New Satellite Receiver: New Way To Capture

[Tom Saurus]

I have been using a Hauppauge HD PVR to record from my satellite receiver for many years now. The Receiver has a HD PVR built into it so it has a component output and that is what I have been using as input to the Hauppauge HD PVR. Well anyway I got an email today and all the receivers are going to be useless soon because they are upgrading to HEVC.

I noticed on the replacement receiver it has HDMI output and composite output. What I do now with my current receiver I set it output 720p and I am happy with the quality. I can live with composite with the 360p maximum quality. However I have read on occasion here of HDMI splitters that allow recording various device outputs.

So I would like to know what capture device I should buy and what HDMI splitter works to get past HDCP. Thank in advance for advice concerning this matter.

[Eric-jan]

Only certain spiitters will allow you to record,(avoid HDCP) also depending the HDMI version number, use a good quality (prosumer) HDMI input card, (NO USB) and use a cheap converter that has HDMI input and HDMI output,(use as passthrough device) for me this works also with a Video Assist (BMD) (SDI/HDMI) recorder.
Using a cheap HDMI capture dongle will give you no good control because most of them work as webcam, and settings depend on your capture software, some of these are very limited on MAC OS, but for window$ …i have no idea.

[Tom Saurus]

Eric-jan: Thank you for taking the time to give me some advice.

[Subtitles]

I have been using a Hauppauge HD PVR to record from my satellite receiver for many years now. The Receiver has a HD PVR built into it so it has a component output and that is what I have been using as input to the Hauppauge HD PVR. Well anyway I got an email today and all the receivers are going to be useless soon because they are upgrading to HEVC.

I noticed on the replacement receiver it has HDMI output and composite output. What I do now with my current receiver I set it output 720p and I am happy with the quality. I can live with composite with the 360p maximum quality. However I have read on occasion here of HDMI splitters that allow recording various device outputs.

So I would like to know what capture device I should buy and what HDMI splitter works to get past HDCP. Thank in advance for advice concerning this matter.

I am trying to understand your satellite setup better. Please forgive my ignorance with regards to Canadian satellite systems.
What I don't understand is since your satellite receiver has a PVR built into it, then why do you need to record to the Hauppauge HD PVR?
Is it because the recorded files are encrypted and therefore you can't copy them to your computer for example?
I had that with my Sony Bravia TV and it was very frustrating.
Perhaps knownig your satellite receiver models old and new might clarify your setup better.
My setup is a dish pointing to European satellites and a DVB-S2 4K Enigma 2 receiver and I can record channels up to 4k quality directly using the built in PVR and I can copy the recorded files to my computer if I want to through the home network.

[Tom Saurus]

subtitles: It is a Shaw Direct HDPVR 630. I have never tried extracting files off of the hard drive. I would just play the files and record via the Hauppauge HDPVR. I don't record as much as I used to because I don't have the funds to subscribe to the movie channels. Also we have trees that when the winds sway there tops it interferes with the signal. Also my Internet isn't all that fast under 10 mbps and I find the volume from On Demand is lower that it is off of recording off the channels live or off the PVR and on top of that you never know when the Internet will go down.

[Subtitles]

subtitles: It is a Shaw Direct HDPVR 630. I have never tried extracting files off of the hard drive. I would just play the files and record via the Hauppauge HDPVR. I don't record as much as I used to because I don't have the funds to subscribe to the movie channels. Also we have trees that when the winds sway there tops it interferes with the signal. Also my Internet isn't all that fast under 10 mbps and I find the volume from On Demand is lower that it is off of recording off the channels live or off the PVR and on top of that you never know when the Internet will go down.

Thanks for the clarification.
My guess is that it would not be possible to extract the files off the hard drive since the receiver is supplied by Shaw Direct and they most probably encrypt them.
This is a common practice by most providers.
I am lucky really because there are so many satellites over Europe that I can have my own receiver and dish and enjoy what we call FTA (Free to Air) TV channels or buy subscription cards from several countries to open encrypted channels.

[Tom Saurus]

I wonder if a HDMI to Component Converter would strip out HDCP and allow me to continue to use component cables to record from the satellite receiver to the Hauppauge HD PVR:

https://www.amazon.ca/Component-Converter-Adapter-Compatible-Players/dp/B09N8K7SPQ/ref...zcF9hdGY&psc=1

Perhaps I can record 360p via composite output from the satellite receiver to the Hauppauge HD PVR if I can't find the HDMI Splitter that strips out HDCP if the HDMI to component doesn't work.

Thank you in advance for any advice you can give me when it comes to this matter.

[Brad]

I would go for this one instead: https://www.amazon.ca/Portta-N3CVTRH-Component-Converter-support/dp/B00JVNUAEI/

It claims to support PS3. If that's true, it must be able to convert an HDCP'd signal, as PS3 has always-on HDCP.

Additionally, it has a resolution scaling feature so if the new satellite box only supports 1080p output, this splitter should be able to downscale to your desired 720p60.

