CVD - your trials and tribulations!

[Poplar]

@Shadowrunner:
Just ignore those warnings and burn it. I have seen these warnings and went ahead anyway. It ended up just fine. You need to figure out what is the maximum file size your burner can handle. After a lot of tests, I found that my burner can only handle files up to 775 MB. I know many people can burn 795 MB on one 70-min CD-R. But my ancient burner can't do it.

[SatStorm]

Rule no 1: CVD ain't for newbies
Rule no 2: Demux and remux as SVCD the mpeg 2 file with tmpgenc.
Rule no 3: Burn with nero, as SVCD non standard
If still not working, something wierd is happening with your file.....

[Nelson37]

CVD is now my preferred method. Future DVD compliance - IF you set audio to 48KHZ, which is outside the spec and makes it an xCVD, but this works in most players. My eyes cannot distinguish the slight loss in sharpness, and I can lower the bitrate more than with SVCD to fit more on a disk.

Burning - remember that SVCD is a subset of the CVD spec. I remux with bbMPEG, which is supposed to be the ONLY program which creates a correct SVCD stream. I then Image with VCDimager. Max bin/cue I can burn with NERO (without overburning) is 814 MB. Works great, synch is good, ff/rw works, all is beautiful.

[shadowrunner]

Satstorm thanx!!!
the demux remux worked like a charm.I will admit that although I have been making svcd for two years now (since twins where born) I have always been a strictly follow the guides type of guy. After seeing the improved quality of cvd I had to try it! I'm happy I did. Now I have to go back and re-capture 23 hours of dv tapes of the twins But the improved quality is worth it!

Thanx all for the help!

[baker]

For anybody who uses it.. My guide has now been updated with new pictures a few bugfixes and a BETA Q calculator. I say Beta as I have not got the figures right yet. So any input will be well appreciated.

Baker

[brucer]

Hi folks can someone give me some straight forward advice on where I should put my energies on CVD or DVD? I recently came into a DVD burner and was wondering when we say that CVD is near DVD quality would it still make sense to burn CVD to DVD? Am I sacrificing anything noticeable to get several clips onto 1 DVD or am I best to just best to encode right to DVD.

Thanks in advance

[vhelp]

brucer, and anyone else on this.

welp, here's my input or 2 cents worth.
One very good purpose of utilizing CVD as your primary encoding
of choice is becuase you will be able to fit MORE on a DVD disk vs.
if you went through WHOLE route and encoded w/ 720x480 and say, ie
6000 or 9000 bitrate. Shesh! What a waist of media!! When you could
have done the whole DVD process at much lower bitrate, and consiquentually
put MORE footage on a DVD disk.

So, why would you or anyone go the CVD route vs. a truely DVD route????
There's as good an answer as any (above)
If I had a DVD burner, I shore's HELL would not waist a good $3 bucks
per DVD disk (assuming you shop around for lowest price) just to put
ONE movie on this DVD disk! Shesh! What a waist!!

Everyone is SOO cought up in the UFORIA of DVD. They still think of
DVD as DVD quality! Just plain nonsense! They just don't get it yet!
Question: Do YOU have a studio or Hollywood video equipment??
I don' think so. So, all your capturing is SOO NOT gonna get you DVD.
NO MATTER HOW HIGH you turn up the resolution AND encode bitrate as HIGH
as well, ie, 9000 bitrate, etc.

DVD is not someone's perfect Cable/Satalite capture and encode to DVD.
They are simply encoding it too a DVD spec, via some template.

So, yes, use your energies on CVD is you can. But, I'm with
SAT on this one. CVD is NOT for newbies just comming in to the
scene here or there. ...just because they heard or even saw a good
sample CVD clip. I've always suggested that it's best to start
from the ground up - - slowly work your way up so you gain experience,
but wisdom as well. So many people want the qucky way. I know, as I
was one of them 1 1/2 hears ago here. But, after a while, when you just
don't get all the answers you're looking for, you have to go out and
SEARCH and DO for yourself!! As I've said once or twice before, pick
up some bruzes along the way. I like seeing some scars first, cause I
know then, that you've ben where I have.

About the best I could see someone utilizie the whole DVD specs in a
DVD disk is for example, when you've got a home-made vide (DV for instance)
and you want the whole 20minutes in as best quality as possible. Maybe
I could co-werse myself into straight DVD spec. encoding. Other than
that, best just use CVD or else just get burned with true DVD
spec encoding to those expensive $3 DVD disks.

That's about it!

-vhelp

[SatStorm]

Vhelp you express it better that I could!

About CVD now on DVD-R....
A standard CVD (or -X- if you count the audio) is a good alternative to burn stuff NOW to CD-Rs and then pass it to DVD-R.
The resolution AND the average bitrate of the format, can be used for DVD-R as well. You have -of course- 2 more alternatives: To set average and maximum bitrate beyond 2520kb/s! That gonna improve the quality on some cases. The true is that you don't have to go beyond that point by using this resolution. Why? Because mpeg 2 can make it perfect with this combo. Why to get higher if you don't need to? Just to say "I did it"?
Most of my encodings, are totally out of standards. I encode 352 X 576 with 2 Pass VBR with 1200min/2100average/3500 maximum which is not playable for most DVD players, but it is totaly 1/2 D1 DVD quality!
Try it if you want true 1/2 D1 quality, and set 1200 minimum (with padding!), 2500 average and 4000 maximum. That gonna create PERFECT DVD quality and still you can burn the DOUBLE in the media (DVD disc). But then you have xCVD as you have xSVCD or miniDVD...

