Star Wars Conversions-Hit me with your best shot...

[gshelley61]

This article contains some good info about 4:1:1, 4:2:2 and 4:2:0 sampling...

http://www.chumpchange.com/parkplace/Video/DVPapers/dv-beta.htm

[vhelp]

@ tedkunich,

Any of your Winfast tweaks involve playing with register settings? I did a bit of digging an found that the Leadtek drivers have the Hscale and H delay set so that there is a LOT of original info that is outside the cards capture window. .. .. ..

No. Actually.., no reg hacks yet. Just capture preporations and filter setups
and things.. ie, crops; color; etc etc.


@ Eandtc,

Sorry, I don't fully understand the whole trueth, but if memory serves me, it
uses the DirectDraw methods or something like that. I forget. But, its suppose
to outperform VFW, though I do wonder at times. WDM preceeds VFW, until
something else better comes along

WDM apps..

If only wish virtualVCR had "segmentation" to their captures (for us w98 users)
we'd be all happy, but it doesn't. And somewhere's on another forum
(formum site I'm withholding) the developer evades responding
back w/ a reasonable or better excuse to not incorporate such a needed
feature. But, it's his app, and as such, he is entiled to not incorp that's
how the cookie crumbles. But, should I find a better app (one that incorporates
segmentation) I'll do away with virtualVCR.., but until then... Anyways.
iuVCR sucks. So, forget this app. I don't like it period! Anyways.

FYI/FWIW.., I did another capture sample, but this time w/ my DC10+ of
the same scene, and I can say, there is no Line Noise in this piece. But,
because it's limited to 640 pixels width, increasing it to 720 puts too much
blur/softness to the video. But, it was nice to see that scene clean.
.
Also, as for my Studio AV/DV endeavor. it's proven to be a pain. It will
not work. I keep getting an Pinnacle AV/DV in device manager,
even though there is absolutely NO IRQ conflicts. Irrrrrr rr.
.
My ATI-Rage Fury Pro (AGP) graphics card also died on me. Man. So many
accidents have ben happening to my setups these past few months.
I just finished finally installing an old (2 year old) PNY NVIDIA GeForce4 MX 440
card. This card refused to install too. But that was because I forgot
to remove the ATI drivers. Dahh.
Performance from this move up, only proved to be the same. No noticable
speed or anything. Too much hype in these cards these days. Really.
Anyways.

That's ben my headache thus far. Problems, problems.., nothing but problems

- vhelp
--> starwarstrilogyset.se_anh.chp21_video_ts.rar - last Star Wars sample clip 07.31.2004pm

[Biodroid]

wait until september to get these 4,5,6 episodes

one year writing the same i already capture the movie and remenber there are no specialized effects like today movies you can transcode it with a good quality...

[FulciLives]

wait until september to get these 4,5,6 episodes

The whole point is that we want the original theatrical versions of the first 3 STAR WARS films ... not the SPECIAL EDITIONS which is what the official release this September will be. In fact I heard that they may even be more "touched up" than the "old" SPECIAL EDITIONS.

one year writing the same i already capture the movie and remenber there are no specialized effects like today movies you can transcode it with a good quality...

I haven't a clue what you are going on about here?!?!?!

- John "FulciLives" Coleman

[Karyudo]

The whole point is that we want the original theatrical versions of the first 3 STAR WARS films ... not the SPECIAL EDITIONS which is what the official release this September will be.

Hear, hear!

In fact I heard that they may even be more "touched up" than the "old" SPECIAL EDITIONS.

I've done more than hear they'll be touched up -- I've seen some of the touch ups! Definitely SSE -- Super Special Edition.

[Eandtc]

What do you mean "Edition" They are the "Special Additions"

[Jason B]

Hay gshelley61,

Don't get me wrong, pal. I just have a picky eye, and spotted it instantly.
But, anybody else.., I don't think they can see them. Also, because I have
an LCD monitor, I have a technique I use, in finding artifacts in my MPEG's
or .AVI 's.
.
Otherwise, I can't see them at all.
.

