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  1. Hi.
    So my Blu-ray player is a Sony BDP-S1500 and I noticed that it plays all my discs at 1080/60p, even my PAL dvds, and Blu-rays (or mkvs) at 25 fps.
    I checked and it says the player is 1080p (50Hz) compatible (source). Shouldn't it play those discs at 1080/50p for better quality?

    I've tried all the settings, auto and original resolution, but it always stays at 1080/60p for every disc. Why do you think that is?

    Thank you.
    Last edited by Nico Darko; 4th Nov 2020 at 22:54.
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  2. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Bdp-s1500 manual says it doesn't play pal discs (pg. 38), and it also says it only plays 1080/60p max on avchd 2.0 discs, otherwise its max is 30p (pg. 40).
    Moreover, and more importantly, the Bluray spec does not support 1080p60 (or 59.94), nor does it support 1080p50. It does support 1080i50/59.94/60, as well as 1080p24/25/29.97/30. And it also supports 720p50/59.94/60 (see the What Is Blu-ray...).

    I think you might be confused about what you are seeing. Perhaps you are putting out 24/25/29.97/30p and your TV is rate upconverting?


    Scott
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    here's a more detailed spec sheet - https://manualsbrain.com/en/manuals/906883/?page=4
    Last edited by october262; 5th Nov 2020 at 00:25.
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  4. Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    Bdp-s1500 manual says it doesn't play pal discs (pg. 38), and it also says it only plays 1080/60p max on avchd 2.0 discs, otherwise its max is 30p (pg. 40).
    Moreover, and more importantly, the Bluray spec does not support 1080p60 (or 59.94), nor does it support 1080p50. It does support 1080i50/59.94/60, as well as 1080p24/25/29.97/30. And it also supports 720p50/59.94/60 (see the What Is Blu-ray...).

    I think you might be confused about what you are seeing. Perhaps you are putting out 24/25/29.97/30p and your TV is rate upconverting?


    Scott
    Right, thanks. My knowledge about all this is pretty basic, but that explains it. Although I don't get it when you say it doesn't support 1080p60, the player always displays "1080/60p" when playing, when I set it to "auto" or 1080p, no matter what the original resolution is. But maybe I'm not getting what you said right?

    Anyway, I'm assuming 1080/60p is fine for discs or files at 25 fps? (my only other option is 1080/60i anyway, I can't get anything else).
    The playback just looks slightly less smooth than when I'm watching tv channels, and my Samsung TV does switch from 60p (bd player) to 50p then (tv decoder) since it's European tv, that's why I was asking.
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  5. Ok I'm lost, how can you tell what the best player to play content at 25fps is? one that supports both 1080/60p and 1080/50p? Because the playback on my Sony player isn't smooth enough for my 25p content, does it not support 50p because it came from the US and not Europe?

    I'd like to buy the European SAMSUNG BD-J4500R player for instance (I live in France), I remember using it at a friend's and I'm almost certain it sent both a 60p and a 50p signal to the tv depending on the source, but I don't know where to look in the manual for confirmation.

    These might seem like stupid questions, but I never quite got what all those differences meant, could someone make it a little clearer? Thank you.
    Last edited by Nico Darko; 7th Nov 2020 at 04:04.
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  6. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    25p content is never smooth. 25i (aka 50i) is, as is also 50p and higher.

    Unless you have a feature on your player that does motion interpolation, all 24p, 25p, 29.97/30p content will have some noticeable motion "stuttering", because those are below the threshold of humans' impression of fluidity.

    If you DO have that feature on your player, you may not like it. Most players' chipsets do not have any more than basic realtime motion interpolation (with no analysis of motion vectors, etc), so what they do is either just sample&hold while raising the flicker/refresh rate, or frame blending.
    Both of those you might consider worse than leaving it unchanged.
    And those devices that get to the next level, the lowest for of motion vector analyzed synthesis algorithms, is often considered to be "so smooth it looks fake". To do this right is usually too costly to implement in a consumer player, and too complex to be implemented in realtime during playback.

    The question of motion & smoothness is different from the question of support for higher rates and the question of cross-platform (NTSC<-->PAL) support.


    Scott
    Last edited by Cornucopia; 7th Nov 2020 at 11:11.
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  7. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    That model only supports h264 up to Level 4.1, and that means that it only supports up to 720 @ p60, but 1080 only goes up to p30. You would need a player that supported Level 4.2 or above.
    Or perhaps it might make sense to get a uhdbd player now? I just did (Sony UBP-X700 on special for $140) and am glad I took the plunge.

    However, that support I just mentioned is only the support for the native format & its framerate. Again, that is different than up-converting the framerate to something smoother.

    Scott
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  8. Thanks for your replies but I'm not sure you understood me. I'm simply talking about my HD content at 25fps, which by definition will be smoother than 24 or 23.976fps. I live in France, all content on tv is at 25fps, we're used to it. And when I play those 25fps files on my tv decoder, the tv signal shown on the screen is 1920x1080/50p and the playback is perfect, smooth as originally intended for 25fps footage.
    Cause you're right I do hate those features that fake fluidity.

    Playing the same 25fps content on my Sony player, my tv will switch to 1920x1080/60p no matter what the setting is, and can a result be slightly jerkier than 23.976fps content.
    But I think I found my answer online, my Sony player is region free but is a US models, and I read that most US BR players don't support the frame rate of 25. And it seems like all European players will support all frame rates, so I think I'll have to buy a (cheaper) European player for that type of content and keep my Sony player for the rest.


    Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    That model only supports h264 up to Level 4.1, and that means that it only supports up to 720 @ p60, but 1080 only goes up to p30. You would need a player that supported Level 4.2 or above.
    I'm confused, are you saying that the Sony S1500 model isn't playing all my 1080p content at its best quality? Again my knowledge is pretty basic, you lose me with too many technical details.
    Last edited by Nico Darko; 7th Nov 2020 at 17:16.
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  9. Originally Posted by Nico Darko View Post
    my Sony player is region free but is a US models, and I read that most US BR players don't support the frame rate of 25.
    That's correct. At the output NTSC players will normally only support 30i or 60p. That will cause your 25p content to be a little jerky. Most noticeable in panning shots.
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  10. Member DB83's Avatar
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    Methinks you confuse 50p ie 50 frames per sec with 50i which is 25 frames per sec interlaced.


    No actual dvd AFAIK plays or is authored so at 50 fames per second.


    The reporting that you see may be a confusion between an input setting on your tv with an output setting on your player.
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  11. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Maybe you didn't understand me.

    That content you have often on your tv in France is most commonly 25i (aka 50i) material, and, assuming you are using the tv receiver/decoder in either your tv or in a standard euro broadcast settop receiver, it would be outputting straight 25i to your euro tv, which shows it as 50p (usually using bobbing, or similar simple deinterlacing).

    If you have pal-type dvds to play, they would most commonly be also 25i, or possibly 25p (as is often done to upconvert from 24p film material), and USING A TRUE PAL PLAYER, it would still output the same way to the same tv.

    But as you say, you have an region free, but stll NTSC-format, dvd player, and it is not surprising that you found out it doesn't like nor does it work well with pal-based discs (or files). And it is perfectly normal for NTSC players to only allow output in 30/60-based rates (or more accurately the dropframe versions).

    And considering it is not billed as a "standard-converting" player, it is pure luck that it plays pal material AT ALL.


    Scott
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  12. Thank you! It is a lot clearer now
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