One-machine-only DVD+RW

[tobenfun]

Can no one shed any light for me? I'm still having difficulties here:
I can burn what appears to be a successful copy a short movie onto DVD+RW. And the result plays back perfectly on the burner drive.
But on any other drive, PC or stand alone, the disk is not even recognised ("no disk", "please insert disk"). I've tried burning with DVD Complete and with Nero. The result is the same. Looking at the disk in Explorer (in the DVD burner) the files seem to be there and correct. So why won't ANYTHING except the drive that burned it recognise the disk?

[rhegedus]

How exactly did you burn the file?

Did you copy it straight onto the disk or did you author it? http://www.vcdhelp.com/author

Is your stand alone DVD player DVD+RW compatable? http://www.vcdhelp.com/dvdplayers

Rob

[tobenfun]

The first burn was from DVD Complete (which is wizzard-based and does it all for you) and then I used Nero and did indeed author it correctly.

My standalone machine is a Panasonic DVD-RV32 which definately should play DVD+RW and DVD+R.
The four computers which didn't like it are two DELL Inspirons with WinDVD under Win2K, an Evesham with PowerDVD under WinXP and a Dell Dimension under Win98SE. None of the above even recognised that there was a disk in their drives at all, never mind actually playing it.

So I just tried a DVD+R. This time the result is the same, except that it also plays fine on the Inspirons. But it is still not recognised at all by the stand alone Panasonic or the other two PCs.

What the hell is going on here??!!

[snowmoon]

http://www.vcdhelp.com/dvdplayers.php?DVDname=panasonic+rv32&DVDselect=&Submit=Search&Search=Search

I assume you have not read ALL the comments.

[tobenfun]

Yes, I've looked through all the comments. And yes, I still believe that the machine should play DVD+R and DVD+RW. Especially as half the comments complain about playing SVCD, which I have never had any trouble with. So different users, different ideas ....
But even if it didn't support the disks, what about the PCs running WinDVD and PowerDVD that also won't play them?

[snowmoon]

DVD+R is not supported by the DVD standards forum!

It works because manufactures have found another way to make disks that SHOULD be compatible.

[tobenfun]

This is an arguement I'm not going to let myself get drawn into. I dare say that DVD-R and -RW are not supported by the DVD+RW Alliance, an organisation equally represented, it seems to me, on the pages of this site. Neither system is flawless.

I have a technical problem which I am sure has an answer somewhere. Someone else has suggested I try looking into Compatibility Bitsettings. If anyone else can help me constructively I would be grateful to hear from them.

[meechieervin]

did you try another burning program? i had the same problem with nero,i would try record now max ever since i used that program i can watch my back-up dvds on my player

[ember]

Let's face it, DVD writing is a failure- the standarsd are lax at the moment. good people are wasting hundreds of dollars/pounds on incompatible/competing systems. Lousy con trick.

[tobenfun]

I fear you may have a good point there, but I ain't gonna go down without a fight! If the media wasn't so damned expensive I could do a lot more trial and error. Let's face it, that's how many of us tweaked our VCD and SVCD burning isn't it? Burning and chucking CDRs like they were going out of style!
Nah, I do agree that it's early days for DVD-authoring, but it's also an immensly complicated process and one check-box wrongly ticked or bitrate wrongly set and the disks won't play. But conversly, get those check-box and bitrate settings right and the result is success.
So please, keep throwing those ideas at me.

Here's a problem re-cap in brief:
Ricoh MP5125A-DP connected via firewire to DELL Inspiron laptop running Win2K. Authoring software DVD Complete. Burning software DVD Complete and Nero. Tried three times to create DVD+RW. Each time the disk burns successfully and plays back (as a DVD through WinDVD) perfectly on the Ricoh drive, but that is all. It is not recognised at all on any other of three test PCs at my disposal or on my standalone Panasonic DVD-RV32 (which does support DVD+RW and DVD+R). Tried burning a DVD+R. Result is identical except that this disk also plays back on the DELL DVD drive as well, but also not in the other 2 PCs or the Panasonic.
Playback on standalone machines is the goal here.

HELP!!!!????

[vitualis]

I dare say that DVD-R and -RW are not supported by the DVD+RW Alliance, an organisation equally represented, it seems to me, on the pages of this site.

Just to stop a misrepresentation.

The DVD Alliance (i.e., the + supporters) is not comparable to the DVD Forum. It has much fewer members, and critically, it doesn't control the licensing rights to DVD.

