The definative solution to our sync problems...

[SCB]

Yes, I know that. Although, I haven't had this problem yet. Not creating synced output on some problematic DVDs is a far cry from having "zilch".

BTW, isn't Star Wars AOTC considered problematic? Sync is perfect using mencoder w/ffmpegX. Haven't tried svcd yet.

[illogicalprod]

===> pmcd: He was referring to his XBox with some media streaming app.
===> illogical: If you think you can get NTSC DVDs to rip in sync using the bare gnu vid tools, then by all means, go for it, and report how it goes. As for typical users, this solution will be a godsend. Why don't you stop talking smack and wow us with your fabulous solution? You can vote with your wallet later, after you spend weeks on end trying to get the @^#%$@#$ rip to sync. I would also like a terminal option, so I could modify the tags for the divx encoding, but it's not a make or break feature if the final product looks good and has a small filesize without motion estimation crapping out in sudden lighting changes and such. Here's hoping.

I bet you anything that they arent using any tools that DON'T fall under the GNU. they said themselves that the software was 'ported"... I highly doubt it is commercial.

As far as a solution goes, i dont care about Divx, but there is one 100% fool proof way to obtain in synced VCDs and SVCDs under Mac OS X and it takes only the length of the movie... It's called EyeTV. Yeah a hardware MPEG 1 encoder that outputs directly to Toast VCD.

Sure it's $200, but it's the best $200 you would ever spend i assure you.

You hook up your DVD player to it [if you have one with Macrovision disabled] start recording, play the movie.

You will end up with 29.97 fps, 352x240, and EXCELLENT in sync quality every single time. Sure this might be an ANALOG solution, but if the quality is so high to begin with and will never ever degrade, who give a snot??

[KaiCherry]

Wow. Thats funny

iilogical: don't worry about paying for anything. Good luck on the reverse as well...

I have offered several people here a chance to test the gui version, most recently DVDudeman, in fact.

He hasn't gotten back to me via PM...

And don't worry about us getting mad and not releasing this...altho' I know when bilestyle sees theis, he will be HOT.

Since I'm an adult, and am pretty much immune to schoolyard cajoling, I have to say that I am offended by the notion that a couple of you have implied about this being some hung pile of hoaxy dung.

The REASON its not out yet is be cause its COMPLICATED. It requires (wait for it) MATH.

If running the stuff thru the mjpegtoolchain was all it took, then yeah, Woo-freakin-hoo.

Oh...but whats this...You can't get The Matrix to work right? But I did! Those Japanese OAVs keep screwing up? I feel your pain.

Look, even BILESTYLE thought I was nuts until I walked him thru the many steps it took to get it right. And we both realized the same thing: If the software could do this for the user, it would be cool.

So I did it.

And now...I've come to a crossroads. I have to decide if the majority of users are like illogical, who are "well screw you pal, you are just using blah blah. I know that crap inside and out, so I'm gonna pick apart your scripts or whatever..." after I've spent hours and hours working at it..

or are they of the type that want something to work...and their time saved will be worth it.

You know, when I floated the question, I didn't expect at all for it to take this sour downturn. But thats cool, too.

Oh. There aren't any shell scripts.



-K

[KaiCherry]

"You don't get it..."

Who KNEW that would cause a firestorm

My intent was not to offend any of you, but it was moreso an indictment towards me

I guess we aren't atriculating this well enough or whatever, based on some of the questions invovled.

Also, I've been *trying* to be diplomatic and not "trash" or critique anyone else's software....not even AfroPic.

The best way I can put it its this: unlike other packages that put a GUI around commandline switches and just sends them, this software is based on two engines that actually *do something useful* to ensure that the commandline switches generated produce in sync results for a particular dvd.

Does that make any sense or help clarify anything? I hope so, as I can't think of any other way to put it. Not a marketing guy, heheh...

Anyway, back to it, if there is any hope of getting this out before Monday...

-K

[rockinsage]

Well put KaiCherry. Perhaps everyone can refrain from further hypothesizing and speculating on this app until it's actually released.

Software Development Rule # 342: If you announce it, they will trounce it.

[illogicalprod]

Kai --

You cant expect me to not get on the defense when you say things that insult my intelligence. [You just don't 'get it'??]

I appreciate your effort and everything and I even offered to pre-pay for this software for your efforts.

You have asked what features people want, and when a realistic option for me that i would like to see implemented is presented you dismiss it as an extremely bad idea without further consideration.

