Sticky labels can screwup the playback of your DVDR's

[engelm]

After reviewing this thread and some others like it I decided to do a little research. I use Fuji DVD+R disks. The package states DO NOT apply labels to either side of the disk. It also states that only oil based pens should be used to label the disk. Alcohol should never be used on the disk. I have always used Sharpie permanent markers. Those markers are alcohol based ink. That might explain why my disks begin to fail after a couple of years of use. I checked the Sharpie web site and found that they make oil based markers, "Sharpie Paint Markers". My take on all this. Follow the manufactures guidlines and used oil based markers instead of alcohol.

[mpack]

It also states that only oil based pens should be used to label the disk. Alcohol should never be used on the disk.

I don't understand what possible harm can be done by writing - with pretty much anything you care to use (within reason) - on the non-read side of a single sided disk. Of course, some kinds of pen simply don't work on the glossy CD or DVD surface, but that certainly won't cause read errors!

The whole point of an alcohol based ink is that the alcohol is volatile: it completely evaporates in seconds, there is no possibility of it hanging around and (assuming it could) eating into the disk like an acid!

So, I don't know what those instructions are referring to...

[lordsmurf]

I have always used Sharpie permanent markers. Those markers are alcohol based ink. That might explain why my disks begin to fail after a couple of years of use. .

No. You're writing on the plastic upper layer. That cannot do anything at all to the disc. You could cover the whole thing in black marker, and it would not matter.

[Mavrick]

Just a little comment from a newbie here, but an old computer dude.

I went to prodisc 03’s and a R200 and can’t be happier with the results, no more skipping and freeze ups. I just recopy the discs and give the sharpie marked discs to friends. Prodisc pintables are less than 50 cents a disc, and the R200 does a Great job with them. And my Plextor 712A and NEC 1300a just love them.

Do you have a link to the exact type of ProDisc you buy?

[dudeman316]

there are quite a few places that have good printable discs. Shop4tech, Rima, & American-digital are a few I have shopped from.

[akagi]

I have done my own experiment with Labels. I burnt a series of small MPEG 1 files onto a DVD. Granted this DVD+R was not of the highest quality being a BulkHQ disk but having done the burn I had absolutely no read errors doing a full surface scan with DVDINFOPRO. I then used a label on the disk placing such as centrally as it was possible to do. Now I would emphasise here that there was a LIMITED amount of ink actually on the label with such only reading 'DISK ONE' in two locations, nothing more, for identification purposes only.

I then IMMEDIATELY reused DVDINFOPRO to carry out a surface scan. (I emphasise the 'immediately' caveat as there would not have been chance for any glue/ink to dye contamination). Doing this then showed read errors. However then going back to play some of these MPEG1 files did not create issues despite the fact one would think it would.

In conclusion my take on things is that applying a label unbalances the disk, not excessively so, but enough that if the disk has to remain running, such as if a movie in a DVD Player is being watched or a surface scan being run, the vibrations build up and up (through resonance) until they create read problems. However, if smaller files such as my MPEG1's above are played or copied across to the PC the issue does not occur - the disk slows down before the vibrations build up to the critical point.

If it is resonance this would explain why some people are having problems with DVD's and other aren't. Some might be working with data so they have a stop start read profile whilst others aren't. More importantly this resonance build up is HIGHLY environment dictated - if the distance between the disk surface say and the loading tray (the nearest relecting object) is of just the right distance such that any vibration is reflected back and amplified (what resonance is) then the critical point will be reached very quickly. If however the distance is such that the vibration is cancelled out by the reflection back then the critical point may never be reached.

For anybody who is having label issues then it makes sense to try a different DVD player if they can or alternatively try a slightly different bit rate (for movies) such that the disk speed is slightly different (meaning a different vibration amplitude) which might stop this vibration build up.

It might not be inks, glues, label type or whatever but a function of pure luck. For my part, recognising the above, I stopped using labels on my DVD movies but would think they should be ok on data DVD's.

Just my thoughts.

[Bubblevision]

I'm printing my Ritek G04 printables on my Epson R210 and then I lacquer with Pressit Sprayfix. It makes a nice job but I don't know just how waterproof and robust they are afterwards. I'm going to try with bog-standard acrylic lacquer from the hardware shop too.

[monkeyking]

No more labels here. Disks I labelled last summer are now showing jitter. I can't read data backup disks reliably. For data, I always re-read them right after burning, so I knew the burns were good.

When I look at the disks, most are bowed concave toward the label. Removing the labels fixed everything. They also were flat again.

[dewaynespaw]

I was having trouble at first with labeled DVD'S, but I bought a new DVD burner and I haven't had a problem since. I use the Memorex high gloss labels and the image covers the entire label and they look absolutely professional. It's hard to tell it is a label The only difference I see is my DVD-R's are only 20 minutes of music videos that I send out to fair committees and potential clients. I have not had any of my clients complain so far about DVD-R's I have sent them not working.

