Format conversion

[Rixter]

Recently, I wanted to convert a MKV to mp4. I used AVC to complete the conversion. The result was less than ideal. The "converted" file was grainy and of poor quality. I've used AVC to convert many MKV's and until now, most all have turned out decent. Has something changed with AVC? Is there another convertor that would work just as well as AVC? And here's a second problem, I'm having trouble getting AVC to rip/convert from a DVD. Appreciate any suggestions/help!!!

TNX;

Rick

[videobruger]

ffmpeg -i video.mkv -c copy out.mp4

But notice .MKV is a more flexible container than .MP4 and maybe the codecs in the .MKV cant be used in MP4

[Rixter]

Thanks for replying.

I believe you missed "I've used AVC to convert many MKV's and until now, most all have turned out decent." Unfortunately, I'm relegated to using public comps until I can get another laptop. So, FFMpeg is not an option.

[davexnet]

If you're using public computers, what programs are available to you?
Almost all of the GUI converters use x264 under the covers, it usually comes down to choice of settings
that makes the difference.
videobruger is suggesting a way to copy the streams to a new container with out re-encode,
preserving the original quality

[Rixter]

RE: davexnet

Thanks for replying! I believe(?) most open-source programs can be accessed. What I can't use is any program that would need to use code programming, such as FFMPeg. Yes, I did have AVC set to mpeg4-hecv-264....(isn't that the same?) That's what I had been using. I doubt this, but would the age of the DVD/video be of concern? One was from 1965 and the other was 2003????? They looked good(DVD) on the media player (before conversion). Any ideas on what's causing the software (AVC) not to convert straight from the DVD? Not sure I understand "videobruger is suggesting a way to copy the streams to a new container with out re-encode,
preserving the original quality"

[Alwyn]

I used AVC to complete the conversion.

Are you sure that is the name of the program you're using to convert? I haven't heard of such thing.

I did have AVC set to mpeg4-hecv-264....(isn't that the same?)

No they're not. HEVC (aka H265) is a different video format to AVC (aka H264). Both are the video codecs that can "live" in an MP4 file.

If oyu could let us know exactly what program you are using to convert, we will probably be able to assist with the best settings so you don't lose much quality.

[davexnet]

I thought AVC was Any Video Converter. Never used it myself, but isn't it another
x264 gui?
The other thought is if the OP is trying to convert something from DVD,
Is it a commercial disk? What about the protection?

[steptoe]

Try FFMPEG Batch Converter


Its 100% free, I use it to very quickly copy MKV or AVI to MP4 format without any encoding for my EMBY media server. I know EMBY can play pretty much everything but I want all my files to be the exact same format. It does no encoding at all with the default copy option


https://ffmpeg-batch.sourceforge.io/


It can convert to x265 or x264 but that's with another preset, unless you specifically tell it to convert, all it will do is copy to the MP4 format keeping all audio and subtitle tracks

[lingyi]

Not sure I understand "videobruger is suggesting a way to copy the streams to a new container with out re-encode, preserving the original quality"

.MKV and .MP4 are containers that can contain multiple different video and audio formats, including Mpeg-2, which is what the video from a DVD-Video is. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_video_container_formats

https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/382060-I-want-a-software-which-converts-mkv-to-mp4...out-reencoding

I'm having trouble getting AVC to rip/convert from a DVD.

Don't know exactly what you mean, but RIP and Convert/Reencode are two different processes, often hidden by the software.

Some will say that the definition of Rip has changed, but I stand by the original definition, a bit for bit copy of the original. So for a DVD[-Video], you can only Rip to an Mpeg-2 and optionally Remux to a .MKV or MP4 container. MakeMKV can Rip and Remux to an .MKV. I don't know of any program that and Rip and Remux to .MP4.

Many programs that output to .MP4, Rip and Reencode, losing quality no matter what Codec and setting you use, as you've found.

Bottom line, if whatever you're using supports Mpeg-2, which most players do, but doesn't support .MKV, you can Remux from .MKV to .MP4 without losing quality. Some players, especially cheap media players* in Smart HDTVs, are very limited in what video and audio formats and containers they accept. And you have to either reencode/convert to meet the requirements or get a better player.

*Don't be fooled by the cost of the HDTV. The media player in most of them are bested by a $50 Android Box which can play the majority of video files.

[Santiago]

I use Shutter Encoder. It is free.

