Does anyone here know how to use these lossless codecs?

[Guernsey]

I am currently looking for an alternative to Lagarith to use on Windows XP and while doing some research on the internet, I learned of a few codecs called MagicYUV, FFV1, UTVideo and Huffyuv. I heard some good things about these codecs but while these codecs are good, I do not know to use them to get the results I want. For example nn MagicYUV, there are options called Mode Conversion, YUV color matrix, Accepted Colorspace. Another example with UTVideo, there several versions on UTVideo wherre you have options like UTVideo YUV420 BT 601 VCM or YUV422 BT. VCM 709 VCM, etc. Huffyuv has options called "Predict Median" and I haven't used FFV1 outside of FFMPEG but I also learned that FFDShow has that encoder. I am confused and I am just looking for options where I can Lossless video with RGB (or YUV) with good compression and low disk space. Does have any in depth guides on how to use these codecs? Or enable settings that are similar Lagarith's "Enable Null Frames", "Use Multithreading" and "RGB (Default)"?

[jagabo]

You need to understand RGB/YUV color conversions, limited vs. full range, and chroma subsampling.

https://web.archive.org/web/20200408180709/https://software.intel.com/en-us/node/503873
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YCbCr
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YPbPr
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chroma_subsampling

[Skiller]

Years ago, after using Lagarith and then Ut Video, I settled with MagicYUV right away when it was new. Especially compared to Ut Video it is simpler to use because, as you noticed, Ut Video creates a "Codec" for every color space and you better choose the right one each time to avoid a conversion. Whereas in MagicYUV you can just set it up so that it never does a conversion on it's own and never put another thought into it. Just set "Mode" to "Compress as-is (no conversion)".
Therefore I do recommend MagicYUV.

[aedipuss]

the only one i wouldn't recommend is magic. neither open source or free. i have used UT for years and it's still being updated unlike lagarith or HUFF and it's free.

[Skiller]

Oh well I did not even notice MagicYUV is not free anymore. That is silly.
But really, I don't care, I may use this old free version forever.

[Alwyn]

the only one i wouldn't recommend is magic. neither open source or free.

For the results that this type of software allows us to achieve, $10 is pretty small change IMO.

[Sharc]

I am still using Huffyuv. It's a bit tricky to install under W10 though.

[Alwyn]

Just installed MagicYUV. Eeek!


[Attachment 60012 - Click to enlarge]

I'll stick with LAGS.

[Barrythecrab]

4:2:2.
It’s a very good codec.

[Skiller]

Wow that is annoying, and, as described earlier, was the reason for me to move away from Ut Video when MagicYUV was brand new. Old versions of MagicYUV have just one entry in the Codec list.
Then again I don't see any problem in using an old version of MagicYUV. It works just fine for me.

[jagabo]

Aside from some edge cases, they all deliver about the same amount compression with real world video. If Lagarith is working for you there's no reason to go searching for others.

[Guernsey]

You need to understand RGB/YUV color conversions, limited vs. full range, and chroma subsampling.

https://web.archive.org/web/20200408180709/https://software.intel.com/en-us/node/503873
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YCbCr
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/YPbPr
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chroma_subsampling

Looks like I got a lot of readin and studying to do. Studying had not been mys strong suit.

Aside from some edge cases, they all deliver about the same amount compression with real world video. If Lagarith is working for you there's no reason to go searching for others.

Yeah. I will have to try to experiment as for some reason one of programs hates LAGS. I think I need to trouble shoot to make sure what the real problem before moving on to any other codec.

Just installed MagicYUV. Eeek!


[Attachment 60012 - Click to enlarge]

I'll stick with LAGS.

This is the core of many of my issues. UTVideo and MagicYUV has so many options that the possibilities are literally endless.

[Alwyn]

Aside from some edge cases, they all deliver about the same amount compression with real world video. If Lagarith is working for you there's no reason to go searching for others.

Thanks Jagabo.

4:2:2.
It’s a very good codec.

Are you referring to MagicYUV 422?

[jagabo]

Just installed MagicYUV. Eeek!


[Attachment 60012 - Click to enlarge]

I'll stick with LAGS.

Those same options are selected by a pulldown in Lagarith:


[Attachment 60026 - Click to enlarge]

YUY2 is the same as YUV 4:2:2. YV12 is the same as YUV 4:2:0. Magic adds support for YUV 4:4:4 and greyscale. If I recall correctly UT Video Codec uses separate codecs for the different colorspaces, like Magic.

Just pick the right one for your video. Otherwise it won't work (the codec will refuse to encode the video) or the codec will convert (not lossless) your video to the requested color space and your lossless compression will no longer be lossless.

Some standouts:

The original Huffyuv is very fast on older hardware (though limited to a single thread, making it slower on modern multi core/thread hardware), limited to YUY2 and RGB, harder to install on modern Windows, and delivers a little less compression than the more modern codecs. But it has a long history and wider support.

FFV1 is slow, compresses a little more than the others, and supports higher bit depths.

[Guernsey]

Do you keep the default settings? Or do you click the "Predict Median" or "Predict Left" options? What about the frame divide count?

[jagabo]

Do you keep the default settings? Or do you click the "Predict Median" or "Predict Left" options?

Predict left is a little faster, predict Median gets a little more compression. Use whichever suits you.

What about the frame divide count?

This is how many pieces the frame is split into for multithreading (each thread works on a block of the source). Too few and you won't get adequate usage of your CPU, lowering compression speed. Too many can reduce compression speed as the codec has to do more work juggling all the threads. Use what suits your CPU and situation.

[Cornucopia]

For most general cases, with a reasonably powered modern computer, leaving it in the default settings works well enough.


Scott