Ultimately, the "buck stops" with the DVD Forum when it comes to DVD technologies and licensing.

Mind you, many/most members of the DVD Alliance are also members of the DVD Forum so the manufacturers are playing both sides...

As to your problem, the fact that your authored discs play properly on your DVD+RW drive but not on other drives (PC and stand-alone) would suggest to me that it is a media compatibility issue... That is, those drives simply can't read your media. BTW, no stand-alone DVD player (except for the DVD+RW stand-alone video recorders) is manufactured to be DVD+R/W media compatible. As such, it can be a bit hit and miss. Have you tried a different brand of media?

Regards.

[bugster]

tobenfun:

you say you have read the comments in the DVD players list. I have just had a look and only 3 of quite a few (didn't count) mention any succes with DVD+R(W) media and one mentions

For using DVD+RW you need to use the bitset utility found at http://www.dvdplusrw.org/resources/bitsettings.html.

have you actually tried this or the same media brands mentioned by the reviwers?

[tobenfun]

Yes. I tried the bitset utility on my +RW disk. When I then put the disk into my standalone machine it produced a pink screen and actually 'hung' the DVD player! So not much success there!
And besides this, all that I can read tells me that +R is already DVD-ROM set anyway and doesn't need bitsetting, so why doesn't my +R disk play either?

I guess I have no choice but to fork out for two or three different makes of DVD+R from different manufacturers (my ultimate goal is to produce +R not +RW) and pray that it is simply a media issue (the +RW and +R that I have so far burned were Ricoh's own disks that came with the burner, so perhaps there is some bias going on there).
Can anyone recommend a make of +R media they have found to be more reliable than others?

[rhegedus]

OK let's settle it!

Take the DVD that you have made and plays on your machines, but not your Panasonic DVD-RV32, down to your local electrical retailer. I presume as you have an Evesham machine that you are from the UK, so try your local John Lewis (staff are eager to help), Dixons (so, so) or as a last resort Comet/Curry's (staff are so disinterested they could work as dummies instead) and just put the DVD into all the DVD players on display (connected to a TV of course....) and see if they play. If they do then you know it is not a disk issue (meaning that you've made it properly) - if they don't, take the model numbers of the players you tried it in and just check if they are DVD+RW compatible.

But like Virtualis pointed out, it may just be a media issue here.

Good luck,

Rob

[midwestarts]

Seems like more and more manufactures are releasing + drives. Even the - manufactures are slowly releasing more + drives or combo +&- drives. Most standalone recorders are moving the + format. In the end a combination of the two will win out. Both have about the same compatibility. The only people who are going to loose are the RAM guys.

[tobenfun]

A great piece of clear thinking from Rhegedus. Thanks for that, and I'll be off to John Lewis this afternoon (nice detective work, too, by the way!).

But you do still say
<Take the DVD that you have made and plays on your
<machines, but not your Panasonic DVD-RV32
The point is that it still won't play on the DELL Dimension or the Evesham and I thought that PC players were supposed to be 'everything-compatible'.

However, thanks again for the suggestion and here's hoping to God it's just the Ricoh media. By the way, I've alyways been TDK loyal since my first tape cassettes all those years ago, but as far as DVDs go they seem to produce only DVD-, not DVD+. Is that correct?

[vitualis]

The point is that it still won't play on the DELL Dimension or the Evesham and I thought that PC players were supposed to be 'everything-compatible'.

No. PC DVD-ROM drives suffer from the same compatibility problems as stand-alone DVD players when it comes to DVD-/+R/W media.

Regards.

[tobenfun]

Thanks. I didn't know that.
Jeez, I think it would have been easier to have taken up brain surgery than DVD authoring!

[tobenfun]

OK, so Monday is upon us and I'm of to buy a few different makes of media to try and get a good burn. My question is this: Is the behaviour or +RW so different from that of +R that I should buy +R media to test on (which has to be chucked afterwards if it doesn't work), or can I test using +RW, which at least can be re-used later for something else. Remember my end-goal here is to create +Rs to distribute for maximum possible stand-alone compatibility.
Thanks.

[Peka]

OK, everyone go over to the DVD Alliance website http://www.dvdplusrw.org and look for the link about bitsettings. The DVD+R(W) spec is exactly the same as the DVD-Video spec for a dual layered disc, so in theory all players are capable of playing back a +R(W) disc. However, there is a bitsetting written to the disc to identify the type of media. 1st and 2nd generation DVD+R(W) burners had different defaults - some set the bitsetting for a DVD-Video disc and others a DVD+R(W) disc. There are some utils to change the defaults, I remember seeing some Ricoh drives mentioned there too.

