want is 1 I frame for the Sony.

[Joe Justa]

Hi Foo. Hmm... one frame is what everyone seems to say, but my findings are that I only get a proper JACKET_P picture display when my MPEG2 is at least a second long (read about it here https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=232001). Perhaps this is because what is wanted is an entire GOP.

As I wrote in the above link, I've been achieving that by using a sound file, which makes the resulting MPEG as long as the sound file, then taking only the video stream. But, in this thread BJ_M seemed to be saying that TMPGEnc can create an entire GOP, without use of a sound file?

[FOO]

I too have problems with jacket pictures. When I put one on a DVD,
the Sony CX860 recognizes it, but either displays it wrong or hangs up.
I gave up for a while because the player won't play my RWs and I don't
want to waste 10 DVDs.
This is what Vdub mpeg says about a real jacket_p

[BJ_M]

tmpgenc will read frames - as in jpg and targa files for example ..

it doesnt mater if there are 10 of them or 50,000 of them ...
it will make a video of the lenth of your frames -

[Joe Justa]

Foo, good screenshot. It definitely makes it clear that there is only one frame in whatever file you were looking at. What is "Vdub mpeg"? Is it a free utility?

I don't have any tools to display such information, but Windows Media Player does tell a little bit about a file. Interestingly, every JACKET_P picture from commercial movie DVDs that I've looked at, has shown as 720x540 in WMP. And, those that I make using the technique described in the link I mentioned, show exactly the same in WMP, and every one has displayed perfectly on my Sony stand-alone single-disk player (which means it's only using the Large file, not the other two). Is the Sony CX860 a multi-disk player? I now put JACKET_P pictures on every disk I burn.

[bruced]

If you insert 6 frames (as suggested by one of my editors) in this routine, you will end up with a pix that is 1 second long for the 720 x 480. But one frame will only work with the 96 x 64 pix for the CX875P Sony.

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=235177&highlight=jacketp

[Cornucopia]

If you insert 6 frames (as suggested by one of my editors) in this routine, you will end up with a pix that is 1 second long for the 720 x 480. But one frame will only work with the 96 x 64 pix for the CX875P Sony.

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=235177&highlight=jacketp

Maybe I'm missing something, but 6 frames can only =1 second if they run at 6 fps, no?
Since DVD is 25 or 29.97 MPEG2, you really want a 1 GOP file (~= 1/2 sec., depending on GOP length)

Scott

[bruced]

Scott,
Being an engineer, I understand the math, but the time is as reported by TMPGEnc, and the image is in view long enough to be seen which means either the screen has a long persistance, or it is there longer than the math says it should be. Display time is not a criteria as far as I know.
My point is, this works for Jacket pictures on my CX875P when all the other things I've seen and tried didn't. In order to end up with picture files that approach the byte size of commercial ones, it is necessary to use 6 frames in the large (720x480) size, but not in the medium and small sizes, where one frame is adequate.
If the large picture will display on the changers that use the 5L image, with only one frame, then there is no need for 6 frames.

[skeg64]

Hi,
I am using Maestro to create JACKET_P's, and it works fine, no problems there. However, I can't for the life of me figure out how to BURN them.
Using nero 6 (latest version), it will not let me add a JACKET_P folder to the DVD video project. When I try to add that folder it gives the error "no compatible files found", meaning it will only let you burn VOBs, IFO's etc and not .MP2's.
I have also tried creating an ISO image of the disc with dvdshrink, then editing inside the ISO with a program called UltraISO. This seems ok at first, but the burnt discs do not play in my standalone player. I can mount the image using daemon tools and it plays fine on my PC.
I also tried making a nero disc image and editing that with UltraISO, but same problem.
Can anyone please tell me how they successfully burn a DVD with a JACKET_P folder??

EDIT: It's ok, I figured it out. I created an image of the directory using ImgTools and burned with DVDdecrypter. Hopefully this will help someone else out. It's a bit of a clumsy method, pity Nero doesn't support it yet.

[bruced]

skeg64,
If you create the JACKET_P folder FIRST with files inside. Then open Nero Burning ROM and choose NEW DVD-Video, you can drag the folder into the extreme left column and it will be added to the burn.
Just drag the files from your VIDEO_TS folder into the VIDEO_TS folder already in the left column, instead of dragging your VIDEO_TS.

That's how I add the Jacket_p folder into Nero 6.

[FallenAngel10]

Little app to add/edit Volume/Titles/Chapters etc dvd-Text (including sony second line) if you want.
Can add pre made menu (generic for navigation/Sound selection or roll your own)

Some menutemplates there too

Located At:
http://www.dvdshrink.info/titlewriter/
Titlewriterfiles.zip

[skeg64]

@bruced
I've tried that. Perhaps the problem was that I have Nero OEM version and not the full package. I use "Nero Express" to burn a new DVD video, maybe this isn't what you're using. I was never sure exactly what the differences are. This program does not let me drag a folder containing .m2v's into the project. It says "no compatible files found". Here is a screenshot of the program:



@Fallen
Had Titlewriter for a while now, love it, thanks! But, I would like to see an explanation of exactly what each feature does and how to use it. Are you still developing it?

edit: hey whaddaya know, I followed the link automatically put in my post to nero express, and found out what the difference is. All this time when people were mentioning "nero burning rom" I thought they were using the same program as me.

