Will you watch the soccer world cup?

[resnullius]

come on ember england is not that bad....
brazil 10:2 england

[ember]

10:1 and we call it quits?

[Truman]

Brazil - England 1-1 (yes, another penalty shoot out)
USA - Germany 0-2 (selfexplaining)
Spain - Korea 0-1 (who knows)
Senegal - Turkey 0-3 (my neighbor is turkish)

Crazy champion chips, Korea vs. Turkey in the final.

[Kennyshin]

Brazil - England 1-1 (yes, another penalty shoot out)
USA - Germany 0-2 (selfexplaining)
Spain - Korea 0-1 (who knows)
Senegal - Turkey 0-3 (my neighbor is turkish)

Crazy champion chips, Korea vs. Turkey in the final.

Many Turkey people are saying they have shared history with Koreans and the same story in South Korea. A millennium ago, they lived in one country for a few centures. Not that I care about that historical fact but it's just too true many (east) Asians tend to sympathize with India, Arab, Turkey, Africa, and Latin America. Whether Turkey wants to be part of Europe is not that important to them.

I don't care who did what at the South Korea vs. Italy game. At least, South Koreans do not depend on the Italian market that much and Italy does not care much about South Korea for any important matter. It could have been thousands of times worse if anything got wrong at games with the US - as was well demonstrated at the Winter Olympic.

[Kennyshin]

spain versus south korea... south korea because they've fixed the game, cheating slant eyes..

Who fixed what? FIFA? The Red Devil fans? Referees? ROK government?

CNN Vote

http://asia.cnn.com/2002/WORLD/europe/06/18/italy.korea.reaction/index.html

Total: 302,310 votes
252,666 Vs. 49,644

Seems to me the Italy team didn't care much to study and prepare against the South Korean team and it was Totti that had become the most hated guy among South Koreans before the game on 18 for his words at the interview.

Things have already gone out of control here.

[MOVIEGEEK]

Lets be civil guys...
everybody knows USA will win the final.

[Craig Tucker]

How they gonna do that if they're not in it :P

[boss]

as for the world cup being fixed i think there is some truth in it. i remember hearing before the last world cup that maradonna said it was going to be fixed and that france would win. so these fixed ideas are nothing new. some of the referees seem to favour certain countries like say, brazil. but this is'nt surprising as brazil are the most famous footballing country and it would be good business for fifa if they won. also, south korea getting to the final would be an appealing prospect for fifa, because it's obvious that apart from the u.s.a. (who are also doing well, coincidence?) south korea is a country that fifa are desperate for football to take off in. at the end of the day it's all about markets and figures.

[ember]

Now I watched that second Korean goal and it looked nigh impossible to fix. It was played in from free play (not a dead ball situation i.e. free kick or penalty) and headed back into the Italian goal. The Italy defenders had free choice to 1) prevent the delivery into the box. 2) Intercept the cross 3)Keeper saving the ball.
1-3 were not carried out proficiently. That is what led to the golden goal. I think Italy had a big say in losing, so if any fixing was going on, it was by the ITALIAN players.

[boss]

actually it was the italians who were claiming it was a fix. remember the penalty, and the sending off. it could be a far reaching conspiracy! think about it, fifa will like to see countries like the u.s.a. get further into the competition for the reasons i mentioned in my last post, while the south korea goverment will be delighted at their team's progress as it will deflect attention from political issues. another conspiracy theory is born, i think!

[d4n13l]

ROTF... what is new here?
The Italians blaming everybody but themselves for losing, is not news. This is how I expected the Italians to react; they ALWAYS react like this when they lose. The Italian Book of Heroes may be the smallest book in the world, but the Italian Book of Excuses is by far the largest book in the world. Italy never fail to come up with excuses after a bad result. Watch the game, Italy score in the 18th minute, after that they tried to contain the game so they only have themselves to blame. If they sat on a 2 or 3 goal lead --which with their talent, they could have easily achieved had they put their minds to it-- I wouldn't blame them for sitting on the game... but a one goal lead? A dangerous tactic. Frankly, I would have been more surprised if Italy DIDN'T make excuses for once.

[Kennyshin]

actually it was the italians who were claiming it was a fix. remember the penalty, and the sending off. it could be a far reaching conspiracy! think about it, fifa will like to see countries like the u.s.a. get further into the competition for the reasons i mentioned in my last post, while the south korea goverment will be delighted at their team's progress as it will deflect attention from political issues. another conspiracy theory is born, i think!