-vhelp

Hehe, this is funny. I just got a LCD monitor and it's so sharp, I can see the artifcats MUCH MORE than I ever could on my old box monitor. Encoded mpegs and downloaded videos look more jagged in certain areas. Any way of hiding this?

[gshelley61]

Hay gshelley61,

Don't get me wrong, pal. I just have a picky eye, and spotted it instantly.
But, anybody else.., I don't think they can see them. Also, because I have
an LCD monitor, I have a technique I use, in finding artifacts in my MPEG's
or .AVI 's.
.
Otherwise, I can't see them at all.
.

-vhelp

Hehe, this is funny. I just got a LCD monitor and it's so sharp, I can see the artifcats MUCH MORE than I ever could on my old box monitor. Encoded mpegs and downloaded videos look more jagged in certain areas. Any way of hiding this?

Yeah... play them back on a CRT

[grimby]

Yeah, there will be a lot of little tweaks made to the dvd's. Some of these include a more TPM-looking Jabba in ANH, Luke doesn't scream on the way down anymore, Hayden Christensen as a ghost at the end of Jedi, Boba Fett's voice redubbed by Temura Morrison (Jango Fett), Ian McDiarmid as the Emperor in ESB....

---

At any rate, I was wondering if anyone would be willing to help me out. As I stated a few pages back, a lot of the discs in my Definitive Set have laser rot. If anyone would be willing to let me borrow their set for a few weeks, it would be much appreciated.

Send me a private message, or email me at zion@aptirrelevance.com.

Thanks in advance.

[mysticgohan17]

I hope the screens that I've seen of the Emperor are fake. They look terrible, but better than the originals. If he has that highly defined chin and you can't see his eyes (like in the phantom menace) I'll be happy, in the one's I've seen his chin is almost all the way up and you can see his eyes perfectly.

[Darth Paris]

I saw the same shots. I think it looks like crap.

[mysticgohan17]

I saw the same shots. I think it looks like crap.

I wan't to say it's an improvement...it is, sort of. The old one was effing terrible, but this still isn't as good. The whole deal is, even though he'll reveal himself in Episode III, he's supposed to keep most of his face hidden until Jedi

[Mythos2002]

Hi Vhelp,

I made the leap and bought a TV2000 XP Expert card. It just arrived yesterday, so I haven't had a lot of time to test with it. I will take your advice and look at VirtualVCR. Does that program tell you if you drop frames while capturing like Virtual Dub does?

The only thing I'm worried about is that it is an ASSY REV:A board, but the PCB is REV: D . What is a PCB anyway?

Thanks.

Mythos

[dphirschler]

The only thing I'm worried about is that it is an ASSY REV:A board, but the PCB is REV: D . What is a PCB anyway?

PCB = Printed Circuit Board


Darryl

[pyscrow]

I saw this thread was still going, thought it would have died a natural death once I saw they were offering the original trilogy on DVD.

[Mythos2002]

I saw this thread was still going, thought it would have died a natural death once I saw they were offering the original trilogy on DVD.

It probably would have if the upcoming DVD's also contained the Original versions, but they only include some crappy 2004 updated versions.


Hi Vhelp,

I've noticed the Winfast card is Top Field First. Is that correct?

Mythos

[Karyudo]

I saw this thread was still going, thought it would have died a natural death once I saw they were offering the original trilogy on DVD.

Well you'd be wrong, then, wouldn't you?

You miss the point: the so-called "original" trilogy that is being released actually features a number of additions and changes even from the 1997 Special Editions -- let alone from the real original trilogy of 1977, 1980, and 1983. That's the original trilogy most people goofing around in this thread are after. I'll bet 90% of us will buy the DVDs (I will, for one), but I'm gonna keep on with my LD conversions, too.