Don't expect me to fall at your feet like everyone else on this board because you are doing something to benefit the community. I appreciate your efforts and your time put into this and beleive that you should be compensated for it, but dont treat me like i'm a jerk because i have an unbiased opinion that you don't agree with.

[qshartle]

I have a quick question for Kai,

Does this program, for DivX, automatically set the bitrate to fit on a CD-R?
And does it use a different shell for encoding DivX?




Q

[WiseWeasel]

To sum things up, I don't think that this project is even real. It seems to full of hype, promise, and apparent success without any proof. Not a scrap, screenshot, demo, or antyhing.
Flip Flop Frog

You're not paid to think! I don't give you enough information to think! You do what I tell you!

Oh, sorry, just watched Total Recall one too many times . . .

[WiseWeasel]

You will end up with 29.97 fps, 352x240, and EXCELLENT in sync quality every single time. Sure this might be an ANALOG solution, but if the quality is so high to begin with and will never ever degrade, who give a snot??

Oh boy, 352*240, i can hardly contain myself. If I wanted crappy vcds, I'd download them. No, instead, for $200, I found a Dazzle Hollywood DV bridge, and I can capture that same signal in 720*480 DV NTSC, and then convert to whatever format I like, such as DVD. If you're happy with your EyeTV, then by all means, use that and don't give K&B any more shit. It would be a shame to have to eat all those pointy words if and when they do release something. It's a good thing more people aren't like you, or they probably wouldn't ever make it to release, from being continually pissed off by their user base.

[WiseWeasel]

Since I'm an adult, and am pretty much immune to schoolyard cajoling...
-K

Except for that one episode about a week ago, right?

Sorry, I couldn't resist. I hope you were joking about that . . .

[KaiCherry]

ROTF...Nice one WiseWeasel...

Heheh.

See, That's why I should stay away from this place, lol.

[illogicalprod]

You will end up with 29.97 fps, 352x240, and EXCELLENT in sync quality every single time. Sure this might be an ANALOG solution, but if the quality is so high to begin with and will never ever degrade, who give a snot??

Oh boy, 352*240, i can hardly contain myself. If I wanted crappy vcds, I'd download them. No, instead, for $200, I found a Dazzle Hollywood DV bridge, and I can capture that same signal in 720*480 DV NTSC, and then convert to whatever format I like, such as DVD. If you're happy with your EyeTV, then by all means, use that and don't give K&B any more shit. It would be a shame to have to eat all those pointy words if and when they do release something. It's a good thing more people aren't like you, or they probably wouldn't ever make it to release, from being continually pissed off by their user base.

I don't own EyeTV... I'm just offering it as a option for a solution... And it captures directly to MPEG-1, not to quicktime. If you use Dazzle, correct me if i am wrong, you still have to use software encoding to convert to DVD or VCD, which, for the sake of defending my example of using EyeTV as a solution, is irrelevant to my post.

AS stated before, i appreciate their efforts, but since we cant use this miracle software hands on as of yet, it's not exactly a solution is it?

I believe that they are working on "something" and this isnt a hoax...

Furthermore, IF and WHEN [as you put it] it is released and i am able to extensivly give it a go i will give credit where credit is due.

Until then we are all pondering an idea. Anyone remember the PS2 emulator for Mac OS X? http://www.macraider.com -- this has supposedly been in development for two years with a "near launch" for a year and a half. I remember a topic on a different message board set forth by the so-called 'creators' of that program/hardware and the mood was identical.

With this project as a closed beta, no screen shots, no indication of any tools used except mjpegtools, why even talk about it?

to the video game saavy: i cant help but to ALSO be reminded of the Panasonic M2.

But whatever. Power to the programmer!

[illogicalprod]

for people thos tried macraider.com you saw that it is down [imagine that]

here is an alternative link:

http://www.macevangelist.com/news/2001/1022.html

[KaiCherry]

Wow. That is *sssooooo* not cool. Hrm. Hrm.

Not at all.

-K

:onders going out to dinner, maybe a movie and hanging out for the remainder of the weekend...::

[KaiCherry]

I was not aware of that Grinch thing...I only use Richard's stuff.

But how is this related again?

iilogical. Go back to the begining of this thread and start over. From day one, it was stated that its not the tools, its they way that they have been (mis)used.

If you are laboring under the impression that it "can't work" then I do really understand why.

