People NOT wanting to use a TBC.

[VHSvideocapture]

In this video you can see the user is desperately trying to avoid using a TBC, he is using a hdmi to rca cheap converter as TBC, why can't he buy a $1000 TBC? He runs a transfer company (I am not here to promote any company)

This guy is trying his best to avoid using a TBC but the expert here wants people to use a TBC on home tapes when they are very hard to find new or old. The ones available may have faults on them because they are 20 years old, if you do manage to find one the expert will say its the wrong color, its the wrong version, this model had so many versions only I known what version is the best and I happen to have one for sale in my marketplace, because I know you want one and these are rare I'm going to overcharge you as much aa I can, the descriptions on the website are are vague like TBCish model no brand name or model number because people may find one cheaper elsewhere. Why does he not post pictures ob the website of what he is selling? Because people would never buy it.

The cypress TBC had the chips changed and that affected the quality of the TBC'S. Say's the expert.

We should try and promote budget solutions

The guy in this video is using elgato USB capture card that is one of the worst capture cards to use.
Why does he not buy something that the expert recommends over and over again like a broken record.
I'm sure this person makes good money converting gullible peoples tapes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0Cl--ij2U8

[Bwaak]

I thought you already have a working solution: a Super VHS VCR and a Panasonic DVD recorder? Why still hammering this topic?

I think his video without the composite-HDMI-composite roundtrip looks ok, and the verticals are vertical, no hooking, no noticeable jitter or dropouts, of course this depends on the tape, but that particular sample did not look that bad. The roundtrip sample has levels washed out, something is wrong in one or both of these converters.

Does everyone need a TBC? This is a personal choice. TBC works best for normal to slightly jittery tapes. It may not work for tapes in really bad condition, and it may not make much of a difference for tapes in good condition. Since you are not going to broadcast it, there is no FCC to require using a TBC from you.

But if I were him I would not show my setup... just in case.

[dellsam34]

@VHSvideocapture, No one is holding you from buying whatever you want, We just don't support non proper ways of capturing video, like composite, HDMI and the likes.

Most members here including myself suggest that anyone start from a good playback machine (S-VHS VCR, Hi8 Camcorder ...etc), little bit expensive in good working condition. Buy a stable capture device that works for the OS used and they are not that expensive, and start capturing, If problems arise there are solutions, take the remaining stubborn tapes to someone who have the gear to transfer them for you, Use a passthrough device (a DVD recorder, a video mixing console, a digital camcorder...) whatever mean that can stabilize the video, If budget allows it seek other alternatives, expensive TBC, SDI SD broadcast hardware or whatever gets the signal converted to digital in a proper rec.601 standard.

Those guys you are linking in videos are folks trying to make easy money, quality is the least of their concern.

[Cornucopia]

@VHSvideocapture,

You could learn a few things from that expert if you got off your rant horse.

The dude in the video doesn't even know what he doesn't know. Which makes me think the same of you. You thinks it's ok to do multiple resizes to alleviate some other issue and that it won't show?
Cheap, crap, cheap, crap, cheap. Yes, it produces a signal, but so does a blue screen when given too much noise, not something to brag about.

You must start over. Do not pass GO.


Scott

[lordsmurf]

The guy in this video is using elgato USB capture card that is one of the worst capture cards to use.
Why does he not buy something that the expert recommends over and over again like a broken record.
I'm sure this person makes good money converting gullible peoples tapes.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0Cl--ij2U8

Some people also eat dog food. That doesn't make them smart. In fact, it makes them dumbasses.

This post will not be a sidetracked novel that delves into the nutrition, manufacturing/safety, FDA, side effects, etc. Simply put, dog food is not good for humans for multiple reasons. And no, don't you link to some random BS about it being "safe". Read every link for at least 5 pages of Google SERPs to understand, if you're so daft to think otherwise.

In fact, this is a great example of misinformation, stupidity, and info that flies in the face of common sense.

no TBC = eating dog food. Sure, you can do it. But there are detrimental consequences.

