Some tricks that I used in VHS/Hi8->DVD

[Proch]

My task was to move my old VHS and Hi8 videos to DVD... I ran into a bunch of issues but managed to solve them. Hopefully I can save someone else some time by describing my process here.

Capturing:
My hardware hookup was to use my Sony TRV50 DV camera to convert to DV. I hooked up my VCD or Hi8 cam to the DV cam via RCA and S-Video cable.
I used Windows XP Movie Maker to capture the video to DV-AVI (A 2 hour video is about 28 GB).
NOTE: Remove the DV tape from the Sony cam or else when you try to record from Movie Maker, the DV cam will also record.

Convert:
I used the latest TMPGEnc to encode to MPG2. The first few times I did this, I used a DVD+RW disk to experiment with settings and quality. I found that setting TMPGEnc for 2-pass VBR encoding gives the best loooking video. The trick is to decide what bitrate to use to maximize quality given the 4.7 GB limit. By writing down the size of the MPG(z)resulting from an AVI of x size given y bitrate, I was able to use ratios to determine what the max bitrate to use is.
Bitrate=(y*((4.7/AVISize)/(z/x)))=(y*((4.7*x)/(z*AVISize)))

Editing:
I found out that TMPGEnc and almost everything else free is bad at editing VBR. Thanks to an idea from another poster, I discovered this method:
Load the original AVI back into XP Movie Maker. Since timescale is constant through the conversion process, use Movie maker and write down on paper the start and end locations of each desired scene. Directly enter those numbers into TMPGEnc's cutter and it works great.

[cguida]

In your bitrate equations,
Bitrate=(y*((4.7/AVISize)/(z/x)))=(y*((4.7*x)/(z*AVISize)))
What do z,x and y stand for?

[Proch]

Bitrate=(y*((4.7/AVISize)/(z/x)))=(y*((4.7*x)/(z*AVISize)))

x=Size of a known AVI
z=Size of the MPG that known AVI produced
y=bitrate of that conversion

Simplified, let's call "Q" the ratio of MPG/AVI.

I'm saying that approximately:
Q1/bitrate1=Q2/bitrate2 (the ratio of quality/bitrate should be somewhat constant)

We can rearrange so that:
1/bitrate1=((Q2/bitrate2)/Q1) or
bitrate1=(Q1/(Q2/bitrate2) or
bitrate1=(Q1*bitrate2)/Q2

Q2 is our known parameters. Let's say we made a 4GB MPG out of a 24GB AVI at 4000bps. Let's also say that we have a 12GB AVI to put onto a new DVD and we want to find out the max bitrate we can use to fit it on our 4.7GB.

That gives Q1=4.7/12=.39167
Q2=4/24=.16667

bitrate1=(.39167*4000)/.16667=9400bps

Pretty nice bitrate. When I did mine last night, I calculated 5550 and used a little less to be sure (5250). I ended up with a 4.3GB file, which seemed successful enough. Better too small than too big.

[LeveL_42]

No offence but: Why not edit the AVI instead of the MP-2 file ?
In AVI each and every seperate frame is captured. In MPEG-2 you have the chance of not cutting exactly at the GOP beginning, making louzy edits...this is also why most programs dont support (good) MPEG editting.

My rule is to first edit, than encode to MPEG-2. Better quality, saves a LOT of encoding time (the bad parts you took out).

And why would we want to use Windows Movie Maker ? This program is a joke.....go get yourself something serious like Video Deluxe 1 (not 2 )

[Proch]

Good points. I actually did realize that cutting AVI was the smart way to go since it is linear and easier to do. Even though I had the space (the AVI file was 28 GB) I really wanted to find a way to accurately cut the MPG just because it simply makes more sense to work with a file that is 1/6 the size. Anyway, whether it's optimal or not, I wanted to describe a simple and accurate way to cut VBR MPG for reference in case anyone was trying to such a thing. I'm working on disc#2 and I plan on using the same method. I can't think of a reason not to unless there was a lot of unwanted material in the AVI as you mentioned.

Windows Movie Maker worked percectly for the two things that I used it for - Capturing the DV-AVI and finding my scene begin and end points. I wouldn't use it for anything else, but for those tasks it was pretty smooth.

Who makes Video Deluxe? What does it do?

[snowmoon]

Another waste is encoding raw analog footage without any NR turned on. I recommend a light NR filter through either vdub or TMGenc to reduce your bitrate signifigantly or increase your overall quality.

Light means that you can't tell it there ( look at skin tones that tend to smear if it's too high ).

[callatis]

What about moving from DV to XVCD? I am trying to get the best formula but for one year I am still using MPEG-1 352x240 29.97fps CBR 2500kbps, Layer-2 44100Hz 224kbps, 4:3 525 lines NTSC (704X480)

[PlaiBoi]

I dont have a MiniDV camera but i want to be able to capture video from my regular Sony 8mm camcorder. Does anyone recommend any good capture cards? I want to capture at good enough quality so that I can edit on my computer then record it back to my VCR onto a blank VHS tape. So then I can watch it on my TV. Has anyone ever done this? Any recommendations/tips? TIA

[zorinsmarket]

I have a 8mm/Hi8 sony camcorder, I use the Dazzle DVC II to capture the vid and then Tmpgenc to cut and encode it, then use Ulead MovieFactory to put it to DVD, everything cam out great.


Peace,
Zorin

[germaninusa]

Hi,
I like to do exactly that, save my old Hi8 tapes onto DVD. I'm a beginner and bought a Sony Vaio RX752. I'm also thinking to buy one of those new DVD-Camcorder from Hitachi (dzmv270a comes with a driver now). They claim those already record in MPEG2. I'm hoping that the software on the Vaio (Sony Movie-shaker, DVDit, Windows XP) is capable of handling those MPEG2 files and make burning easy. Does anybody have any experience with those devices?
Thanks for your help

[DolbyDork]

Here’s my argument for editing the AVI before encoding as opposed to editing the MPEG2 after:

For the most part, we want to maximize the bitrate we use to encode the MPEG2 to the fixed sized of the blank DVD. Let’s say for example, you capture your favorite Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea episode from the Sci-Fi Channel. If you simply take that 1 hour DV AVI and encode it to fit on a DVD, you wind up with a ~4.3GB mpg file. Now you cut out all the commercials and wind up with a ~3.9GB mpg file. Wouldn’t you like to have that unused space back for a higher bitrate? If you edit first, you can use the maximum bitrate to fit your movie/whatever on the DVD.

For the poster wondering what capture hardware to use, I love my Canopus ADVC-100. I use it to capture both VHS and movies from my DSS. See my post on it at: http://www.vcdhelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=107649&highlight=

-DD