Adobe Premier and Apple Pro Res HQ

[Johnnysh]

Hi Guys

a few quick questions please ......


Ok so I found my old Sony HI Camcorder with a few HI8 Tapes, my aim is to digitally capture those cards using my High End digital Capture Card AJA Kona

Sadly the tape in the camcorder had to me spliced and repaired about 25 times as it kept on breaking, most people after repairing the tape twice would have thrown it away, but no the memories on the tape were special so a gave up a whole evening splicing and repairing and unwinding the whole tape through and through

With analogue capture of its always a fine balance between RAW/Compressed & Hard drive space.

The capture setting I have Chosen with AJA Kona is not RAW but Apple Pro Res HQ... Is this acceptable quality for what I trying to do archive old HI8 Tapes ?

Video
ID : 1
Format : ProRes
Format version : Version 0
Format profile : 422 HQ
Codec ID : apch
Duration : 7 min 20 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 68.8 Mb/s
Width : 720 pixels
Clean aperture width : 703 pixels
Height : 576 pixels
Clean aperture height : 576 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 4:3
Clean aperture display aspect ratio : 4:3
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
Standard : PAL
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Scan type : Interlaced
Scan type, store method : Interleaved fields
Scan order : Top Field First
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 6.637
Stream size : 3.53 GiB (92%)
Writing library : AJA Kona Hardware
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2021-08-26 22:59:29
Tagged date : UTC 2021-08-26 22:59:29
Color primaries : BT.601 PAL
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.601

Audio #1
ID : 3
Format : PCM
Format settings : Little / Signed
Codec ID : sowt
Duration : 7 min 20 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 80.7 MiB (2%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2021-08-26 22:59:29
Tagged date : UTC 2021-08-26 22:59:29


1) As I want to capture the Analogue data from the HI8 tape at the best quality (but possibly not RAW due to the HUGE file size), would there be much visible difference in RAW verses Pro Res HQ?

2) Is Pro Res HQ the best codec / option to use for HI8 tape capture or should I consider better quality version of Pro Res when capturing ?

3) Once taking the captured Pro Res HQ video in to Adobe premier and editing etc. when I choose to export the final edited video, under the export (Media) video settings in adobe, I am choosing match clip setting, i.e. the original captured file (Pro Res HQ) video setting/format

so in theory adobe premier has matched video rendering settings to the source file when exporting the final video

using this export template, will there be any loss in video quality in the final exported file or should it be equal to the source file in quality ?

4) when I export as above and use medio info I notice a difference of the bit rate

original is constant and exported is variable

5) does this mater ? can I make adobe premier export constant bit rate ?


Here is the Adobe rendered Output File, I assuming the quality will be 100% the same as the source HI8 captured file from my AJA Kona ??


Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : QuickTime
Codec ID : qt 2005.03 (qt )
File size : 4.30 GiB
Duration : 8 min 48 s
Overall bit rate mode : Variable
Overall bit rate : 70.0 Mb/s
Encoded date : UTC 2021-08-29 14:11:09
Tagged date : UTC 2021-08-29 14:11:35
Writing library : Apple QuickTime
TIM : 00:00:00:00
TSC : 25
TSZ : 1

Video
ID : 1
Format : ProRes
Format version : Version 0
Format profile : 422 HQ
Codec ID : apch
Duration : 8 min 48 s
Bit rate mode : Variable
Bit rate : 68.5 Mb/s
Width : 720 pixels
Clean aperture width : 703 pixels
Height : 576 pixels
Clean aperture height : 576 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 4:3
Clean aperture display aspect ratio : 4:3
Frame rate mode : Constant
Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
Standard : PAL
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:2
Scan type : Interlaced
Scan type, store method : Interleaved fields
Scan order : Top Field First
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 6.603
Stream size : 4.21 GiB (98%)
Writing library : adb0
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2021-08-29 14:11:09
Tagged date : UTC 2021-08-29 14:11:09
Color primaries : BT.601 PAL
Transfer characteristics : BT.709
Matrix coefficients : BT.601

Audio
ID : 2
Format : PCM
Format settings : Little / Signed
Codec ID : sowt
Duration : 8 min 48 s
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 1 536 kb/s
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel layout : L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
Bit depth : 16 bits
Stream size : 96.7 MiB (2%)
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2021-08-29 14:11:09
Tagged date : UTC 2021-08-29 14:11:09






INTERLACING --- Wil l Lose Any Original Video Quality Converting Interlaced to Progressive ?? Should I Keep The Exported Final Video To Interlaced ?