[Cornucopia]

I don't get why people don't understand simple, straightforward physics/engineering.

Tape in motion running past a record or playback head (and its friction) ALWAYS has some amount of wow & flutter, and if that/those heads are also in motion, there is an additional amount of instability. Add to that the angled helical scan where successive frames are broken by the limit of the tape width, with the result that the signal is repetitively "lost" and then "re-acquired", adds up to a large opportunity for time-base instability.
For EVERY tape-based medium.
But, the faster the tape, and the tighter ($$) the electronics, PLL etc., the less this is an issue, so pro formats have less likelihood of being out of tolerance enough compared to consumer formats (let alone slow modes, or rerecording) to require extra assistance, yet ALL analog formats have enough where correcting the time-base will visibly improve the quality.
Actually, even digital formats exhibit it (you can see it on an RF scope), but because all digital formats include both data buffering and error detection & correction, besides being coded in a more obvious failsafe manner, they are virtually impervious to signal issues short of breakage/mangling or excessive dropouts from shed.

Much of the need for TBC depends on the tolerance of the downstream devices in handling an unstable signal. Old analog CRT tvs were pretty tolerant, VCRs less so. Digitizing, however, is not very tolerant, thus the baked-in flagging and/or the skipped/duped/dropped frames of iffy sources, when TBCs aren't incorporated.

My guess is that lots of the folks that pooh-pooh the need for one are not discerning enough just what is a great vs good vs fair vs poor vs bad signal.


Scott

[dellsam34]

The main problem of video capture nowadays is using low budget composite player that can't handle the majority of tape situations, A cheap composite VCR will lead to a lot of problems even with decent gear, let alone using chinese crap that does not adhere to any standard. If using a fully functional player built in TBC and capture out of the YC socket more than 80% of the problems are already taken care of, The remaining 20% is a stable capture device in a stable computer system using the right setting, Oddball situations can be mitigated by getting more gear to address a specific problem.

[lordsmurf]

I don't get why people don't understand simple, straightforward physics/engineering.
My guess is that lots of the folks that pooh-pooh the need for one are not discerning enough just what is a great vs good vs fair vs poor vs bad signal.

It's rarely an issue of "not understanding" -- after being told the facts -- but rather "not wanting to understand". It's just willful ignorance, or stubbornness for sport (trolling).

99% of the time the conversations are due to money. It's often not even a case of "not having" money, just being a total cheapskate. Those same people almost always splurge money on all kinds of random crap, from video games (innocent) to hookers or drugs (not so innocent). Or overpay for cell phones, Starbucks, car stereos, whatever. I always find it ironic when a Mac user whines about costs.

But spend any money on an essential tool for a task, such as video conversion? Endless bellyaching.

First-world problems.

And remember, there are budget setups that can exist, but it's heavily situational based, per-person recommendations have to be made, on where corners can be cut. You cannot follow generic/cookie-cutter advice when you start to lop of dollars, as it could overly lop off quality and functionality. Even then, it cannot always be guaranteed to work (either for all tapes, or be "almost as good as" ideal quality workflows/TBCs). But it's for certain better than nothing at all.

It reminds me of bums in gradeschool. "Can I borrow have a dollar?" ... and then the same person would spend his lunch money (both from mom and bummed) on random junk after saving up for it. Or weed in later years.

It's about priorities.

And "can't have you cake and eat it too" (convert video without proper tools, especially zero TBCs).

Set the video project aside for later, save up, don't buy crap to blow your money -- the lesson most kids should have been taught by their parents (but weren't). Hence so many stupid adults running around. And childishly arguing it.

Yes, TBCs are boring boxes. Buy it, use it, resell it. Microwaves and refrigerator are boring boxes you can't resell, and nobody ever cries about needing to buy those costly kitchen tools. TBCs are analog video conversion tools.

- Do these people seriously think any of us like buying boring tools? (NO!)
- Do these people seriously think we'd own these if not needed? (NO!)
- Do these people seriously think these items are status symbols, owned for bragging rights, like a fancy car? (NO!)