Using a camcorder's 1394 output as a bridge to analog input?

[Ridgh]

Is there any posibility to use a camcorder's 1394 output as a bridge to analog input ?
I attached my Sony camcorder that have a 1394 in/out socket and an analog input to an analog VCR. put it on recording mode and played a cassete on the vcr. I could watch (and record, if I wish) the VCR's footage on my camcorder's monitor.
Trying to connect the 1394 cable to the camcorder, made it stop responding....it seems there is a conflict between the 2 cables.
Any idea how to use this mess ???
I am sure ut works somehow as I saw it some time ago, but don't know how to make it work in my case.
TIA for your help,
Ridgh
ridgh@hotmail.com

[rsuave5]

many people use there camcorders as "bridges" put the av from your vcr av out to your cam. plug the 1394 into your computer and see if that works. if not you may need to buy a card to record directly from the vcr to your comp

[banjazzer]

The Dazzle DV bridge will do this - but at a price.

[Ridgh]

Yes, I know about the price , but there are 3 problems:
1. I bought last year a Pinnacle DC30+ board. The worst thing I bought anytime. No drivers, and the WORST service I know... From then, I won't take a Pinnacle hardware even for free. I'm telling that because I got a lot of information about Dazzle service....that it sucks as well. I haven't try any of their products, but from feedback from various forums - I got this impression.
2. The bridge costs in my country about 600$, and I'm afraid to buy it overses, again because the service, even I can get it for 200$...
3. I'm using a Sony DCR-PC100E camcorder, that have the options of the DV IN/OUT via 1394 and an analog connector for analog to DV capture. I connect this connector to VCR, and put the camcorder on "rec". I can see the clip from the VCR on the camcorder monitor. BUT....at the moment I'm connecting the 1394 cable to the camcorder. it make it stops working.
It gots a signal - as I understand - from the firewire card.
I'm sure I've seen that it works - not mine of course - but have no idea how it's been done
I'll appreciate any other help please ...

[john_630]

Ridgh
I have a Canon ZR45 that I use to capture vhs to a avi file.
There is a option in the camcorder play(vcr) mode that needs to be turned on (AV->DV Out). Also don't have a tape in the camcorder.
Works great but you need lots of hd space, a 2hr vhs will make a 24GB avi file.
Hope this helps.

[The village idiot]

Last and least choice... Record the analog video onto a DV tape, then play back the DV tape into computer. Doubles your time to finish, but at least it should work.

[Ridgh]

@The village idiot,
Well, of course it works, but it's not an "elegant" solution, having in mind that there are "quality losts" from recording from cassete to cassete, and then to the firewire input...
The "wrong" part is that I really have seen it working....
Maybe I'll check at Sony's support too...

[Ridgh]

Any other ideas ???

[solarfox]

Ridgh -- What you're talking about is "pass-through conversion"... and yes, it can be done. Unfortunately, not all camcorder models can do it. The Sony DCR-TRV11 and DCR-TRV340, for example, have this capability, as does john_630's Canon ZR-45; my Sony DCR-TRV103, on the other hand, does not. (And mine behaves exactly as you describe yours doing -- plug in the IEEE1394 cable, and the analog inputs deactivate automatically.)

Unfortunately, information on your DCR-PC100E seems to be hard to find; I can only find one page through google which mentions both "DCR-PC100E" and "pass-through", on a Malaysian electronics outfit's web store, and it appears to be basically a text-only reposting of a Tom's Hardware review (which doesn't mention the capability at all) and a list of features.

(And BTW, you're right not to consider the Dazzle DVbridge. I have one, and it's one of the most bloody annoying things I've ever used. When it works -- which is about half the time -- it's great, but it's prone to all kinds of flaky behavior... including a hair-trigger "Macrovision detection" circuit that likes to arbitrarily decide that a video is "copy protected" at even the slightest loss of sync, which makes it damn near useless for digitizing my old VHS tapes.)

[yg1968]

Ridgh,

What capturing software are you using? It would help to know.

Secondly, taping to a miniDV tape is a step that obviously adds time to the process but it will not affect the quality of your capturing since what is imported from the miniDV tape is the exact same information that is on the miniDV tape. Remember that the camcorder is the capturing device and that firewire only transmits the data and wraps it into an avi file without modifications. In other words, the DV file on your harddisk should be identical to the dv on your miniDV tape.

Since the PC-101 has passthrough, I am tempted to believe that the PC-100 also has it. Rememeber to enable DV out on the menu of your camcorder and take the miniDV tape out. You can try the following freeware capturing programs to see if it works: DVIO or amcap.

Here is the link for the Sony PC-101:

http://www.sonystyle.com/home/item.jsp?hierc=9682x9129x9012&catid=&itemid=50337

[Faceman101]

Like solarfox mentioned that is what you want to do. As I know almost all American DV cams can do this pass-thru. All you need to do is take the tape out of the camera and do your setup. Use ScenalyzerLIVE to capture your DV (since I originally tried doing this with Studio DV and it did not work, later version it might).

If you are in Europe or anywhere else that uses PAL, I have heard that this method is disabled. There are devices you can buy (not expensive, under 100) to re-enable this mode.

Also if you record to your DV tape, then capture onto the computer you are not losing anything. Even if you record onto DV tape then back onto an analog there is no loss. Once the source is onto a DV median, that is it. No lose transfering to another (another DV device, tape, or computer). It just takes twice as long as someone else mentioned, which I used to do until someone told me all I have to do is take the tape out (that and don't use Studio DV).

[kitty]

FYI even though the Sony DCR-TRV-900 manual hints at passthrough it will not do it - same as your machine you connect it up and it fails. Sony won't even answer why on their help e-mail. For the price of this camerait should come with a maid to hold your hand when plugging it in.

[vcdfreak]

Did you guys select the DV-OUT option as instructed in the manual?

[vcdfreak]

Another comment is that the loss of quality will be cut to minimum if this method is used. Plus, you save time a lots of time as it goes directly to your harddisk and ready for editing and/or encoding.

[Ridgh]

Ok, for clarifing things (to me..... ) :
I'm using Premiere 6 built in capturing program for capturing from digital source (i.e. PC100E) without any problem, and the same with Video studio 6 - all that as a regular dv capture.
I have at my menu no option to select DV-Out !!! Wierd....Maybe I couldn't find it, but I tried to find it in VTR and Camera mode....no such option, or maybe I'm looking in the wrong place...
Anyway, when I take out the minicassete, and press the REC button, I get the sign of "no MiniDV Tape" on my camcorder's monitor.
I'm almost sure I'm doing something wrong, as the PC101E seems or looks similar with the PC100E.
John_630, vcdfreaky, they mentioned the DV-Out - unabble to find it...
And I'll try to find a capture program, a stand alone...
Thanx a lot for your great help
Regards, Ridgh

[Ridgh]

Upps, found on Menu: DV editing, which has an IN - Out option and works only with the 1394 cable attached.
It's on IN position and cannot be mooved.... maybe this is the problem...
Anyway, I can't change it.....

[vcdfreak]

What's the brand and model of your camcorder? It might not support the DV-out feature.

[Ridgh]

It's Sony DCR_PC100E - but it has the feature, otherwise I couldn't record from the PC....