[Rixter]

To Everyone:

OK, guess I haven't explained, very well, what I'm trying to do. I have a number of DVD's that I want to (and have in the past) convert to mp4-hevc-264(or 265). I have been using MakeMKV to "rip" the DVD to MKV. Then, using "Any Video Converter", convert the MKV file to mp4. In the past, that has worked and produced good quality video. Lately, I had a few DVD's reformatted this way and the quality of the video was rather poor. What I'm wondering is if AVC has changed their formatting process in any way recently? And, barring FFMPeg, are there any other open source video converters that work as well as AVC used to? I'm going to try, again, to convert the DVD's going through the same process and carefully scrutinize the setting of AVC. Now, the other problem w/ AVC. In it's UI, you have an option to "rip" and/or convert from the DVD. However, now, sometimes it works, most times it don't...and when it does rip/convert the DVD, lately all it will produce is the first 3-5 mins of the DVD. Thus why I asked if AVC has changed their procedures in some way?

RE: lingyi "Don't know exactly what you mean, but RIP and Convert/Reencode are two different processes, often hidden by the software." Yes, I am aware.
RE: steptoe I used to use FFMPeg, but unfortunately, my laptop died and for the present, I'm relegated to using public comps. which does not allow(for obvious reasons) "coding" processes.
RE: Alwyn I'm confused by your reply. Am I to understand hecv264 and x264 are not one in the same? I am aware 264 and 265 are a bit different, but they can both be integrated into mp4 (is that correct?)

TO ALL WHO'VE REPLIED Thank You very much. Never hurts to "learn" a bit and consider different methods. I appreciate every one of your replies!

[Alwyn]

I'm confused by your reply. Am I to understand hecv264 and x264 are not one in the same? I am aware 264 and 265 are a bit different, but they can both be integrated into mp4 (is that correct?)

HEVC (High Efficiency Video Codec) is the commoner's name given to the H265 video codec. "AVC" (Advanced Video Codec) is the name given to the H264 video codec. They are different, and a video can't be both. HEVC/H265 is allegedly better for size vs quality: same quality, less file size.

It seems to me that the crux of the matter is what video codec is in the MKV.

I'd suggest installing Mediainfo, opening one of your MKVs in it and going to View>Text View. Then simply copy all of that and post it here.

We'll then see what's inside that MKV and advise a way forward. You may well just need to change container from MKV to MP4 without any conversion.

[Alwyn]

Bottom line, if whatever you're using supports Mpeg-2, which most players do, but doesn't support .MKV, you can Remux from .MKV to .MP4 without losing quality.

Surely a conversion from MPEG-2 to MP4 is going to entail a re-render? Or are you suggesting MPEG 2 in a MP4 container? If size isn't an issue, you'd be better off just leaving it as an MPG. All TVs open those (well, they should do).

[lingyi]

Remuxing is just switching containers with no quality loss. However, the cheap media players in some Smart TVs are very particular about what type of codec is in what type of container. There are numerous posts here about "Some videos don't play in my Smart TV, but others do?" and the first answer is always check your manual for what container and format it supports and check the working video (Mediainfo is a good suggestion) and a non-working video to see the difference.

[Cornucopia]

Bottom line, if whatever you're using supports Mpeg-2, which most players do, but doesn't support .MKV, you can Remux from .MKV to .MP4 without losing quality.

Surely a conversion from MPEG-2 to MP4 is going to entail a re-render? Or are you suggesting MPEG 2 in a MP4 container? If size isn't an issue, you'd be better off just leaving it as an MPG. All TVs open those (well, they should do).

Mpeg containers (mpeg2-ps, mpeg2-ts, mp4) are designed to accommodate mpeg streams (m1v, m2v, h264, h265, mp3, aac) as well as a few other vetted formats (ac3 is common), so although mpeg2 video in mp4 is not that common, it shouldn't have any issues with muxing.

Playback is another matter, however, and that is due to manufacturers going the simplest & most common route. So YMMV.


Scott

[Alwyn]

...

[Rixter]

Hey: Doing a 'reformat" of the same DVD's and here's what I came up with. Using AVC , I used these settings MKV to mp4(h265) quality set to "high" video size: 352X240 (best it could do). Well, it didn't turn out as well as it has in the past. Noticed it was really reducing the size of the file from 6+G's down to 350 mb's (or so). Hmm...not sure 'bout that and probably why video is degraded(??). Thinking I'll try .avi and see how that turn out. Post results later.

[Alwyn]

Please please please give us a readout of your MKV from Mediainfo.

[ProWo]

With a DVD source (720x576 PAL, 720x480 NTSC) your should never set a lower resolution, 352x240 in your case.
You can't expect quality at this low resolution.

