Freezing, not smooth capturing with JVC TBC and DNR on

[Marshalleq]

So playing back what you've said, essentially I think you're saying that turning TBC on, changes something in the signal that in turn is either registering frame drops in the capture software which are not visible or registering frame drops which are visible (not sure which from what you wrote). But something between the VCR and capure card. As others have said it's very unlikely to be in the VCR despite the VCR TBC seemingly causing it. I think I prefer the term 'triggering' the problem as it allows the mind to think of problems outside of the VCR.

If you have access to another computer with another capture card at a friends house or something - that would be the most useful place to start as it would isolate between the two ends of the problem. Other things you could try - different capture card, different computer, different VHS that has TBC.

The only other thing I can think of is (noting from your screenshot that you're capturing in 50fps) whether the TBC is doing something that's messing with the interlaced nature of the source and the capture card is being confused because of that. I have a JVC too, but I'm still awaiting the remote - so I have no idea about the internal details and their options yet, but it could be something to look at - I've heard some of them have a mandatory noise reduction when TBC is turned on. So maybe try capturing in 25fps interlaced or something.

[dellsam34]

But this is what I'm trying to say
When the TBC is ON- I get those FPS drops (no frame drops = 0)
When the TBC is OFF - I get NO fps drops (screen attached) - it stays like that - maybe a minor drop to 24.98 for a mil second but not below that like the TBC is on.

I have even tried 3 more standard vcrs with no tbc.
All 3 has exact 25fps.
When I turn ON the tbc on the jvc, fps drops at some points.

I understand that, those are VCRs with Line TBC, You need a frame TBC, they have different functions. Or fix your capture software setting if that's the culprit. As you may already know by now capturing video with consumer gear is a rabbit hole and you will need to learn how to deal with its problems.

[oln]

So playing back what you've said, essentially I think you're saying that turning TBC on, changes something in the signal that in turn is either registering frame drops in the capture software which are not visible or registering frame drops which are visible (not sure which from what you wrote). .

Yeah most likely the TBC in the VCR is having some effect on the frames that causes the capture card to freak out on some frames even though it's generally helping otherwise. The TBC in the JVC VCRs don't ensure a completely stable output signal unlike say a dvd-recorder or standalone TBC unit does. Especially the stuff you get on unrecorded sections on tape with the TBC active tends to cause video decoders to balk but it also can do this vertical jitter in some cases.

[Bwaak]

Yeah most likely the TBC in the VCR is having some effect on the frames that causes the capture card to freak out on some frames even though it's generally helping otherwise.

I can understand visually frozen frames, but technically they should be just frame repeats. After all, this is what TBC with frame store DOC would do - replace a whole frame. But it should still regenerate V-sync pulses, and these determine individual frames, and these are, I presume, are being counted by software. So, what gives?

[oln]

I haven't looked at what exactly it outputs and I don't know why it isn't or isn't able to output a clean signal since it presumably has at least memory for more than 1 field of data for 3D DNR but as noted it seems to end up outputting something that's not proper when there is unrecorded portions on the tape and it's also prone to this vertical jitter thing in some cases so presumably it can end up stuff that's garbled enough that a capture device that isn't great at handling unstable video signals in the first place struggles with.

[Idan1822]

Just to clarify the problem again.

With TBC *OFF* - I still get continuous 25 fps 0 frame drops.
With TBC *ON* - I get weird slow motion video. This is expressed in FPS drops (not frames) which you can see in this photo of Amarec (fps goes down to 13.73-24 for a second).

Playing the file on VLC along with "FRAPS" - a program that shows the FPS on real time.
I can see it goes down to 22fps on 00:05 seconds on the video - and go up again to 25fps on 00:08.

With TBC off I don't experience those issues.
Should I just not use the TBC if I don't see any major differences in quality?

[dellsam34]

As I suggested in post #29, Just get a DVD recorder with built in line TBC such as the Panasonic ES10 or ES15. Turn the VCR line TBC off and be done with it. We did our part, now it's up to you to apply the fixes suggested.

[Idan1822]

As I suggested in post #29, Just get a DVD recorder with built in line TBC such as the Panasonic ES10 or ES15. Turn the VCR line TBC off and be done with it. We did our part, now it's up to you to apply the fixes suggested.

Thanks
By reading this thread:

https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/403635-Panasonic-DVD-recorder-passthrough-settings...15-DMR-ES25%29

Can I connect only the S-video to S-video as a passthru?
or do I need to use S-video to scart adapter like this?
Because the thread says to use scart output on the unit

Or a cable like this should be also good

[dellsam34]

I don't think it matters if a good cable is used, just make sure the right port is selected in the menu. The trouble with SCART is that some cheap cables have unused pins and the device defaults back to composite automatically without indicating so, That's why it is suggested to use S-Video whenever possible.

[Idan1822]

I've got the Panasonic ES10 connected and JVC TBC off.
Not a single drop right now and no freeze anymore!