How much does a good printable DVD-R run for an inkjet printer. I know the printable CD/DVD printers (Epson is the only brand of printer I will use) start at about $100.00. Just wondering if it would be worth the change. A friend of mine sent a printable CD to me and I have to say it looked terrible. That could be the printer he was using too. Anyone have any suggestions on media types.

[Bodyslide]

Not to threadjack:
The epson 200 prints dvd's and cd's very well. It all depends on what the original image is you are using. If the image is a low quality image it will llok bad. Here is also a link to a CIS system for the Epson 200 that will save money on ink.
https://www.videohelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=241206

[Xylob the Destroyer]

i used to make labels for all of my DVD's, but i don't do it anymore
i didn't stop because it was causing problems tho...
i just got lazy
i now use a Sharpie to label my DVD's

[pixiemom]

Hi everyone,
I'm glad I haven't yet created & labelled any DVDs yet - that was going to start happening in a few weeks after I upgrade my computer and install the DVD recorder drive! But I do have a lot of CDs with labels. So far I haven't noticed any problems, but I haven't checked the oldest ones yet.

My question is - for those of you with an Epson R200 or R300 - would it be possible to use Durabrite (pigment) ink instead of regular Dye ink? Durabrite ink is waterproof and would completely eliminate the smudge problem, from what I understand. It's supposed to be used in the C80-series and the Pixma series, but I don't know.... are the engines similar enough that one could substitute Durabrite ink in the R200/300?

I have an Epson R200 (still in tne box, waiting for me to get either a CIS or refillable cartridges), and planned on printing my future CDs and DVDs with it, but I would be interested in some ideas on how to keep the ink from smudging.

[digitalwiz]

I have 25 DVD with full label printed in a inkjet printer... i can't read in any dvd drive or player i tried. DVD maxell, label Fellowes Neato. I peel off 1 label from the dvd to see if this can work but no, it's remain with the same problem... Can you help me? ah the dvd's was recorded like 18 months ago with a Panasonic DMR-E20

[rebarlow]

Two words:

Hub Labels

[BCAESE]

After doing an intense test the majority are right DO NOT PUT LABELS ON YOUR DVDRS!!
Especially if you movie takes up 4GB! If you moive is 2-3 GB you will be safe.

After my testing I found out it has to do with HEAT and TIME in your DVD player. If you play a 4GB DVD with a label it will almost always skip near the end.

However ther has been some cases were it didn't but you are gambling.
(this will only work if your DVD s are not printable and it also depends on your player). I have had 40% sucess with this method I have 5 different players. Play fine on 2/5 players.

Do Not put a labels on Printable DVDRs!! 100% of the time it will skip near the end if the movie is 4GB. The heat from you player heats up the DVD too much because of the label and fact that it is printable.

100% success with no label 5/5!

The people that are having sucess are probably not playing movies over 4GB this is why. The problem starts near the edges of the disc. TIME,Heat and Weight.

[fritzi93]

Two words:

Hub Labels

[mdw46]

I started out using avery label's, Then after being stored in a binder for a few months my dvd's started freezing..I tried using 3 different standalone players and still had the freezeup problem.I was suggested that i try removing the labels which i did.The disk's played with no problem !!!!
Mabe it was the avery paper,Who know's..I mark them with a sharpie marker now !!!!!

[mdw46]

I have also read that in time moisture get's under the label's

[Gritz]

BCAESE wrote:

The people that are having sucess are probably not playing movies over 4GB this is why. The problem starts near the edges of the disc. TIME,Heat and Weight.

Exactly ..... paper labels are death on full DVDs. Make you next printer one that prints directly to the "printable DVDs"

[cd090580]

Just one question about the labels.

Why when a label is put on a dvd, the playback become jerky ?

in computer, that makes CRC errors, on TV a lot of green mpg blocks.

does the label alter the reflexive properties ? weigthens the dvd too much ? the disk is no more centered ? or other things ?

thanks.

[ALBERT1]

SureThing Hub Labels, 520 quantity, $9.95 at LabelGear.com

I ordered the above labels and the kit to see if and/or how well they may work.

From everything I have researched independently and read in these posts, it seems reasonable that Hub Labels would be the safest way to go.

[junkmalle]

Why when a label is put on a dvd, the playback become jerky ?

There are many theories. The one that seems to be the case for my DVD player is that labels can warp the disk. Paper expands less than plastic when it's heated which causes the disk to warp, pulling the outer edge of the disk up away from the laser. Also, shrinkage as the glue dries out causes the disks to warp. Some drives can adjust for this, others can't.

I originally thought balance was an issue -- slightly offset lables (or uneven distribution of paper/glue) can cause the disk to wobble in the drive. I once cut half a label off, creating the worst possible balance problem. The disk was still readable but I thought my DVD player was going to explode from the vibrations!