Hm... not sure about FIFA but that part on the government of South Korea is as true as anything can be ever true.

However, the real ugly thing for me to watch - I'm in Seoul - is the ultra-nationalistic reaction from both sides of the globe. For now, Italy has suddenly become the most hated country for (most) South Koreans, replacing both the USA and Japan. That's another thing what will surely make the government of South Korea happy since the country depends heavily both on the US and Japan.

[boss]

ken, i'm not surprised people in korea dislike japan, but the u.s.a. as well? why? i thought the u.s.a. would have been popular over helping your country in the war, or do some people in korea see themselves as victims of the cold war,divided by america and russia's conflicting idealogies?

[Phibes]

Brazil 2 x 1 England

Hey Boss. Do you still think the referee's are helping Brazil?

Ronaldinho was the man of the game but deserved that red card.

I am from Brazil but I have to say. France deserve to win the 98 Cup. That's no doubt. They had no help from any referee in that Cup. Let's make justice.

[ember]

What a crap game. England lost to a lucky goal. Terrible play by both both sides: Brazil went negative and England couldn't capitalise after poor refereeing decision against Ronaldinho. Awful. I still expect Brazil to win the cup now.

[Phibes]

Ember, are you crazy? That was crap to England. Brazil made 2 wonderfull goals and even with 10 played very well. In defense, but very well.
Do you think that second brazilian goal was lucky. I am totally sure that was not. You don't know Ronaldinho. He is not that kindof player that kicks the ball and pray. He is one of the best of the world with the ball in his feet. Have you seen what he made with the number 3 from England at the first goal of Brazil? A little movement but a terrible consequence to England. That's an artistic goal. Not like that "robotic" goals that we are watching so often in this Cup.

Brazil was near the perfection before and after the red card. Unfortunately they had to play like England after the red card.

[ember]

Phibes- what happened to the Brazillian flair? It was non existent in the first half even with 11 men. And we can debate all day about the second goal, but the fact is, the game died in the second half becaue of poor refereeing. Brazil is the not the force you thought. But with the other big names out of the competition, they should win.

[boss]

phibes you're right. england were crap. they created no good chances and had to rely on a brazil error to score. brazil used the right tactics and defended well.as for the brazil goals the first was a classic , tearing apart the so-called best defense in the world. as for the second, it's not brazil's fault if seaman is past it at international level. The referee did england a favour sending off a brazil player, but even then england were not good enough and still could'nt dominate the game. by the end they had run out of ideas and were diving looking for free kicks and penalties.i told you sven is'nt up to it at this level. The best team won as far as i'm concerned.

[ember]

A good example of England's midfield weakness was created by the sending off. England rely on counter attack and trying to thread the ball through a 10 man defence was too much for them. I have seen England do this, perhaps the second Brazillian goal was a body blow and England lost faith. Disappointing.

[boss]

hmm.. sending offs wreck games don't they?
like totti being sent off against south korea.

[SteveDVD]

USA vs. GERMANY
0 - 1

[Truman]

Yes, the better team have lost. Yes, not Germany but Oliver Kahn have won the match. Yes, I must say, it's a pain to watch the germans. But WTF, WE ARE IN THE SEMI FINAL. (and England is flying home) 8)

[Truman]

It's football, not figure skating. The team, that scores one more goal is the winner. Yes, it's that simple. That's why I like football. (@ phibes )

[ember]

But winning by 4 clear goals is very entertaining!

[Helmut]

One thing I notice during the game (Brazil-England), was when Rivaldo was hurt. Damd, he must be very weak if he's not playing!!!!

[Kennyshin]

ken, i'm not surprised people in korea dislike japan, but the u.s.a. as well? why? i thought the u.s.a. would have been popular over helping your country in the war, or do some people in korea see themselves as victims of the cold war,divided by america and russia's conflicting idealogies?

There have been communist elements always both in Japan and South Korea and it was originally during the Japanese occupation that communists had become quite popular and powerful in the Korean Peninsula.

Also, many millions of North Koreans were killed during the war and there were many South Koreans with relatives among them. Koreans still worship ancestors and words from fathers and grandfathers matter more than law or religious belief.