Disclaimer: I haven't tried any adapter like this. Read reviews and purchase accordingly. Hopefully you can return it easily if it doesn't work.

[Tom Saurus]

Brad: Thank you for your post. It seems to be out of stock. I haven't checked the settings on the new Shaw Direct receivers but on my old receiver you can set it to output 720p and that is what I do because we have at least two televisions that are 720p TVs.

I am foolish at least to some I convert my 720p captures to 480p and I am satisfied with that resolution. Probably I will regret that someday when you can no longer buy smaller TVs.

[Subtitles]

Since you are satisfied with 720p resolution or less, perhaps the easiest and cheapest way would be to use a screen capture software.

[Eric-jan]

1.One does not want to convert HDMI back to analog with a consumer grade converter, if…at all.
2.Most of the time the SAT PVR storage device has it's own file system.
3. HDMI passthrough is the best way in your case, (no changes in the video data) and is easy to do with a good HDMI input (PCI) card
4. your capture over HDMI won't be better then 4K HEVC anyway, downscaling to FullHD leaves enough quality also.
5. the Portta converter is meant for gaming solutions, color levels will be "off" for analog vcr video, brightnes and color values will be boosted.

[usually_quiet]

4. your capture over HDMI won't be better then 4K HEVC anyway, downscaling to FullHD leaves enough quality also.

Subscribers must normally pay for a premium channel or sports package to receive 4K in N. America, so Tom Saurus probably won't have much, if any, 4K available to him. He will have 1080p if he only has a standard package.

[Eric-jan]

4. your capture over HDMI won't be better then 4K HEVC anyway, downscaling to FullHD leaves enough quality also.

Subscribers must normally pay for a premium channel or sports package to receive 4K in N. America, so Tom Saurus probably won't have much, if any, 4K available to him. He will have 1080p if he only has a standard package.

Downsampling from FullHD will give some artifacts like blocks or banding in the darker parts of the image.

[usually_quiet]

4. your capture over HDMI won't be better then 4K HEVC anyway, downscaling to FullHD leaves enough quality also.

Subscribers must normally pay for a premium channel or sports package to receive 4K in N. America, so Tom Saurus probably won't have much, if any, 4K available to him. He will have 1080p if he only has a standard package.

Downsampling from FullHD will give some artifacts like blocks or banding in the darker parts of the image.

If all of the channels provided by Tom Saurus's Shaw Direct satellite subscription are 1080p, how does that advice help him?

Tom Saurus doesn't even have a 4K TV. There is no good reason for him to include 4K in his package and pay extra for that 4K content.

[Cornucopia]

Also, downsampling, when done correctly with dither, does the exact opposite - covers over artifacts and smooths banding issues. Of course at the cost of reduced resolution, but that is a given when downsampling.


Scott

[Tom Saurus]

Thank you everyone for the additional advice. usually_quiet is correct I don't have a 4K TV. Shaw Direct has a streaming counterpart called Blue Curve TV whether I could somehow capture that and if they have On Demand as part of that I will have to look in to that. I suppose I can survive with 360p composite captures at least it is something as opposed to nothing.

[Tom Saurus]

I kept my old receiver hooked up until the made the total switch over where all channels went to .h265 format. So now I am recording via composite and I miss greatly the quality of the component cables.

I may buy the HDMI to component adapter and give it a try. I am considering this one:

https://www.amazon.ca/Component-Converter-Resolution-Adjustable-Extractor/dp/B08693GVF...s%2C129&sr=8-5

The Blue Curve app has been changed to Rogers Ignite. I doubt I have the skills to record from that.

[Eric-jan]

Only use a HDMI passthrough device, for a consumer HDMI source, to get rid off the HDCP, so a converter/device that has a HDMI input and a HDMI output, anything else will result in color and brightness values that are all over the place.
It's true that a component to component (YUV) connection will not have anti copy signals, HDMI in the chain will just block video because of HDCP, some HDMI China devices can be an exeption, only use cases can tell you that.(quality is not guaranteed)

[Tom Saurus]

I have been experimenting and I have been able to make some templates in Vidcoder to work with the composite video captures and the results of the encode have turned out fairly well. I don't capture as much as I used to but it is nice to have the option.

I tried out Rogers Ignite and even if I could capture it from what I watched the quality was barely better than 360p so there isn't much use in bothering.

I am glad I can at least capture a few things and maybe it is a blessing that most of the stuff they put TV to me isn't worth watching. Thank you everyone for the advice. I won't bother with the HDMI to Component device as I can make due with composite.

[Tom Saurus]

I finally figured out how to get a fairly decent picture via recording from the composite output on the Shaw Direct Receiver. But the signal is so weak now that it just is not reliable to record from. I had some luck recording from the On Demand and now for whatever reason it the VOD just doesn't want to work. We have been customers for over twenty years but we are paying nearly a hundred bucks a month and barely watching anything and what we want to watch just the least little bit of wind or rain and it goes out and poor signal quality notice comes up on the screen and will not go away until you press some the OK button.