Not to mention this is kinda fun, and I've learned a lot about digital video, etc., etc. The fact that it's something not easily available elsewhere just adds to the experience.

What I don't get is all the people slaving away at various DVD ripping projects: just go buy the thing already!

[Mythos2002]

I'm not going to buy the DVD's. I hated the '97 versions and I hate the '04 versions even more. The only way I would buy them is if they also included the Original versions.

I too have learned a lot from about video editing from the experience. I still have a lot more to learn though.

Mythos

[Marco33]

I saw this thread was still going, thought it would have died a natural death once I saw they were offering the original trilogy on DVD.

Maybe he feels they are the original version, which they are not. But, if he thinks so... how many other people will buy them thinking they are.

Even after buying & watching them... I wonder if people (the average consumer) will notice.

I've talked to a couple of friend and they had no idea that even the 97 versions were not the originals.

[vhelp]

@ Mythos..

I've noticed the Winfast card is Top Field First. Is that correct?

Well, (IMO) yes or no.

The reason the dumb-found, is based off of what I found out in my trial's and
tribulations w/ my Graphics cards and other Mobo's I've ben wrestling with
these past few weeks now
.
Case in point - -

Using my ATI-Rage Fury Pro graphics card - AGP and
Using my ATI-Rage 128 16mb graphics card - PCI:

*All my captures from my Winfast (which I still have on my D: drive) were top
field.

Now, in using my PNY nVidia 32mb graphics card:

*All my captures from my Winfast (again, which I still have on my D: drive)
were now bottom field (too see them properly, I had to use SwapField)

How very strange, and this would seem to open up a can of worms in our
previous arguments w/ Capture Cards:

* Being either top field first or bottom field first, or
* The arguments about person A 's field being Top vs. Person B's being Bottomg
... even though they may have the same Capture Card

Anyone here care to briefly explain my phonomenah of woo's ??

But, I have a 2nd issue w/ my cards.
They don't behave the same at my ATI-Rage Fury Pro's card's Overlay
feature. The overlay feature doesn't seem to work properly (or at all) because
the video images look the same. - - Anyone know why ??

Tanx !!
-vhelp

[Mythos2002]

Thanks for the information Vhelp. When I was doing my captures with my GeForce4 Ti4200, which is my graphics card, I noticed they were Top Field First as well. I was worried something was wrong because I had Bottom Field First set in TMPGEnc since I didn't use the wizard and I noticed my test capture didn't IVTC properly. It still wasn't IVTC'ed properly when I switched the field to Top, but that was because I didn't reset the IVTC filter. Once I reset it, everything was fine. I still plan on trying out Virtual Dub's IVTC filter, but I was just doing a small sample test. Also, I only used the WinFast's PVR to do the capturing. I'm going to try out VirtualVCR to see how it works.

I know VirtualVCR will show you dropped frames, but will it show how many frames you drop as you are capturing like Virtual Dub and WinDV does? The reason I ask is that I would hate to waste time capturing a 1/2 hour or hour capturing only to find out afterwards that I had dropped frames. On another forum, someone complained that they had dropped frames when they used the WHQL drivers, but they didn't after they switched to the non WHQL drivers.

Marco,

You are right. There are a lot of average consumers who do not know the DVD's do not contain the Original Versions since the packaging doesn't say anything. On another forum, someone told a friend there were changes and they were unaware. However, their friend's response after hearing the changes was something like, "That is stupid. Why did they do that?". I just hate how Lucas said these are the versions he always wanted to have. I don't believe that because there are still a lot of effects mistakes that are not fixed. I've seen screen caps for the new versions and the Emporer still has the little slugs (a term used for the thick black lines that appear on the edges of his cloak due to the way they had to use composite effects to make his eyes yellow) on the edges of his hood. If you look at how they inserted him in ESB, they do not exist there. There are other examples, but I don't want to go too far off topic.