[Cornucopia]

I think this is a prime example of the difference between a "regular" and and "express" app. Express is just like the name says--lite, fast & easy (as long as you're doing something simple). But with JACKET_P, you're no longer doing the plain & simple.

Use Nero Burning ROM (not express), I think even OEM versions will allow the JACKET_P, just like the man said. I've been doing it this way for a while, no problem here.

Scott

[FallenAngel10]

Actually the site contains a helpfile explaining titlewriter.
And yes still playing with it -- working on readding original menus back after dvd (Shrink/Shrunk) reauthored mode -- current ver only works readding original menus in limited cases

[skeg64]

Hi FallenAngel,
I looked for the help file you mentioned, but only found the "make a menu" tutorial. Is this what you meant?
I just read what the option "Force TextData segment reauthor" does on the digital-digest forums, but what about "include sorting support" (which is checked by default)? The other options all seem to be to do with adding menus to the disc, which I don't use at this stage, but may well do in the future.
Do you know of a site that explains about DVD text: how much information can be stored, how/what is actually used on different players, what all the different descriptions are (NAME/AUTHOR/CHAPTERS etc)...?
P.S. The program works great with DVD Maestro - authored discs.

[bruced]

skeg64,
Yes, I'm using the"full" version of Nero 6. I also found out that there are several different "OEM" versions. A friend bought a $9.95 OEM from a website because I told him that he needed the SoundTrax to make audio CD's. After several long e-mail's I finally sent him my OEM and he e-mailed me the graphics from his and the two were no where alike, and his did not have the SoundTrax in it.

[FallenAngel10]

Skeg64 -- You must have an older version -- Its in titlewriterfiles Titlewriterhelp
--Option Sorting support
Some Very old (And I mean old) players (single disc) that supposedly support dvd_text glitch badly if sorting support is added. Its primarily used by dvd player for alternate sorting (for ex volume names in internal player menu).
-- ? Site explaining dvd_text
There isn't one (Actually nobody knows without sony's 5000$ book and a signature in blood)
Heres a few things I worked/guessed out
Ive found 255 codes (VOLUME,Title,Karoke,CELL etc)
There are 255 subcodes (subcode validity is dependent on code )
and include for ex Directors Name,Song Title, Primary Actor, Actress, comments, producer, etc -- and theres probably codes for who kissed the directors butt in there
Titlewriter will rewrite unsupported subcodes to OTHER
Individual chapters of titleset can be named
Individual Cells in chapters can be named (No Titlewriter support)
No Limit on Dvd_Text table size (But Titlewriter has a 1 Segment (2kb Limit) -Overhead+text)
No Limit on individual text String length (each string may(?)end with a tab --Player may truncate to internal memory limits)
You can Name up to 99 Title Play Maps(Think Titlesets limit)
All the above is dependent on player Supporting the codes/subcodes
(I don't think any player including sonys supports them all)
TitleWriter supports the most popular ones

Goofing around with the proggie I've managed to create MST3k like commentary on jukebox player (pioneer) led. (Got bored once and decided to push the limits)

[skeg64]

holy crap, you've been busy since when I last got it. It's great having a help file! I will have to play around with "shrinkandtitlewrite" too.
Next I'm going to see if a menu made with Maestro can be used as a template for TW.

[bruced]

If you insert 6 frames (as suggested by one of my editors) in this routine, you will end up with a pix that is 1 second long for the 720 x 480. But one frame will only work with the 96 x 64 pix for the CX875P Sony.

https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=235177&highlight=jacketp

Maybe I'm missing something, but 6 frames can only =1 second if they run at 6 fps, no?
Since DVD is 25 or 29.97 MPEG2, you really want a 1 GOP file (~= 1/2 sec., depending on GOP length)

Scott

Scott,
This item has bothered me not only from your question here, but also why the Jacket pictures I created required that the GOP be setup for I frames only. Just recently ran across a good description of Key Frames and how they are used in MPEG videos. Essentially a Key Frame or an "I" Frame is a whole picture. If you were to run your video camera in a room the first picture the camera takes is the static room with walls, doors, windows etc. not moving. The first picture would become a Key Frame in the resulting MPEG file, and there actually would be no more pictures included in the MPEG file. While the GOP structure governs the exact Key Frame sequence, the Key Frame time length is extended as long as necessary to fill all succeeding frames, AS LONG AS there is no movement in the picture. If someone were to walk in front of the camera, a new Key Frame is generated and carried forward in time until the movement stops and another Key Frame is generated.
The only pixels recorded inbetween these two Key Frames are the pixels of the moving individual. Reducing the number of pixels recorded this way is what gives the compression to the file. It also explains why adding more Key Frames than necessary to a file increases the size of the finished MPEG file, and why videos with lots of fast movement create such large files.
In the Jacket pictures, the TMPGEnc program has decided the MPEG file is going to be 1 second in length, so the BMP graphic it's converting and which has no moving subjects is simply extended for 1 second, regardless of the frames-per-second setting.
This simple explanation has given me much more insight into this recording buisness.