A lot of smart folks have had a crack at it. I appreciate that. Appreciate this:

Its doable. Its done. Its OK. And when its release worthy, even beta ish, it will be around.

But I think you are being a bit unfair here, too. Why not wait and see before lumping us in with the impossible, or just plain insane (PS2/XBOX emus? C'mon)

Thats all I ask.

-K

[bilestyle]

okay i definitely agree, comparing this to the grinch project is not cool at all.
im not going to go into a long rant because im not going to give such assinine comments the justice of having any type of well thought out response. Just keep pushin the wrong buttons, i dont think you will like where that leads.

[Macnewbie]

Don't let them get to you. Keep up the hard work.

[KaiCherry]

Don't let them get to you. Keep up the hard work.

We are smiling here...don't even worry about it.

-K

[illogicalprod]

I was not aware of that Grinch thing...I only use Richard's stuff.

But how is this related again?

iilogical. Go back to the begining of this thread and start over. From day one, it was stated that its not the tools, its they way that they have been (mis)used.

If you are laboring under the impression that it "can't work" then I do really understand why.

A lot of smart folks have had a crack at it. I appreciate that. Appreciate this:

Its doable. Its done. Its OK. And when its release worthy, even beta ish, it will be around.

But I think you are being a bit unfair here, too. Why not wait and see before lumping us in with the impossible, or just plain insane (PS2/XBOX emus? C'mon)

Thats all I ask.

-K

I dont have the impression that it CAN'T work -- because i am sure that it can. I just have the skeptical impression: If you got it, then let's see it instead of trumping around this forum expecting praise for something that you wont even release as of yet -- not even a screen shot. I believe in giving credit where credit is due... And here there are over 2,000 views to this thread, 50+ replies touting how awesome this app is, and 100% of pure nothing backing it up. And i'm not trying to be an *******.

And you are right -- It was unfair for me to classify and compare you with "The Grinch Project" for which I apologize. I was only trying to make an analogy to other "Miracle Applications" that have been on the rumor mill but never been delivered. If the macraider web site was still up, they made it sound VERY VERY believable for a PS2 emulator with a hardware add-on.

As stated several times before, i appreciate your efforts. But you cannot expect me to give you a virtual high-five like almost everyone else participating in this thread based on what you claim to be doing.

[KaiCherry]

[quote="illogicalprod"]

I dont have the impression that it CAN'T work -- because i am sure that it can. I just have the skeptical impression: If you got it, then let's see it instead of trumping around this forum expecting praise for something that you wont even release as of yet -- not even a screen shot. I believe in giving credit where credit is due... And here there are over 2,000 views to this thread, 50+ replies touting how awesome this app is, and 100% of pure nothing backing it up. And i'm not trying to be an *******.

Fair enough That will be rectified shortly. The UI is being cleaned up for distribution to a new set of testers.

You are welcome to be one of them...(its a vote process between 3 people who is chosen).

Screenshots, probably the ReadMe, some sample clips (it saves them) will be available as well. I was looking into doing one of those movies like apple does on their sight, but encoding mpeg2 video (even for the sample) is like watching paint dry.

-K

[Flip Flop Frog]

Did I not make my appology clear enough?

I'm not being in anyway hostile. Or at least not trying to.

They fact of the matter is I've been hoodwinked before on matters like this, twice actually. So needless to say I'm a bit weary.

Now why did I make any accusations at all? Because it looked like a fish, it smelt like a fish, and some how I felt as if I (and a few others) were getting hooked.

Now I'm absolutely serious about hoping I'm wrong, because lord knows I want this app just as many others.

And I'm not fussy, I don't want it in terminal, or this or that. I just want to drop a DVD in and covert it to an SVCD. That's all.

I'm not complaining, or trying to presure you into prematurely releasing an copy. I'm just challenging the validity.

If something sounds too good to be true, some times it is.

------------------------------

So yet again, if I'm wrong and I sturred up all this fuss for nothing at all, I'm sorry. I really am.



Flip

[qshartle]

Im Majoring, in Web Design at my High School.
I would be happy to make a web page for you guys.





Q

[Eug]

Hmmm... Here are my comments (as a non-programmer):

If you're gonna charge for it... Do you have experience with shareware distribution? Not that I know anything, but I'd suggest looking into it more deeply. Are you utilizing anybody else's code? Are you not afraid of the DVD companies knocking on your door?

One wonders if it might make more sense to allow usage for only non-encrypted discs or VIDEO_TS folders as someone else already suggested, to avoid all the problems with DeCSS-like code.