Oh Yeah. Vhelp. I noticed you mentioned previously about using Huffyuv. I was wondering if you prefer that over MJPEG. Also, have you found that 688x480 is the best resolution to capture these films in?

Thanks.

Mythos

[Eandtc]

I just wanted to say that I've spent 15 minutes with my WinTV GO card from Hauppauge that claims 4:2:2 capture (as does Sony Vegas), and all I have to say is "DAMMMMMMMMN!"

The picture is AWESOME, and for only $40 at OfficeMax. Holy Cow! Thanks for the advice, folks!

[mysticgohan17]

Even after buying & watching them... I wonder if people (the average consumer) will notice.

Anyone who watches the ROTJ DVD and doesn't know they aren't the originals are dumbasses. And should be shot.

Same with anyone who thinks the movies are new.

[Eandtc]

^^ Agreed.

Okay folks, dumb question. Now that I'm using this capture card instead of my camcorder, I need to be more specific on my settings.

With the intent to de-interlace, should I capture at 30 fps (29.97), or 24 fps (23.976), or do I capture at 30 and save at 24 with 3-2 pulldown?

BTW, I just found out that this card outputs only to 320x240. Not horrible, but should I be looking around for something hitting at least 640x480? (my camcorder captured at 720x480)

[Karyudo]

With the intent to de-interlace, should I capture at 30 fps (29.97)?

Yes. You'll just mess it up if you cap as anything else.

...this card outputs only to 320x240. Not horrible...

Yes, actually, 320x240 is horrible! Not to worry -- that can't be true. There are almost certainly better drivers or a better codec or a better cap app that you should use. I don't have any idea what card you're talking about, but I say there's no such thing as a card that can only cap 320x240.

My card will cap at greater than 720 x 480 if I so choose (I don't), by interpolating on the fly.

[Mythos2002]

Hi EandTC,

Check out this link which features the comments for your capture card. https://www.videohelp.com/capturecards.php?CaptureCardRead=9#comments Others there mention that they can capture at the NTSC resolutions of 720x480, 640x480, or the equivanlent PAL resolutions. They also mention using different drivers, etc.

I hope that helps.

Mythos

[Eandtc]

I had a feeling someone here could help me out.

Long story short, it mostly works with the WDM drivers. My AMCap program must be set on "no video compresson", because when I capture to it, I can only see the audio in Vegas.

No biggie, since I can capture in Vegas. YUY2 doesn't work at 640x480, but RGB does (and it still looks great.) I get vertical banding when I capture at 720x480, so I'll stick with 640-480. Maybe later on, I'll tweak it more, but I'm pleased as punch right now.

Now, off to try a new capture. Thanks again, guys.

[Eandtc]

Damn. 200GBs, but it looks FANTASTIC!!!. I will post some captures today or tomorrow.

Okay guys, help me out. Why am I getting these interlacing artifacts?

From my MPEG

Bottom field


Top field


From my capture (consecutive frames)


Now, according to Vegas, my capture has no field order (progressive). What should I do?

[dphirschler]

That's most definately NOT progressive. What it looks like to me is interlacing except it has been scaled. So your fields are blended somehow.


Darryl

[dphirschler]

OK, new question/comment.

I played around with aspect ratio last night. My original capture was 704x480. Up until now, I was planning on encoding (and in fact have made a few test encodes) at that same size. After getting involved in some discussion about image size and aspect ratio, I decided to check out my capture and see if I needed to pad it.

So here is what I did. I resized the frame to 640x480 for 1:1 square pixels. Then I found a frame with something round.

There are several frames with round objects, among them are:
- shots of the death star
- the floating zapper thing that Luke practices with
- planets
- round lights

I copied those frames from VirtualDub out into Photoshop and overlayed a 1:1 circle on top of it. If the circle didn't match, then I went into VirtualDub and padded the video before resizing. Then I made the comparison again.

The final result was I had to pad 20 pixels on each side until the circle was finally round. Can this be right?


Darryl