Pls help, capture probs with GF4 WDM VIVO capture.

[Moogle]

OK, here is the problem, then I'll try and fill in as much releveant info as I can think of.
Capturing in anything other then 320x240 leaves the picture either distrorted (looks like it was trying to cap at 320x240 then stretching it, a straight diagonal line would be made of alternating big rectangles and small rectangles) or VERY interlaced (when something moves- only every other line is updated, then after that the rest of the lines are updated).

OK, now for the data.
Using MPEG4 codec (just for testing, but it happens in all codecs or uncompressed).
Gainward GeForce4 TI4600 w/VIVO (using the video in port).
Video source (Cartoon Network off of satalite dish (easiest to see interlaced and distortion).
WDM drivers- 1.22 off of nvidia's web page.
Capture progs- Flaycap and AVI-IO trial.
CPU- AMD XP 1600+
HDD- WD 100GB at ATA100
512 MB RAM

I have tried 320x240 (comes out clean without interlace or blockiness), 352x288 (what I would like to cap at for VCD's, comes out with ugly blockiness, not as noticble on real scenes but distracting on cartoons, and also interlaces), and 720x480 (interlaces BAD, but the resolution reduces the blocky problem, also, I have to choose codec carefully or it drops frames.)

Please, any help on this would be appriciated. I tried looking for someone else with this problem, but I haven't found anything yet. I REALLY need to get rid of the interlacing, the blockiness can be fixed with a higher resolution, but if you can fix the blockiness also, then it would be even better cause I could cap at 352x288.

[Moogle]

OK, to try and help show the problem, I have some pictures:

First is the interlacing prob:


Notice how the rocket trails and clouds have those areas that are like interlaced afterimages? That's not good.



OK, see how the lines eyes, mouth and face are all wobbily, well they aren't really, that is just the way that it captured it, this is what I meant about blocky.



OK, this was capped at 320x240, see how you can't tell motion cause there aren't any interlaced lines, that's good. Also the lines are properly even, not blocky. The only problem here is that it is 320x240.

Any help would be nice, thanks.

[Moogle]

I guess this is a hard one.

Is the problem:

1) The problem is too easy, everyone already knows and the question is so easy he should already have thought of it?

2) The question is too hard, everyone has been having this problem, and they have discussed it at length without a solution, but the thread is somewhere else and you have misplaced the link?

3) The problm is too rare, no one else has this video card and no one else is having this problem, so no one can give insight on it?

4) I haven't stated the problem corectly, so everyone is waiting to see if someone else knows what I'm talking about?


If you can't help me with the original problem, then try and give me a clue as to why you can't help me. I would like to help you help me.

[Moogle]

OK, I have changed my searches from looking for geforce issues to looking for interlaced issues.
And pretty much what I found is confusing.
People either de-interlace, or are really against de-interlacing. Some de-interlacing causes more problems then it solves. Some say that some re-encoding formats, like MPEG2, use interlacing so that the finished output looks better on TV if you leave it interlaced. Does interlaced mpeg2 still looked interlaced when shown on your computer? My settop doesn't play svcd I think, so I would be playing them on the PC. Are all NTSC tv's interlaced? If all MPEG1 is deinterlaced, then do the people who are usually against de-interlacing never use mpeg1? Some people talk about "capturing both fields" by setting it to 352x480. My WDM drivers don't have the option of setting it 352xanything other the 240. I can use AVIIO to set it to 352x480, and all that does is set 120 black lines above and below my capture. Could anyone make more sense of this?

When attempting to de-interlace, would it be better to capture at normal size, capture larger and try to de-interlace and reduce size at the same time, try to de-interlace THEN reduce size, or perhaps capture at the lower setting wich doesn't interlace, then enlarge it when I reencode?

What TMPGEnc filters will help the de-interlace filter look better? Sharpen? maybe one of the others?

My old GF1 DDR used to be able to capture in any resolution I wanted without interlacing, or you could choose interlacing if you wanted it. Why are the new capture chips or drivers so ridgid in their resolution settings? Why are there almost NO settings on the drivers. You can select from about 5 PRESET resolutions and they give you a drop down box for method or something that has only ONE option in it. Am I missing software or hidden registry options that would let me set the resolutions, interlacing and capture method for the capture driver. I'm not refering to the capture program, it can only process the info the the WDM driver gives it. I need to be able to adjust the info that the WDM driver passes or that the chip is picking up.

With the number of replies I've gotten from this, I feel I should start my post with "Dear Diary." I'm sure other people are reading this, could the next person to read this just make a little post under it, even if you don't know the answer, just to let me know someone else is out there.

[Moogle]

OK, no help for me here.
I fixed it, kinda... the whole point to this post is to pass on what I finally learned so that if anyone else finds this thread while searching for their problem, it might help them.
Keywords are: 352x240 352x288 blocky stretch capture GF4

I kept trying different video capture programs suggested in the How To section until I tried VirtualDub. It's custom capture system works differently from aviio's. AVI-IO adds blank areas to the top and bottom, while VirtualDub stretches the image. Eventually I'll look into the whole "both fields" but for now I'm just doing normal VCD's and there doesn't seem to be any point to it (maybe I'm wrong, I havn't read up on that part). The reason my old capture was blocky was that my driver only captured at 352x288, which is PAL and I was capturing a NTSC signal. normally it wouldn't show up as much but on cartoons, it was obvious (see above screen caps). Well, when I told AVI-IO I wanted 352x240, it disn't really do a good job, but virtual dub did. I think it put my resolution pretty low then blew it up or somehow tricked my driver, but either way, it showed up good. It also captured it low enough not to have interlacing. I batch reencoded it with TMPGEnc, and once it is done, I'm going to join them (it was an hour long cap) then burn it to VCD, I expect it will go as planned.

[ChrisX]

I have a similar video card, "LeadTek WinFast A250 MyVIVO". I am having the same problem as you experiencing interlacing on captured videos.

The interlacing distortion normally occurs on large captured videos, above 320x240 or 352x288 depending on the codec used.

My video card has a capture program, “WinFast PVR”. This one got automatic de-interlacing available and no problem using MPEG2 on a size 640x480.

My problem with interlacing is confined with VirtualDub using DivX, Microsoft’s MPEG4 and there is no way I can avoid it. I can de-interlace the captured video using Virtual Dub’s video processing.

I recommend using the Smart Deinterlacer Filter fixing the annoying distortion on captured videos. A de-interlaced video may not be perfect and seems to be much better than the original interlaced captured video.

Did you try this web site on interlacing Info, questions and answers: http://www.100fps.com?

This one will help you on areas that are and aren’t interlaced and advice on whether to de-interlace or not. On TV, a lot is interlaced due to the nature of television processing of images. However, not everything is interlaced. Sometimes to de-interlace may make things much worse for reasons as obvious, unnecessary.

Info on unnecessary de-interlacing: http://www.100fps.com/video_resolution_vs_fluidity.htm

If you are creating SVCD you can leave the video interlaced, as it is supported with SVCD. If you are making VCD you need to de-interlace the video, with software such as VirtualDub.

It depends how the processing will come out and you have to experiment on what is best.

Check out this info: http://www.lukesvideo.com.

I know this a complex issue there with video processing as I am learning too. I can't capture everything the way I wanted, especially huffyuv. With this codec I am restricted to size 352x288.