Someone brought up the possibility that some players may have trouble gripping the disk with a slippery full-coverage paper label. This would be a case against hub labels. But I've never heard anyone with hub labels complain of problems -- so this may not be an issue.

Note that there doesn't have to be one cause for all DVD players. Some may be more sensitive to balance, some more sensitive to warping, etc.

[Gritz]

One explanation given was that the DVD tracks are so fine that any (even slight) out of balance condition causes erratic video at the outer edges where the speed picks up. Sounds reasonable .... and I've has so much trouble with paper labels that I ended up buying an Epson R300. Prints beautifully but after about 200 DVDs it fails to feed reliably. You can diddle around with it and make it feed ... but it's a pain in the arse!

[87gator]

Well I think I have verified that this is indeed a heat related problem whereby the label expands at a different rate than the disc causing the disc to flex. This would explain why the errors tend to occur toward the end of viewing, are random in nature, and why some players play (heat less) better than others. I've found that you can remedy the problem by putting the disc in the freezer for a short period of time (~1min) and then resume the movie. Next, I'm going to see if I can avoid the problem altogether by storing my discs in the freezer ;^)

[espaeth]

Edit: Re-read thread -- removed obviously flawed observation.

[joeg04]

Well I think I have verified that this is indeed a heat related problem

Also according to an article in the German computer magazine C't, paper labels warp the disk. See this news article:
http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/46600

Data Becker in Germany offers sticky labels specific for DVDs, made of polyethylene instead of paper, and also have a special glue. Colors offered are silver or white. They claim, that those labels don't warp DVDs and don't create any playback problems:
http://www.databecker.de/page.php?TemplateCategory=Artikeldetails&lngArtikelID=310559
Does anyone have experience with those?

[slalanc01]

Hi Everyone,

I have experienced playback problem after applied some label on my DVD media for my Toshiba SD-3750 DVD player. EVERY DVD was running with problem after I applied Full Coverage DVD Label (the one with the very little hole) . But strangly one of my DVD was always running correctly after I applied a CD LABEL (the one use for Audio CD with the larger hole). This is the only DVD I use a CD label and this is the only one running correctly!!! The 2 labels type (CD and Full Coverage) are from Neato

I don't have experimented other DVD yet but it may be an alternative??? Someone have similar expericence???

thanks

[edsmith77]

Good Morning to All,
Well at great risk, I am going to offer some unscientific data on the label, don't label issue.
When this topic first surfaced some time ago, I had unfortunately already labeled a bunch of CDs and DVDs. I have since made backups to protect myself from what seemed like the logical consequences. But I did not get rid of the labeled discs. In fact, I did my own rigorous and very scientific experiment.
I took 6 labeled CDs (music mix) and placed them in the glove compartment of my car and left them there (and they are still there now). They have survived two winters and two summers. I placed about six more in plastic jewel cases and put them in a closet in my bedroom. The remaining 12, I just left lying about with and without protection about the house.
The results.
They ALL still play perfectly. The labels are all still attached. None of the labels are starting to delaminate. This was most surprising for those in the glove box. But facts are facts. I have been hesitant to place them in the dash mounted player but instead used a portable cd player to test. All is well. I had even expected them to physically start to warp but that did not happen either. Those discs in the house are as good as the day I made them. The external temperature extremes for this period have been from -10 deg F to over 100 deg F.
Not one has ever shown any effects of "off-center" wobble as described by others visiting this forum.
So from my perspective and limited data, I am somewhat perplexed by what the data shows. But as of this writing I have discontinued using labels and totally rely on keeping Sharpie in business. Why, no real good reason.

Maybe another two years worth of data will make a difference.

[SCDVD]

As discussed before, labels contract at a different rate than the plastic that the discs are made of. This contraction results in a warping of the discs. The label's contraction causes the outer edge of the disc to pull up slightly which creates a focus problem for the player. Fortunately or unfortunately as the case may be, DVD media is MUCH more sensitive to this problem than CDR media. The focus tolerances on DVD media is very much tighter than on CDR media. It is critical that the reflective layer in the disc be much closer to the laser in the drive. That is why DVD media is actually a sandwich of two thin plastic discs with the reflective layer in between the two discs. For the same reason, DVD media is much more sensitive to variations in the distance between the reflective layer and the laser lens in the drive. That is why labels are such a problem on DVD media while they don't create much of a problem on CDR media.

[junkmalle]

I took 6 labeled CDs (music mix) and placed them in the glove compartment of my car and left them there (and they are still there now). They have survived two winters and two summers. I placed about six more in plastic jewel cases and put them in a closet in my bedroom. The remaining 12, I just left lying about with and without protection about the house.
The results.
They ALL still play perfectly.

I've never had problems with labled CDs. I have lots of them, some nearly 10 years old, they all still work. Only labeled DVDs give me problems.