6) the original clip is interlace ok for TVs not so good for digital playback ?

there is an option in adobe premiere export setting to change export to progressive

when I have tried this I think the exported file is no longer interlaced as when I disable interlacing in vlc player there are no horrible interlacing lines


7) Now my question is, should I leave Interlacing On when exporting final video from premier ??


8) will there be video loss in quality exporting progressive over original interlaced

playback on pc seem better progressive, but don't want to lose any original capture quality from the Hi8 Tape


should there be anything else I should do in adobe premier or settings I should check for


Appreciate any help as just want to archive the old tape the best way with maximum acceptable quality


Thanks in advance for any help

[lordsmurf]

Wil l Lose Any Original Video Quality Converting Interlaced to Progressive ??

Yes, lots.

Retain interlaced version for archive.
Create deinterlaced copy for using on streaming websites.

[Johnnysh]

Thanks for the info


but could someone please answer the questions about editing files in Adobe Premier

If I import a video file in Apple Pro Res HQ

Then Trim

and then export Apple Pro Res HQ

will there be any video loss in quality or should the exported file be the same as the original file

Thanks in advance for any help

[DB83]

Since your topic title does not really describe your core issue, I suggest you edit it. (Think you can do that from the initial post)


Some like "Q re Adobe Premier and Apple Pro Res"


If not, contact forum admin and ask them to edit the title with your chosen words.

[Johnnysh]

thanks for the suggestion of title change

[Cornucopia]

Rule: with lossy codecs (not counting lossless suboptions), there is ALWAYS loss with every re-encoding generation. How much depends on the quality of the existing source, the codec, and the settings including the bitrate. Hard to say other than that, but ProRes is already considered a near-lossless codec, so unless you do something odd/wrong/stupid, your loss should be minimal.

Scott

[poisondeathray]

If you're just doing cuts type editing, PP can smart render prores (use to be only Macs , but even the PC version can now) . Smart render means it basically stream copies, so no loss. You have to make sure all the settings match correctly in the source and export settings. On other sections that you do other things like effects, layers, overlays etc.. it will re-encode those sections so minimal quality loss because you're re-encoding prores to prores

[Johnnysh]

Thanks for the replies, appreciated

how do you know premier pro is using smart render prores ?? when rendering out?

as the prores 442 hq files out of premier pro are always smaller in size than my source pro res 442 hq ??? so would not imagine premier pro has matched the source file quality when saving ?

Thanks

[poisondeathray]

If any of the settings are mismatched, it forces re-encoding.

eg. If source was TFF, but you left interlace off, and encoded progressive, that's different , it will cause a re-encode

But in general - indirectly you can tell in PP smart rendering is working with all supported smart render formats, because it's very fast compared to re-rendering and re-encoding.

But if you want to be 100% certain, you do a quality test on and in/out test - the export compared to the import , such as PSNR . Anything other than infinity means it's not lossless, and it's not smart rendering

[poisondeathray]

as the prores 442 hq files out of premier pro are always smaller in size than my source pro res 442 hq ??? so would not imagine premier pro has matched the source file quality when saving ?

But is that with editing, cutting out segments? Or just an in/out test ?

Is audio the same ?


If you do PSNR test , it will confirm if it was smart rendered (or not)

ffmpeg -i "export.mov" -i "source.mov" -lavfi  "[0:v]settb=1/AVTB,setpts=PTS-STARTPTS[main];[1:v]settb=1/AVTB,setpts=PTS-STARTPTS[ref];[main][ref]psnr" -f null -

If it's lossless and smart rendered it will say something like this
[Parsed_psnr_4 @ 00000089198c7680] PSNR y:inf u:inf v:inf average:inf min:inf max:inf