So far, DVD+R's made in my new Sony DRU500A have worked in 100% of players (PC and Home), so I'm thinking that it must default the bitsetting to DVD-Video.

[vitualis]

OK, everyone go over to the DVD Alliance website http://www.dvdplusrw.org and look for the link about bitsettings. The DVD+R(W) spec is exactly the same as the DVD-Video spec for a dual layered disc, so in theory all players are capable of playing back a +R(W) disc.

Sure follow the link to see if that helps. However, the above assertion is hype and has been shown many times over. DVD+R/W does not have better compatibility than the comparable DVD-R/W. It is as good or worse.

And it definitely does not have as good compatibility as a plain pressed disc.

@ tobenfun: you may eventually want to use DVD+R media on your drive. It generally has better compatibility than DVD+RW and is cheaper as well.

Regards.

[Peka]

Yep, I agree that +R(W) compatibility is comparable to -R(W) at the moment. My point was just that in theory [always in theory ] all players should be able to play it, and also that the main issue with the compatibility seems to be the bitsetting. Of course, that is assuming that the media is good.....

Anyway, that's why I bought the Sony DRU500 - it does both the + and - formats, so I should be able to make DVD's for everyone

Oh, I have also found that +RW is not as compatible as +R.....

[tobenfun]

I'm glad I've sparked an interesting debate here, but let me make my own case very clear. I DO NOT WANT TO BURN DVD+RW! I want to create +R for as wide a distributiopn as possible. I only started on about +RW in the first place because I had hoped that it would be possible to do my trial-and-error burns on the same +RW disk over and over so as to save forking out for a new +R disk for each burn. But I see now that that is not possible.

OK. No prob. So the last area that still confuses me is this: Are there bitsetting issues to be tackled with DVD+R (forget about +RW for now)? Do I need to make any further adjustments to anything or should I now just try burning a few different makes of +R and see what kind of results I get?

[tobenfun]

Just a post-script to report that it was my standalone player all along.
My DVDs were all burning just fine. Only my Panasonic RV32 (which, acording to this site should play +R/RW) won't play them.

So with gratitude to you all for your help, I guess I'm of to buy a new DVD player!

Thanks again,

Alan

[vitualis]

Yes, you do have to take the compatibility list with a grain of salt.

Firstly, you don't know who the original submitter was and we can only hope that they weren't deliberately sowing misinformation.

Assuming that they are not, they may have been using a different brand of DVD+R/W media which can make a difference on some DVD players.

Regards.

[jcort]

I think its your RV32 thats the problem. I made a test +RW with hp200i,hp and memorex media,used dvdit,mydvd,dvdworkshop,nero,recordnow. dvd burned fine. RV32 doesnt display menu correctly but does play the dvd. I have to make it mode 2 for it to be read. I tried my burns in family and friends players and all played my burn fine. Im off to buy the Philips 724. I have old philips 825 that plays my +RW burn fine,menus and all. I wasted much time trying to get the menus correct on the rv32 but Im giving up and resigned it to the players problem.

[tobenfun]

Hey, jcort, you may have hit on something there.
You say "I have to make it mode 2 for it to be read". That's Greek to me! You had to make what mode 2? The RV32? How's that done?
Thanks.

[jcort]

I have a bitset utility that came with the HP 200i. I read on forums that the RV32 will read +RW only if set to mode 2 (DVD-ROM). I tried that and I was successful reading a +RW dvd in my RV32 but it has trouble displaying the menu page. It does play the video tho. I bought a philips 724 to replace the RV32. No problems with +RW so far.

[tobenfun]

Ah! I hadn't twigged that Mode 2 referred to the bitsetting.
I also tried the same thing with my Ricoh, setting a +RW to be read as a DVD-ROM. The result; I got a bright pink screen and the RV32 actually hung! I had to pull and then replace the power in order to eject the CD. I tried a second time with a new burn and got the same result.
+R is still not recognised at all.

So I'm currently trying to sell my RV32 and will get a new machine that plays everything you can throw at it. Can you recommend any players?

[RoopeT]

Not knowing anything about Panasonic DVD players, but maybe there's a firmware upgrade (either official or hacked) that makes it play DVD+RW?