Regards,
Bruce

[BJ_M]

The only pixels recorded inbetween these two Key Frames are the pixels of the moving individual. Reducing the number of pixels recorded this way is what gives the compression to the file. It also explains why adding more Key Frames than necessary to a file increases the size of the finished MPEG file, and why videos with lots of fast movement create such large files.
In the Jacket pictures, the TMPGEnc program has decided the MPEG file is going to be 1 second in length, so the BMP graphic it's converting and which has no moving subjects is simply extended for 1 second, regardless of the frames-per-second setting.

this is incorrect ..

first- in a mpeg , the P and B frames are more than just the pixels recorded between the I frames ...

second - the number of I frames (what you call key frames) has no relationship on the file size ..


if you make a 1 hour movie with only one I frame (you can do this in tmpgenc) and 4000 CBR and a 1 hour movie that is all I frames (you can do this in many encoders) and that is at 4000CBR , they will be the same size .

[TBoneit]

Thanks to EVERYONE for thier help. I FINALY got the jacket_p's to work on my Sony 875. Even figured out how to get the text to show up automaticaly as well. I HAD to use Scenarist though. I was having trouble "learning" Maestro. Scenarist worked like a charm. The text info was a little tricky, but I got it to work. If anyone needs help with making JACKET_P's to work for a Sony DVD Jukebox, or the text info, let me know and I see if I can make a litle "how to". The original procedure at the top of this thread does NOT work. Which leads me to believe that the encodeing process or something is wrong. The pics would work on my other players, but not the Sony when using that method.

Just ran across this thread, I've got the Sony 985, And so far trying to get the DVD text working, I've created several coasters. Any help would be appreciated.

TIA
Roger

[TBoneit]

Little app to add/edit Volume/Titles/Chapters etc dvd-Text (including sony second line) if you want.
Can add pre made menu (generic for navigation/Sound selection or roll your own)

Some menutemplates there too

Located At:
http://www.dvdshrink.info/titlewriter/
Titlewriterfiles.zip

Hello Fallen Angel, I had tried Titlewriter1.52.exe, It nver worked except once in my Sony 985, The Disks wouldn,t even play.

I'm slightly leary, Do you think TitleWriter1.654.exe will work better, IE what changes?

Thanks

Edit: Well I see others are using titlewriter successfully, I just made another disk that the Sony won't play, Operator error maybe?

I figure I must be doing something wrong, just don't know what, Any Ideas?

Cheers

[FallenAngel10]

Tboneit Post your VIDEO_TS.IFO from the disk that crashes at this forum.

http://forum.digital-digest.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=39486

Perhaps i'll be able to answer then.
There are very few functional changes in the Dvd_Text area of the code in the newest ver. (Yours is the first prob I.ve heard in months). I'll assume you are using the newest ver.
? will Dvd_Shrink or Ifoedit open and play the Dvd

FAllenAngel

[bruced]

BJ_M

Sorry, I didn't mean to imply that all I frames are Key frames. This is certainly not the case. I have been trying to understand why the jacket picture consisting of one I frame lasts for 1 second at a rate of 29.97 frames per second. The explanation came from a college website which I forgot to write down or put into a bookmark. It took quite a while to find it, although there are a number of websites that re-iterate the same explanation about keyframes and their function in MPEG files.
If you have a better or more understandable way to explain this, please pass it along.
Thanx
BruceD

[Flarch]

Commenting very late, but here's something odd.

From HP and the Goblet of Fire:

J00___5L.MP2 ---> 640 x 480 movie image
J00___5M.MP2 ---> 148 x 112 text movie title
J00___5S.MP2 ---> 84 x 64 text movie title

All seem to be 1 frame.

[BJ_M]

yes - that is correct

[TooLFooL]

many discs have that "text title" for the 2 smaller images simply because the picture becomes unrecognizable at that size.

[dellov1]

OK. To those interested, I think that I just proved that my issues do NOT lie with the player. I just burned a disk with a JACKET_P from an original along with my VIDEO_TS and AUDIO_TS. It worked as it supposed too. So my "problems" are with the MP2's that I am creating. Can anyone out there help???

Terrell28, i have also been searching for this information. Not untill SpiderMan3 have i wanted to copy the Jacket_P and make it work on my Sony 400 cd/dvd changer/player. I also use this as my main DVD player and it has the same funtions on yours. I am able to hit the folder button and see a list of names and picture of movies. I can also capture a picture from the movie and have that displayed but on the Spiderman dvd i wanted the original. I juse the following.

DVD Shrink
AnyDVD
Nero6

How do you get to make a backup and include your Jacket_P from the Original DVD and make it work with your player?

[scruffziller]

Does Nero 8 do the Jacket Picture automatically?