[Rixter]

RE: Alwyn I don't know the parameters of the MKV file. And, let me state, I think you've missed a point in my original post. I said "I have used MakeMKV to rip the DVD, then used AVC (AnyVideoConverter) to convert the file and [U]in the past, that process created a good re-format.(good picture quality) The problem is with "lately".

RE: ProWo I stated I used AVC (AnyVideoConverter) to reformat the MKV file. This program(AVC) has options of video size --Original, 160x112, 176x144, 220x176, 320x240 and 352x240. There is another option for video codec which I've never altered (default). Hope you saw, in my original post, 'I've used AVC in the past and the results were fine. Lately is when I've been getting less than "good" results.

THANKS to everyone for helping out!!!

[Alwyn]

I don't know the parameters of the MKV file.

That is why I've suggested to you, twice, to install Mediainfo and give us the "text" view readout so we can see what is in that MKV. You may not even have to "convert" it.

[rgr]

Thanks for replying.

I believe you missed "I've used AVC to convert many MKV's and until now, most all have turned out decent." Unfortunately, I'm relegated to using public comps until I can get another laptop. So, FFMpeg is not an option.

If you use public computers, how do you want to convert if you can't even use ffmpeg?
Are there any online converters?
Anyway, ffmpeg shouldn't be a problem on a public computer.

[Rixter]

RE: rgr There are a number of converters available. Some are open source, some are purchase. I had been using AnyVideoConverter. It's just lately, I've run into "quality" issues. FFMPeg isn't a problem, per se, the public computers restrict/prohibit using command line[Windows cmd]. (for obvious reasons) I think !'ve found a workaround for FFMPeg.(??)

[Rixter]

RE: Alwyn General
Unique ID : 300535007906723492757778375678394820234 (0xE218EFE634D88DE63ABC56CC8DBAE68A)
Complete name : C:\Video\SONSOFKATIEELDER_1\The Sons of Katie Elder.mkv
Format : Matroska
Format version : Version 2
File size : 4.12 GiB
Duration : 2 h 1 min
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 4 849 kb/s
Encoded date : UTC 2022-10-31 19:51:26
Writing application : MakeMKV v1.17.2 win(x64-release)
Writing library : libmakemkv v1.17.2 (1.3.10/1.5.2) win(x64-release)

Video
ID : 1
ID in the original source medium : 224 (0xE0)
Format : MPEG Video
Format version : Version 2
Format profile : Main@Main
Format settings : CustomMatrix / BVOP
Format settings, BVOP : Yes
Format settings, Matrix : Custom
Format settings, GOP : Variable
Codec ID : V_MPEG2
Codec ID/Info : MPEG 1 or 2 Video
Duration : 2 h 1 min
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 4 456 kb/s
Maximum bit rate : 9 800 kb/s
Width : 720 pixels
Height : 480 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Variable
Frame rate : 24.097 FPS
Original frame rate : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
Standard : Component
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Scan order : 2:3 Pulldown
Compression mode : Lossy
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.535
Time code of first frame : 01:00:00;00
Time code source : Group of pictures header
Stream size : 3.79 GiB (92%)
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No
Color primaries : BT.601 NTSC
Transfer characteristics : BT.601
Matrix coefficients : BT.601
Original source medium : DVD-Video

Audio #1
ID : 2
ID in the original source medium : 189 (0xBD)128 (0x80)
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Commercial name : Dolby Digital
Codec ID : A_AC3
Duration : 2 h 1 min
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 192 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel layout : L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Compression mode : Lossy
Delay relative to video : 18 ms
Stream size : 167 MiB (4%)
Title : Stereo
Language : English
Service kind : Complete Main
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Original source medium : DVD-Video

Audio #2
ID : 3
ID in the original source medium : 189 (0xBD)129 (0x81)
Format : AC-3
Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
Commercial name : Dolby Digital
Codec ID : A_AC3
Duration : 2 h 1 min
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 192 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel layout : L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Frame rate : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
Compression mode : Lossy
Delay relative to video : 18 ms
Stream size : 167 MiB (4%)
Title : Stereo
Language : French
Service kind : Complete Main
Default : No
Forced : No
Original source medium : DVD-Video

Text #1
ID : 4
ID in the original source medium : 189 (0xBD)32 (0x20)
Format : VobSub
Codec ID : S_VOBSUB
Codec ID/Info : Picture based subtitle format used on DVDs
Duration : 1 h 58 min
Bit rate : 3 343 b/s
Frame rate : 0.253 FPS
Count of elements : 1802
Stream size : 2.84 MiB (0%)
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No
Original source medium : DVD-Video