Would I pay $15-20 for it? Maybe, although I must admit I wouldn't use it much really. I personally am only interested in MPEG-2, and if I really wanted to back up a movie I simply would use my Panasonic DMR-E30 standalone recorder and Apex region-free/Macrovision-free/CGMS-free DVD player. ie. Real-time backup with very good results (although not as good if the source material is much longer than 90 minutes or has a lot of noise in it already). You've said the output quality would be excellent and I suspect may be better than what I get with shows over 1 hr in length, but you've also said that MPEG-2 encoding will take just about forever.

I'd love to beta test it though. (I have a 1 GHz SD TiBook.)

[illogicalprod]

okay i definitely agree, comparing this to the grinch project is not cool at all.
im not going to go into a long rant because im not going to give such assinine comments the justice of having any type of well thought out response. Just keep pushin the wrong buttons, i dont think you will like where that leads.

Bile --

I'm not trying to piss anyone off... I'm sorry i came across the wrong way.

[qshartle]

I was bored, so i threw together a test site.

Kai, or Bile

Let me know if you like it. Ill be happy to make the site for you.



http://www.angelfire.com/mac2/dvdivxer/index.html



Q

[KaiCherry]

I was bored, so i threw together a test site.

Kai, or Bile

Let me know if you like it. Ill be happy to make the site for you.



http://www.angelfire.com/mac2/dvdivxer/index.html



Q

Thanks man


look for a pm...

-K

[KaiCherry]

Hmmm... Here are my comments (as a non-programmer):

If you're gonna charge for it... Do you have experience with shareware distribution? Not that I know anything, but I'd suggest looking into it more deeply. Are you utilizing anybody else's code? Are you not afraid of the DVD companies knocking on your door?

You can pay, or not. Its cool.

I'm using my code with other people's binaries, in a way that is "legal" which is to say i haven't incorporated anyone's source. I used to work for a company that did Linux-based kiosks and a large part of my job was abstracting our stuff from GPL'ed stuff. This uses similar methodologies, sorta like Safari. You only have to release the code you changed that is GPL'd (if any) but not your own if its not GPL'd.

The one thing that is...problematic is a binary I compiled for this specific purpose. I didn't change the source; I just compiled it differently.

This piece uses CSS-like code, but its same same code that's in vlc et al.
So i dunno

One wonders if it might make more sense to allow usage for only non-encrypted discs or VIDEO_TS folders as someone else already suggested, to avoid all the problems with DeCSS-like code.

I hadn't thought about the folders, actually. Its worth investigating but would add space requirements. Hrm...would that even work?

you've said the output quality would be excellent and I suspect may be better than what I get with shows over 1 hr in length, but you've also said that MPEG-2 encoding will take just about forever.

Yeah...it does take awhile...

I'd love to beta test it though. (I have a 1 GHz SD TiBook.)

I'll let you know

-K

[qshartle]

I just added a few touches to the test site(had nothing better to do)

Hope you like the pics!


http://www.angelfire.com/mac2/dvdivxer/index.html






Q

[MacDSL]

Kai-Bilestyle You two are trying to do a great service....

No matter what they say, no matter what they do, no matter how it turns out. I have enjoyed your advice, I have learned from it, and I appreciate it.

Make it what you two think it should be. Please, Please don't let anyone 'committee' you into adding ANYTHING to your program. You two are creating this, you two make it what you need/think it should be and do.

You both have answered ALL the questions that NEED to be answered. Please take the time you need/want to finish this; finish your project and crack a Guinness when it's finished. I would appreciate seeing it when it's completed, I will send a little scratch your way if it works, if it does not, then I will still appreciate the effort and politely request changes.

Geez, leave Kai-Billestyle alone to finish their adventure. Quit sidetracking them, and if it does not work, It does'nt; end of story. None of you here will lose anything by waiting...

If this does not work of you, none of you here will still loose anything.

Best of luck boys, and I'll be trying it no matter what.
If they want something different, let them program it.

If i can help with a Mirror or something, I have an old G3 Powermac running on a spare T-1 by itself at work that I can put your program on for distribution if you need...

[elreeko]

Just wanted to say that Kai and Bile rock!

I have been creating synched SVCDs on ffmpeg for some time with only the occassional synch problem. But I still have been forced to use OSex first. It will be great to finally have an app that will do it all for you without having to worry about wether or not you set something correctly.

Keep up the good work! :