Recommended settings to capture vhs pal without editing

[Sharc]

Yes you can actually crop however you want/need (mod2 for 4:2:2 captures) and pad back to 704x576 with black borders and encode x264 with --sar 12/11 and let the player do the rest. This is for 4:3 PAL material.

Putting it simple: The 704x576 represents the 4:3 content. It doesn't matter what the 704x576 contains: picture, borders, crud....
Make it overall 704x576 by cropping and padding and then resize to any 4:3 dimension, or just force the player to play it as 4:3.

I think you have all the options now.

[prodarek]

Very nice package of information and more complication

When I capturing I have info:

[decklink @ 0x5d7291f657c0] Found Decklink mode 720 x 576 with rate 25.00(i)
[aist#0:0/pcm_s16le @ 0x5d7291f801c0] Guessed Channel Layout: stereo
Input #0, decklink, from 'Intensity Pro':
Duration: N/A, start: 0.000000, bitrate: 167424 kb/s
Stream #0:0: Audio: pcm_s16le, 48000 Hz, 2 channels, s16, 1536 kb/s
Stream #0:1: Video: rawvideo (UYVY / 0x59565955), uyvy422(top first), 720x576, 165888 kb/s, 25 fps, 25 tbr, 1000k tbn
Stream mapping:
Stream #0:1 -> #0:0 (rawvideo (native) -> ffv1 (native))
Stream #0:0 -> #0:1 (pcm_s16le (native) -> pcm_s16le (native))
Press [q] to stop, [?] for help
Output #0, matroska, to 'test_capture-2024-02-16-05-43-716116600.mkv':
Metadata:
encoder : Lavf60.16.100
Stream #0:0: Video: ffv1 (FFV1 / 0x31564646), yuv422p(tv, top coded first (swapped)), 720x576 [SAR 16:15 DAR 4:3], q=2-31, 200 kb/s, 25 fps, 1k tbn
Metadata:
encoder : Lavc60.31.102 ffv1
Stream #0:1: Audio: pcm_s16le ([1][0][0][0] / 0x0001), 48000 Hz, stereo, s16, 1536 kb/s
Metadata:
encoder : Lavc60.31.102 pcm_s16le
frame= 123 fps= 26 q=-0.0 size= 23552kB time=00:00:04.88 bitrate=39536.5kbits/s speed=1.04x

[SAR 16:15 DAR 4:3] I should set 12:11?

[Sharc]

Nothing wrong. That's the default (generic) assumption for a 720x576 4:3 frame. If your capture has small black pillars left and right of about 8 pixels each side (your milage may vary) the true SAR of the useful active (~704x576) PAL picture is 12/11. For post processing like resizing you should be using 12/11 and crop the side pillars off. Your capture device has no eyes and cannot "see" the black side pillars and hence assumes the generic SAR of 16/15 for the 720x576 frame. But as I said the difference is ~2% only and viewers usually won't even notice the difference.
Search the forum. It's full of such discussions and explanations.

Putting it simple: Crop as you like or as needed, encode with the correct SAR (12/11 for PAL footage) and put it in an *.mp4 container. Done. Any reasonable player will play the video undistorted.

[prodarek]

I know I should do some tests and compare, but...why 1080p is recommended?

This look fine?



Which DeGrain DeNoise filter is recommended for movies and fast work? and could be use as default, I don't want to compile conversion and use multiple ones at once.

Thx for all information.

[Sharc]

I know I should do some tests and compare ....

Exactly. It all depends on your source, time you are willing to invest and personal preference. Quick and dirty solutions usually conflict with quality.

[rgr]

Thanks for the scrambled eggs in the brain hehe

Based on the last answer, this will be ok ?
https://i.imgur.com/fbtwjvo.png

Yes.
Sidenote: You assume that the source PAR (PixelAspectRatio) of your PAL capture is 16:15.
However, I am pretty sure that the PAR of your PAL capture is 12:11 rather than 16:15.

I once compared both of these values and 12:11 seemed a bit too wide to me. I'm waiting, maybe I'll find a cassette with something perfectly round and I'll compare it

Anyway, the difference is ~2% only. You can easily live with it.

And it's easy to correct without recompression.

Or as per post #6: crop to 704x576 and mask the top and bottom crud rather than just cropping vertically.

I definitely prefer a crop over a mask. There is no need to keep black margins. It just looks nicer.

[lollo]

I definitely prefer a crop over a mask. There is no need to keep black margins. It just looks nicer.

What looks nicer is to respect the right proportions and to do not introduce lossy resizing

[rgr]

I definitely prefer a crop over a mask. There is no need to keep black margins. It just looks nicer.

What looks nicer is to respect the right proportions and to do not introduce lossy resizing

Resize does not occur, you simply save in e.g. 690x560. You just have to keep an eye on the PAR. You can also reduce the height to 540px, it will scale beautifully and the image will be wider I once had such a CINERAMA mode in Thomson TV (it made 16:9 from 4:3). It was even watchable

[lollo]

Resize does not occur, you simply save in e.g. 690x560. You just have to keep an eye on the PAR.

We all know that. But not everybody specifies PAR (Pixel Aspect Ratio) in final outcome instead of DAR (Display Aspect Ratio), in particolar with old TV/Players

it will scale beautifully and the image will be wider

There is always a "scale" when watching SD material with modern hardware. The point is to limit unnecessary intermediate resizing steps in post-processing.

I once had such a CINERAMA mode in Thomson TV (it made 16:9 from 4:3). It was even watchable

It was surely unwatchable to my taste

[rgr]

it will scale beautifully and the image will be wider

There is always a "scale" when watching SD material with modern hardware. The point is to limit unnecessary intermediate resizing steps in post-processing.

There is no intermediate resizing. The TV (or other player) will have to scale, e.g. from 560px to 1080px instead of from 576px to 1080px. The effect is the same.

[lollo]

There is no intermediate resizing. The TV (or other player) will have to scale, e.g. from 560px to 1080px instead of from 576px to 1080px. The effect is the same.

it was not referred to your workflow

[prodarek]

It's cool that everyone has different opinions and methods hehe

On another topic, I am disappointed, but I noticed that in Pioneer dvr 540 and 560 "TBC" only works in passthrough mode, not for recordings ...

[rgr]

It's cool that everyone has different opinions and methods hehe

On another topic, I am disappointed, but I noticed that in Pioneer dvr 540 and 560 "TBC" only works in passthrough mode, not for recordings ...

Weird. But it's better this way than the other way.

[Bogilein]

On another topic, I am disappointed, but I noticed that in Pioneer dvr 540 and 560 "TBC" only works in passthrough mode, not for recordings ...

Weird. But it's better this way than the other way.

I don't think so, the Pioneers work internally with a picture width of 720 and the analog S-Video output with a width of 704 + black borders left and right. If so, the function of the TBC should be checked with a straight line in the picture and you should not be fooled by the black straight edges.
I can't find any test pictures of the Pio 560 to show this. But I can made a test capture with the Pio 560 if someone want to see it.

[prodarek]

If the line is looking so nice in passthrough mode, it must be doing something better... all image is also better cleaned but it's a bit unfair to compare recording vs lossless codec. Will be nice to see test pictures from you test.