Help w/ SVCD for WinDVD AND APEX player

[bchays]

I am trying to create an SVCD which will play correctly with WinDVD on the computer AND that will play correctly in my Apex player.

I was using Nero, and the disc would play fine with WinDVD, and played ok on my Apex, but I could not fast-forward or rewind.

I found VCDHELP for VCDImage, and started making my SVCD that way, then burning the bin with CDRWin. Those SVCD would play and fast-forward and rewind in my Apex, but would not play with WinDVD.

I found out this was due to WinDVD wanting a SEGMENT dir on the cd.

I then tried using VCDImagerEasy, which has the option of adding the SEGMENT dir. The SVCD played with WinDVD, and played and fast-forward/rewind with my Apex, but the Apex thinks it is a VCD 1.1, and does not allow time search. I found out this was due to no pbc info on the disk, so I checked that option in VCDImagerEasy.

After that, Apex sees it as a SVCD, and can time search, and fast-forward/rewind, but now it does not see the track or time information.

I am using CDRWin 3.8d to burn the bin/cue
I am using vcdhelper with vcdimage 0.6
I am using vcdimageeasy with vcdimage 0.7.9

Does anyone know of a simple program that will make an SVCD with the proper pbc for my apex that will also include the segmet dir for windvd. I only need to be able to have multiple mpg files, but do not need menus or chapters, etc.

[hvr]

if your player doesn't not work with vcdimager's SVCD's then it's mainly a problem with it's firmware not being compliant...

if I-Author generated SVCD's work better than vcdimagers' then your player conforms to the chinese SVCD spec...

should you happen to find a tool which does all right, please let me now, so I can add that functionality to vcdimager...

[next]

Have you tried the scandata.dat trick for Nero burns? It works on my Apex 703 and 660 for ff and rr with (x)SVCD's.

Include a scandata.dat file in the ext folder that contains the line:

SCAN_VCD

that's 'vcd' not 'svcd' even though its an SVCD you're burning.

I've heard of some just putting in an empty scandata.dat file but I've never tried it.

edit -

The SCAN_VCD is in caps in my scandata.dat file. I don't know if this matters but my original post did not have it in caps.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: next on 2001-08-22 12:21:28 ]</font>

[bchays]

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Quote:</font><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE>
On 2001-08-22 11:39:57, hvr wrote:
if your player doesn't not work with vcdimager's SVCD's then it's mainly a problem with it's firmware not being compliant...
</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR></TABLE>

It appears that if I use VCDImager GUI version 0.6 as a front-end for GNU VCDImager 0.6.2rc2, then I get an SVCD that plays perfectly on my Apex 703. The player see's it as an SVCD, I can ff/rewind, I can time serach, and it shows correct track and time info. The only thing it doesn't do, is put a SEGMENT dir, so that the disc will play with WinDVD.

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Quote:</font><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE>
if I-Author generated SVCD's work better than vcdimagers' then your player conforms to the chinese SVCD spec...
</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR></TABLE>
Haven't tried I-Author yet, but I'll give that a try.

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Quote:</font><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE>
should you happen to find a tool which does all right, please let me now, so I can add that functionality to vcdimager...
</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR></TABLE>
Like I said above, it appears that vcdimager works ok, but that the two GUI's I've tried tell vcdimager to do different things, but I don't understand vcdimager enough to know what the difference is. I even used vcdxrip to create an xml file from the bin that vcdimager gui made, and it appears the same as an xml created from a bin made with vcdimagereasy 0.9.6 and gnu vcdimager 0.7.9.

If you would be willing to try these combinations of programs, and be able to compare exactly what they are passing to gnu vcdimager to see why the resulting bins are different, I would be very grateful.

[bchays]

Looks like I have narrowed done the problem a bit, although I still don't know what it is.

If I use VCDImager Easy 0.9.6 with GNU VCDImager 0.7.9, and select use PBC and leave created SEGMENT dir checked, and ONLY use one mpg file, then I will get an SVCD that will play on my pc with WinDVD, and will play in my Apex 703 while showing correct time, and allowing time search, ff, and rewind.

If I select more than one mpg file, thus creating more than one track, then I loose the time info on my apex. Specifically, I created an SVCD with three mpg files. I then put the cd in my apex. When it recognizes the cd, it shows total 3 (tracks) but has no time info (all three = 25min). When I hit play, it starts counting from 1 sec, but doesn't show the track number. If I skip to track 2, it will count again from 1 sec, but doesn't show track 2. Also, if I select time rem, it will not show anything.