Therefore, about ten percent of South Korean population tend to side with North Korea rather than the USA and their own ROK government. They can afford to do so especially because they themselves do not necessarily have to live under their glorious beloved fatherly leader of North Korean regime. North Korean influence over South Koreans is still immense and it works very well because the central political and religious ideology of North Korea is "Juche" which literally means "Own Body (all important Korean words are Chinese)" often interpreted by the West as "self-reliance" and it is popular for those who believe in nationalism and believe the reason the country is divided is because of continuing interference and presence of the West.

The power of communists and pro-North Koreans in South Korea actually grew during the 1990s because of the transition to democracy, "Sunshine" policy meaning friendly approach towards North Korea, and the downfall of communism in Europe.

Visit any major college in South Korea and you'll find hundreds of posters showing some civilians killed by some US soldiers. The Korean CIA, renamed to National Information Service to change popular image, is very weak for the time being.

[boss]

thanks for that insight ken, there's often more to history than meets the eye.
i'm from the irish republic (southern ireland). Another divided country so i am in the same boat as you. a lot of people in ireland were delighted with the result of the england game. sad but true. i think it has something to do with the inferiority complex that irish people have towards the english since the days when they ruled our country.
Do koreans have the same feelings towards the japanese? also, while many people in your country might have synmpathy towards the north what do they think of the prospect of a united korea? with regard to ireland some people say it will never happen and that there will always be trouble in the north, while some say if it did happen we would have to pay more taxes because the north is poorer than the south(although this was not always the case.). I think we might have a united ireland but it won't happen for about 20 or 30 years. what do people in south korea think? would they be reluctant about it over economic reasons, because north korea is so poor, it would take billions to bring their economy up to scratch.

And finally i remember reading somewhere that there were japanese that settled in korea. Are any of them still there?(the descendents of the british that settled in northern ireland are the people who are against uniting my country because they see themselves as british.)

[Kennyshin]

Hm...

Koreans are mostly ultra-nationalists. They are as proud of their blood as any other people. The fact that their country was completely dominated by the Japanese still hurts. It was in 1592 that Japan invaded Korea. Japan stole (?) much of the best things Korea had that time - including people, knowledge, technologies, etc. - and destroyed much of the land. China didn't want Japan to have troops on its border so sent army to help Korea and by doing that, the Ming Dynasty grew weaker and ultimately got replaced by the Manchu-born Ching Dynasty.

Literally ALL of the most admired and respected people in Korea have been those who fought against the Japanese. The one thing South Koreans envy about North Korea is that North Korea did very well to clean itself of any remaining thing that were even remotely Japanese. After 1945, basically all those who cooperated with Japan in China and Korea were killed though many of them survived.

I know some history of Ireland and Northern Ireland - my major in college was English - but it's quite different. Korea had been historically more advanced and powerful than Japan until around 1500 and Japan tried to erase Korean culture and the Korean language completely during the occupation period that ended in 1945 because they firmly believed anything that is not Japanese is basically inferior.

Traditionally, Koreans are not merchants. They are not capitalists. National unity and commune-like social harmony and conformity come first before individual prosperity and happiness. Therefore, though I estimate more than 100 billion dollars annually will need to be spent to raise North Korea to South Korea level, most South Koreans have no objection or complaint about reunification. Even in 2002, South Koreans watch more TV about lives in rural areas and history of 100, 500, and 1,500 years ago than any other thing.

I don't know if there were more than a few hundreds of Japanese in Koreas after 1945. There were some 100,000 Chinese (including Taiwanese) in South Korea but as far as I know, every Japanese moved back to Japan during 1945.

South Korea is still technically at war with North Korea and Koreans will permanently view Japan as enemy that needs only to be totally destroyed unless Korea is destroyed first and that is why I am a proponent of Greater Co-prosperity Zone in East Asia that existed during the first half of 20th century and annihilated by the USA and USSR in 1945. I don't care whether I'm a Japanese or a Korean or Martian or whatever and so I encourage everyone in Korea to marry internationally.

[resnullius]

Back to more important things (soccer) Brazil totaly deserved the win they are the better team england tried and failed misrably. Why am i so harsh with england cause if ronaldihno got a red card i saw a couple of times english players did worst and didn't even get a yellow card. How about spice boy taking a dive that deserved at least a yellow card. And that guy who put his hand in rivaldo's face, nothing...
I wonder how much England payed to get ronaldihno out? do you think they'll get a refund?

[d4n13l]

I hope Spain win.