Anyway, I start wasting much time by explaining things not related with the subject direct and it is silly.... All this time I could answer 2-3 other posts and help people than to explain the same things all the time!

[onerag9]

I've been having a problem with the CVD guide by Baker. I encoded the "Beverly Hills Cop" DVD into CVD, and then tried to import my three CVD clips into DVDit PE. It didn't work. The mouse pointer turned to an hourglass for a moment, and then back to the pointer - and my video clips still did not appear in the menu. I tried several times to no avail.
I then tried to import the clips into SpruceUp. At 18% completion, the clips stopped importing.
Does anyone have any suggestions? Also, can i set DVD2SVCD up to NOT split the CVD stream into three parts?

[baker]

Right first off are you trying to burn a video file or are you trying to put the bin/cue files into your authoring program? You must select do not create images in dvd2svcd if you lan to burn straight to dvd.

Baker

[adobeman]

Here is my two cents,

I have had very good results backing up DVDs to CVDs using TMPGenc and VCDEasy. I have not seen too many people talk about using VCDEasy to do this. If you don't turn off the compliance checks it will not let you burn since 352x480 (I'm NTSC) isn't standard. But as long as you turn of the mpeg compliance checks you can burn the files using the SVCD setting. I lucked out a few years ago when I got a Pioneer 525 stand alone. I didn't know about any of this stuff back then but the player plays just about anything I put in it. I can even use 48k audio on CVD/SVCD with no problems. Next thing to check out is DV from my camcorder to CVD.

One thing is for sure... I would be lost without this everyone elses good inputs to the board....thanks all !!

Adobeman

[sullen]

Adobeman, are you doing chapter entry points also with VCDEasy? I have a Pioneer C302D which also has played absolutely everything I have put into it including PAL SVCD and CVD with the 48k audio. The only things it won't play are MP3s (old school DVD player) and Mini-DVD. Also, I have been simply loading the SVCD template in TMPGEnc, then using the unlock.mcf, then changing the resolution to 352 from 480, and changing the audio up to 48 to do testing. Is this the best way to get to CVD standard? I haven't done a DVD rip to CVD yet, but I am planning to do AI and Dune soon. Any recommendations before I get to work are much appreciated.

[Whitespliff]

Hello,

I've tried creating some CVD clips but there are vertical lines in it.
I've tried increasing (after that decreasing) the Q factor but the lines stay.
Is this normal or am I doing something wrong.
I've tried simple resize & bicubic, same result.

I've got another question as well, I've searched the guides & posts here but I'm still not sure about something.
Is one pass VBR (with the Q thingy) only better because it's a lot faster then 4 pass?
If time isn't a problem should I use 4 pass?

Tnx

[SatStorm]

Some people believe that 1 pass is better and some believe that multipass is better. I belive that multipass VBR is better.
Also, where you saw those lines? On monitor screen or TV screen?
If you saw them on monitor, is natural. Interlace in such low bitrates gonna look like crap in monitor. Burn your file to a dvd-rw and look the result on TV. Probably, there gonna be no lines there...
Also, have in mind that CVD ain't THAT compatilble with R1 standalones

[abularkin]

this post has been retracted due to stupidity on my part

[adobeman]

sullen,

Yes I am doing entry points by pasting in raw ChapterXtractor data. But since VCDEasy didn't analyze the files it just warns you to make sure that you don't have more time defined in your chapters than is actually in the mpg file.

Here is what I have been doing.
SmartRipper

DVD2AVI -Dolby Surround Downmix left at 48k, no normalization, YUV->RGB PC Scale

TMPGEnc - Unlock and changed video to 352X480, DC Component 10 bit, Highest Quality, 2 Pass VBR 1100/1900/2100
Advanced - Source aspect 16:9, Arrange Method Full Screen (keep aspect ratio 2), and set a source range
GOP - Number of I = 1, Number of P = 4, Number of B = 2, Only detect scene change checked.
Quantize Matrix - Default, Output YUV as basic....unchecked (this seems to give me the best results along with the DVD2AVI pc scale. Everything else has been either to contrasty or not true black), Use Floating point...checked, nothing else checked
Audio 48K/224
System - MPEGII Program (VBR)

then I wait for a long time for the files to be created. this works for me but I am sure there are probably things I should be doing differently...like perhaps the GOP stuff.

Once the files are done I burn them with VCDEasy as described earlier.

I'm all ears if anyone has any comments or warnings about what I am doing. Looks and sounds great...OK not as good as DVD picture and DD5.1 sound but considering it's on CDs it is pretty impressive.