Text #2
ID : 5
ID in the original source medium : 189 (0xBD)33 (0x21)
Format : VobSub
Codec ID : S_VOBSUB
Codec ID/Info : Picture based subtitle format used on DVDs
Duration : 5 s 996 ms
Bit rate : 2 417 b/s
Frame rate : 0.167 FPS
Count of elements : 1
Stream size : 1.77 KiB (0%)
Language : French
Default : Yes
Forced : No
Original source medium : DVD-Video

Text #3
ID : 6
ID in the original source medium : 224 (0xE0)
Format : UTF-8
Codec ID : S_TEXT/UTF8
Codec ID/Info : UTF-8 Plain Text
Duration : 1 h 58 min
Bit rate : 112 b/s
Frame rate : 0.252 FPS
Count of elements : 1790
Stream size : 98.1 KiB (0%)
Language : English
Default : No
Forced : No
Original source medium : DVD-Video

Menu
00:00:00.000 : en:Chapter 01
00:06:41.601 : en:Chapter 02
00:12:07.226 : en:Chapter 03
00:17:42.728 : en:Chapter 04
00:27:36.521 : en:Chapter 05
00:36:47.538 : en:Chapter 06
00:50:08.839 : en:Chapter 07
00:56:21.745 : en:Chapter 08
01:03:32.475 : en:Chapter 09
01:09:26.495 : en:Chapter 10
01:14:32.468 : en:Chapter 11
01:21:09.531 : en:Chapter 12
01:31:21.976 : en:Chapter 13
01:41:38.092 : en:Chapter 14
01:47:50.997 : en:Chapter 15
01:55:35.028 : en:Chapter 16

Everything OK? There has to be a better way to export this file?

[Rixter]

Alright, I once again, ripped/re-formatted the DVD. MKV rip was 4.2Gb. When formatted to mp4 the file size is 304Mb. The settings of AVC(anyvideoconverter) BASIC settings - - video size 352x240,,,quality-HIGH In video options; video codec: x264 Frame Rate - auto Video Aspect - auto Encode Pass - 1 Didn't adjust any audio settings. IDK...pic quality is low.

[rgr]

Alright, I once again, ripped/re-formatted the DVD. MKV rip was 4.2Gb. When formatted to mp4 the file size is 304Mb. The settings of AVC(anyvideoconverter) BASIC settings - - video size 352x240,,,quality-HIGH In video options; video codec: x264 Frame Rate - auto Video Aspect - auto Encode Pass - 1 Didn't adjust any audio settings. IDK...pic quality is low.

With such settings, the quality must not be high.
Resolution: 720x480. The other settings are ok.

Rip looks good.. Oddly, isn't interlaced...

[davexnet]

Set it up like this. Program uses 1-pass ABR mode for MKV. I set a custom bitrate of 1500

[rgr]

Use the crf (19) parameter instead of bitrate. But I don't know if avc has this option. Or increase the bitrate. From my observations, poor mpg compresses poorly to h264 with low bitrate.

[davexnet]

Use the crf (19) parameter instead of bitrate. But I don't know if avc has this option. Or increase the bitrate. From my observations, poor mpg compresses poorly to h264 with low bitrate.

I prefer CRF myself, but it wasn't immediately obvious whether it could be set in AVC.
The 1500 bitrate in the source I used was equivalent to approx CRF 14 (tested in VidCoder)

[Rixter]

Hey ALL: This time I changed one thing and the "quality" is better. Maybe not what I'd like, but much better than anything I've gotten previously. I changed to video size from 352x240 to ''original". To davexnet & rgr. I agree the resolution needs to be 720x240 or better, but not an option w/ AVC. UNLESS I can enter that resolution in Video Options>Customized Quality Options(?) I'll try that! Quote: "I prefer CRF myself," ?? What is CRF? You know, I've used AVC (anyvideoconverter) for quite awhile and until recently, never changed anything/settings and always had good quality pix! I'm still open to any other open-source "converter" that can produce good quality. Have been trying many and it's a crap shoot to find a good one. Movavi wouldn't "load"/install (just kept buffering at about 85%), same problem with Handbrake, Wondershare will only rip first 5 mins. of film, and others will only give you a limited time "trial".

A great deal of thanx to everyone helping out on this thread. I'm learning a little and getting some good help. APPRECIATED!!!