All of this works correctly when using only one mpg file.

To test, I also created an SVCD using VCDImager GUI 0.6 and GNU VCDIMager 0.6.2rc2 with more than one mpg. It did give me total time of the cd, but it was way off. It should have been about 12min, said 55.

So it looks like my player doesn't handle multiple mpg files and time correctly. I will do a test with nero later to make sure it is my player that is screwing up.

If you have any ideas, I'd love to hear them.

[bchays]

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Quote:</font><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE>
On 2001-08-22 12:06:03, next wrote:
Have you tried the scandata.dat trick for Nero burns? It works on my Apex 703 and 660 for ff and rr with (x)SVCD's.

Include a scandata.dat file in the ext folder that contains the line:

SCAN_VCD

that's 'vcd' not 'svcd' even though its an SVCD you're burning.

I've heard of some just putting in an empty scandata.dat file but I've never tried it.

edit -

The SCAN_VCD is in caps in my scandata.dat file. I don't know if this matters but my original post did not have it in caps.

<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: next on 2001-08-22 12:21:28 ]</font>
</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR></TABLE>

Although I know about this tip, I haven't tried it because even if it does work for ff/rew, it still does not support time serach, ie goto a specific point in the movie. That is actually more impt for my viewing.

Thanks for the help anyway.

[hvr]

<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Quote:</font><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><BLOCKQUOTE>
Looks like I have narrowed done the problem a bit, although I still don't know what it is.
[...]
So it looks like my player doesn't handle multiple mpg files and time correctly. I will do a test with nero later to make sure it is my player that is screwing up.

If you have any ideas, I'd love to hear them.
</BLOCKQUOTE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR></TABLE>

that's exactly the behaviour I expected...

the reason is that, the tracks.svd of the chinese svcd spec and the philips svcd spec are only compatible if you have only one sequence item (track) on your SVCD... as soon as you add more, the format differences will show up...

I've already added a new option for the upcoming vcdimager 0.7.10 release (it will show up in 0.7.10pre3 ... if you want to test it, just let me know by email, and I'll give you instruction on how to do it...)
the option is named

<option name="svcd vcd30 tracksvd" value="true" />

regards

[hvr]

btw, here is some further example for the records;

tracks.svd with the svcd vcd30 tracksvd option enabled
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Code:</font><HR ></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><PRE>
SVCD/TRACKS.SVD
ID: `TRACKSVD'
version: 0x01
tracks: 3
track[00]: 00:59:67, audio: 2 streams, video: no stream, OGT stream: None
track[01]: 05:02:01, audio: 2 streams, video: no stream, OGT stream: None
track[02]: 59:54:55, audio: 1 stream, video: reserved (0x6), OGT stream: None

(VCD3.0 interpretation)
(track[00]: 00:59:67 (cumulated), audio: 02, ogt: 05)
(track[01]: 01:59:54 (cumulated), audio: 22, ogt: 55)
(track[02]: 02:39:28 (cumulated), audio: 02, ogt: 00)
</PRE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR></TABLE>

tracks.svd with the svcd vcd30 tracksvd option disabled
<TABLE BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER WIDTH=85%><TR><TD><font size=-1>Code:</font><HR ></TD></TR><TR><TD><FONT SIZE=-1><PRE>
SVCD/TRACKS.SVD
ID: `TRACKSVD'
version: 0x01
tracks: 3
track[00]: 00:59:67, audio: 1 stream, video: NTSC stream, OGT stream: 0 &amp; 1 available
track[01]: 00:59:61, audio: 2 streams, video: PAL stream, OGT stream: all available
track[02]: 00:39:48, audio: 1 stream, video: NTSC stream, OGT stream: None

(VCD3.0 interpretation)
(track[00]: 00:59:67 (cumulated), audio: 59, ogt: 00)
(track[01]: 61:00:39 (cumulated), audio: 8d, ogt: 4
(track[02]: de:0d:00 (cumulated), audio: 00, ogt: 00)
</PRE></FONT></TD></TR><TR><TD><HR size=1 color=black></TD></TR></TABLE>
so, if your apex player sees this file as shown under the 'VCD3.0 interpretation' heading, it is confronted with some quite confusing values...