CCE multipass settings?

[davidian]

Hey. If I'm going to rip a DVD to SVCD using CCE as the encoder, how much does the multipass VBR affect? I know that I should at least have 2-pass VBR but if I take 4? 5? 9-pass VBR, is the quality better then? How much does it matter.. really?

[Truman]

CCE manual:
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Quote:</font><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE>
Specify the number of times of executing encoding in Passes .
The range of values which can be specified here is 1 ~9.
When two or more passes are specified,the encoding result is
alternately output to the two files which are set in Video files .
This is because the encoding result up to the previous pass can
be saved when the Multipass VBR mode is used for encoding.
This is effective when lengthy stream is created.
Image quality slightly improves each time encoding is repeated,
but quality improvement reaches its limit at 3 ~4times of
encoding.
</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR></TABLE>

edit: now it should look properly, damn .pdf..

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: Truman on 2001-09-09 16:50:47 ]</font>

[ccngo]

Do you have cce as a stand alone or plugin

[kriskim]

what multipass vbr does is essentially go through the movie, and allocate bits where it's most needed. the more passes you do, the better your bits will be allocated.

when i have the time, i prefer 4-pass, on occasion, 5 pass. (but i have a very fast system). if you're cpu is borderline (early p3s), 3-pass is what's "generally" accepted, especially in the dvd-ripping scene. many times, when lazy groups encode only 1pass or cbr, nukes are dealt out unforgivingly. but whatever you think looks good is good, but if it's your first time, i'd say 3-pass always looks fair.

the lower bitrate you use though, the more the number of vbr passes will be significant.

[abularkin]

Alternatively, I used Tmpegenc with 2 pass VBR( with a Celeron 500 mhx / 63 MB RAM) and it took 32 hrs. for an 80 min movie, but it is the best conversion that I have ever made. No macroblocks. No blurring. Textures of the scenes are perfect. AVG br=2400 / min br=1150 / max br=2500. All freeware. All compatible with older systems.

[Sully]

As already mentioned, the more passes the better CCE deals with distibuting the bits. All this info is stored in an .ecl file, which is a file CCE creates prior to actual encoding "telling" CCE how it should encode the source file. Obviously the more passes used, the more exact dispursion of bits & thus the better the quality of the end video. Keep in mind though, contrary to TMPGEnc, CCE will always do one more pass than you specify. The first pass is the creation of the .ecl file THEN it starts doing the actual encoding with the number of passes you decide to do.

[Truman]

Well, the first "pass" is the creation of .vaf (video information) file.
.ecl (encoder control list) is just a project file, that you need sometimes too.

[davidian]

Thanks! That was going to be my next question. Why the hell does CCE spend 10 hours making a vaf..

/Johan

[klaus]

Hi abularkin,
i converted about 1 minute with your method and got a 20 Mb
file. if you want to make a 100 or 120 min. movie that will fit on 2 90min-CD, what settings do you propose ?
How do you calculate this ?


<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: klaus on 2001-09-14 07:26:43 ]</font>

[Truman]

Calculate the average (or constant) bitrate with a bitrate calculator.
Example: You can fit 120 minutes on 2 90min CDs, if you set the avg bitrate to 1791(video) / 224 (audio)

[klaus]

Thanks for the tip truman.
But what`s about the min- and max-bitrate i can enter when encoding 2-pass VBR with TMPGEnc ?

[Truman]

Min and max does not effect the calculation, so it's your choise.
Set the maximum, that your dvd player can handle or according to SVCD specs to 2520kbps (+224 audio)
You can set the minimum to zero or whatever you want.

[nfl2k2]

All movie lengths set to 2 cd's

max 2590
min 300
max avg 9999
min avg 0

audio 128

4-5 passes is what I use, usually gets done if I start before 11 PM and get back from school at 3:30 PM for any length movie to fit on 2 cd's.

[Jeomite]

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Quote:</font><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE>
On 2001-09-12 04:42:03, abularkin wrote:
Alternatively, I used Tmpegenc with 2 pass VBR( with a Celeron 500 mhx / 63 MB RAM) and it took 32 hrs. for an 80 min movie, but it is the best conversion that I have ever made. No macroblocks. No blurring. Textures of the scenes are perfect. AVG br=2400 / min br=1150 / max br=2500. All freeware. All compatible with older systems.

</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR></TABLE>
There's bare minimal improvement if you try VBR with an Average Bitrate above ~2200kbit. Might as well do 2200 CBR.

[Sully]

thanx Truman. Very true, just didn't pay attention to what I actually wrote.

Jeomite - That may be true with the quality... to a certian point. The advantage of using VBR is the encoder uses less bits when they aren't needed in the first place. That results in two things - usually smaller files sizes & better quality & bitrate usage in those scenes when it's really needed. IMOHO, it doesn't make much sense to be wasting the bits on a "slow" scene when a few minutes later you'll need them on a "fast" one. That make sense?

[Jeomite]

Sully,
I agree to some degree. If you're making a DVDRip, in the end, you plan on using the most out of your CDRs. So you might as well go all out if you're bitrate is 2200kbit or higher (if that'll fit your accommadated amount of CDRs). There's so point of 'preserving' space on a DVDRip, since you already won't be using that remainder of space for anything else.
But if it's something else like a captured video or something you're going to leave on your hard disk, using VBR instead CBR will help out with saving you a few MB. =)

[Sully]

Point taken. I just didn't realize you're encoding something to leave on your HD. From my own practice I ONLY encode what I also plan on burning. If you're leaving it on your HD for "trading" porpuses or whatever that can be a completly different situation. Although I still have to say (from my own experience only) VBR will give you smaller file sizes while still maintaining the same quality throughout the "clip".

To each his own! Happy encoding.