BTW, I don't try and go for 1 or 2 disks but usually need 3. Where I live there are always rebates on blank CDRs. The last 100 I bought literally cost me nothing! so I go for better quality over less disks. I now understand the appeal of a stand alone DVD changer ! I wonder if any of them play these things ? Hmmm... have to check the guide.

Good luck. Let me know how it goes.

Adobeman

[onerag9]

I followed Baker's guide to encode to CVD, then attempted to author a CVD stream as a DVD using Ulead DVD Movie Factory. When the program began building the VIDEO_TS folder, i got the error message "The number of video frames in a GOP is not valid for DVD." I also tried to author with DVDit PE and received a similar error message. Can anyone help me out with this?

[baker]

Never post more than once!!!! But make sure close all gops is closed and I don't reccomend using this guide if u r just doing dvd-dvdr.

Baker

[onerag9]

I was trying to re-encode the DVD stream so that i could fit the whole DVD on one DVD-R instead of having to split it onto 2 discs. If the guide creates DVD-compliant CVD streams, then why am i getting this error? And how do i close the GOPs?

[baker]

There is a special set of instructions for dvd2svcd to turn a dvd-dvdr they can be found on doom9 if u search.

They are great.



Baker

[onerag9]

Looked around the Doom9 site - didn't see the instructions you described. They had instructions for putting (S)VCD on DVD-R, but i didn't see anything about using DVD2SVCD to rip a DVD and keep the stream DVD-compliant in order to put it back on DVD-R. Do you have a link, perhaps?

[baker]

well you forgot to search the foroum.

Here you go lazybody..


http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?s=&threadid=28017

Might turn this to a guide myself

Baker

[onerag9]

Fuckin' A. Thanx.

[sullen]

@Adobeman

I am getting started now with Dune. I am with you on the quality issue and blank media. I have a BJ's wholesale club that has 100 CDRs for $25 with a $12 rebate.

As for the standalone disc changer issue. I have a Pioneer C302D 3-disc DVD player that plays CVD. I was looking at getting the 333 back then, but went for the floor demo C302D at Sears. At the time it was a little more money, but had the changer which won me over. I had no idea what I was going to get into with the VCD scene so I really lucked out. If only Apex would make a decent multi-disk we would all be set I think. The bad thing about some of the newer Pioneers is they don't play PAL SVCD. I got my parents one for Christmas and they can't watch some of the stuff I have given them. It isn't my fault some person in Europe only encodes good stuff to PAL. Oh well.

Will post again with the results. Later.

[Martyn1980]

How did you multiplex it, you could try multiplexing it again using different settings if you use Tmpeg then try Mpeg2 SVCD and Mpeg 2 Program stream or if you use BBmpeg then try SVCD VBR which is what i use and i usually end up with file sizes like 798mb and they work in both nero and VCD Easy.

Id recommend using BBmpeg to muultiplex but use Tmpeg if you have to and im guessing if you use SVCD then it should be ok as Mpeg 2 Programs is meant for DVD.

[Martyn1980]

how the hell did that happen, i think my e mail is messed up, i just answered a question asked ages ago, answered loads of times since, sorry guys

[ol]

Maximum bitrate beyond 2520 ?!
I just tried to make a CVD with average video bitrate of 2477 and maximum video bitrate of 4888 (5000 - 112 for audio). No problems on my Cyber Home DVD player. It was just a clip of 60 seconds.

Is this stil compatible for DVD ?
Can I expect problems with a fuly filled CD ?

[sullen]

Well, I finished the first disc of Dune with CVD. It took a while because I had to work around this problem:

http://www.vcdhelp.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=87471&highlight=73f91d04

I even bought the full version of TMPGEnc 2.56 trying to get it to work right and still had to fight to get decent cut points! I used VCDEasy to burn with chapter points. I use a 3 minute interval as opposed to the actual chapter points. BTW there has not been an answer found for the above problem yet so maybe we should start working on it. I plan to use tech support on my newly paid for program to complain and try to get Hori on the problem. I didn't have the error with 2.56 Plus, but the cuts were awful with the audio cutting out and the video just rambling on.

As for the disc itself, it looks and plays great! Not that this is on topic, but is there a way to get SVCD or CVD to perform like VCDs in my Pioneer? With VCD I can stop and resume, and also look at the time of the disc using display like on a DVD, but for SVCD and CVD this doesn't work.
Thanks. No Tribulations here!

[Trenton_Net]

I never encode in CVD because the quality hit compared to SVCD is very poor. Although you have vertical Resolution, Horizontal resolution is exchanged instead. This causes pixles to be streched horizontaly, and causes the image to be blurry (Like a VCD). Also, without any Anti-aliasing filters, horizontal lines have a strong "Stair Stepping" effect which SVCD or DVD Does not.

[Martyn1980]

Thank You Trenton, someone who has noticed the same thing as me, CVD can be too blurry and i dont know how people are saying it is sharper than SVCD, at best ot might look the same but it cant ever look sharper, CVD is better in High Motion scenes if you have a lack of bitrate, but in slow stuff its just not as detailed as im used too.

I too notice the stair stepping effect, but only when i view it on my PC i cant see it on my TV.