We barely watch anything anymore and it seems to be a waste of money. I think we drop Shaw Direct and go to streaming video services and purchase DVD Box Sets. At least twenty years as a customer; but it feels foolish to keep paying and have this type of service.

[Subtitles]

I finally figured out how to get a fairly decent picture via recording from the composite output on the Shaw Direct Receiver. But the signal is so weak now that it just is not reliable to record from. I had some luck recording from the On Demand and now for whatever reason it the VOD just doesn't want to work. We have been customers for over twenty years but we are paying nearly a hundred bucks a month and barely watching anything and what we want to watch just the least little bit of wind or rain and it goes out and poor signal quality notice comes up on the screen and will not go away until you press some the OK button.

We barely watch anything anymore and it seems to be a waste of money. I think we drop Shaw Direct and go to streaming video services and purchase DVD Box Sets. At least twenty years as a customer; but it feels foolish to keep paying and have this type of service.

Why is the signal weak? Maybe your dish needs alignment or the receiver is not working as it should.
The subscription cost is quite high compared to what people pay in Europe. Perhaps you can downgrade to the basic package if they have channels that you need.
The alternative of streaming might be a good idea but recording will not be easy. buying DVD boxsets you will end up with shelves full of DVD boxes that you will not watch again.

[themaster1]

I finally figured out how to get a fairly decent picture via recording from the composite output on the Shaw Direct Receiver. But the signal is so weak now that it just is not reliable to record from. I had some luck recording from the On Demand and now for whatever reason it the VOD just doesn't want to work. We have been customers for over twenty years but we are paying nearly a hundred bucks a month and barely watching anything and what we want to watch just the least little bit of wind or rain and it goes out and poor signal quality notice comes up on the screen and will not go away until you press some the OK button.

We barely watch anything anymore and it seems to be a waste of money. I think we drop Shaw Direct and go to streaming video services and purchase DVD Box Sets. At least twenty years as a customer; but it feels foolish to keep paying and have this type of service.

What kind of noise factor LNB do you have ? I recommand 0,3 or lower. Also obviously the Azimuth and tilt are critical for the dish. Let's not forget the LNB skew (right or left rotation). Also if you have a long cable (+/- 20 meters) that will not help and a gain amplifier may be a good idea

[Tom Saurus]

It is a matter of trees in the way and I did read something Shaw Direct is migrating all the channels over to one satellite instead of the multiple satellites they have had their channels divided up on. I used to get about 87 percent signal strength on The Game Network now it is 63 percent and the least little thing and the signal goes out.

As for DVD Box Sets I do watch them but I am obsessive compulsive so I tend to want to collect TV Shows that mean something to me. But with what they put on TV these days doesn't give me much enjoyment so about 95 percent is not appealing to me. However my Sister she has a few shows she likes mostly This Old House and the PBS Cooking Shows. I noticed if one was to subscribe to Prime you can get PBS Passport so that might be the answer to keep her content.

Most of the time now I am watching YouTube or Dailymotion. I got rid of most of our channels but even when one does that your bill creeps up. It seems it did take all that long to go from 67 dollars and now it is $91.50 No new channels just raise the bill whenever they see fit. The same goes for the ISP creep the bill up bit by bit but other than lining their pockets no increase in speed or quality. But enough grossing it isn't the end of the world and there is so much to be grateful for.

This X3 VOD error when you look at the Shaw Direct website no information about that but all the other errors have explanations. I should give the tech department a call and at least get an explaination or try to get one.

[Subtitles]

I think as more satellite subscribers cancel in favour of streaming, the service providers increase the subscription cost in order to remain profitable. It doesn't help if they are the only service provider as there is no competition.
As to the ISP increasing the cost, it might be worth looking into getting internet using cellular routers. If you have 5G cellular antennas in your area, you will have amazing speeds with 5G routers or even 4G routers.
I have been testing this option to get rid of my ISP and am looking at the moment to order a 5G cellular router. Unfortunately for me I have many surrounding buildings that can block the cellular tower, even if they are available in my area.
In the past when DVD was king, I ordered a lot of DVD and Blu-Ray set boxes. It was the only way at the time to watch what I wanted to watch. Now they are sitting in shelves doing nothing.

[Tom Saurus]

Didn't you rip the DVDs and make files to store on a hard drive to stream to your TV?

[Subtitles]

Didn't you rip the DVDs and make files to store on a hard drive to stream to your TV?

No I didn't.
It is a waste of hard disk storage and I am not likely to watch them again.
I have so many videos recorded from satellite (thanks to Enigma 2 receivers they don't encrypt the videos), and so little time to watch.

[Tom Saurus]

Subtitles: Perhaps you could donate the DVDs to a Library if you have no use anymore for them or perhaps if you know of any Thrift Shops that are run to raise money for charities that might be another option.

Good news a Shaw Direct contractor technician came out today and he got our signal up to at least the 80 percent range so it is has made a big difference. The signal is staying in now and that is wonderful. As far as I know though the VOD X3 error remains.