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Depending on your final output you will almost certainly have to re-encode whichever method you use.
Since it's only a two minute clip, try this:
Resize with VirtualDub and bring it into your project.
Also bring the original file into your project.
Put both versions into your timeline stacked on separate tracks.
Switch back and forth between the two to see which you prefer. -
There are dozens different types of scaling algorithms. Generally a NLE uses a soft bicubic to prevent aliasing. It's generally a softer scaling algorithm. If you used something like "lanczos3" in vdub it will be a "sharper" upscale.
It depends on the scenario you are facing. I suspect 480x360 public domain video will be soft and a sharper upscale would be beneficial. On the other hand, if it's "noisy", you might upscale sharpened artifacts
Or, if the goal was to "match" the existing VHS segments, there might be other approaches .
By the way, I’ve not before used VirtualDub. It appears that after resizing, I can save the project either as:
EXPORT>Save Old Format AVI, or
EXPORT>Save Segmented AVI.
In vdub classic it's "file > save as avi"
In vdub2 it's "file > save video" and that gives you more options other than AVI
Generally you want to select a compression first (video > compression) , otherwise it will export uncompressed video -
Yes, but uncompressed files are very large
If "Save as AVI" or "Save Video" is the correct execution for the purposes described above, what then is "EXPORT"?
Save as old format AVI uses an older AVI spec AVI 1.0 . It's for some older legacy software compatibility. Don't use it
Save as segmented AVI breaks the AVI into separate AVI segments. Generally you wouldn't want to use it -
Filesizes are large, but if you hardware is sufficient, go ahead. It makes editing more difficult. I probably would not
You can use lossless compression to reduce the filesize, but do you need truly lossless ? Most professional workflows use something "near lossless" like cineform, prores, dnxhr for intermediates, even Hollywood movies, TV shows, Netflix productions
You won't notice the difference in the end result
If it's something that's priceless , or archival, you might consider using a true lossless workflow. But if that's the case, you'd just make multiple backups all the original clips and references
Fine details, feel free to ignore this -
There are different types of "Uncompressed AVI " . Different pixel formats, subsampling. By default, vdub will use YV12 for 8bit 4:2:0 uncompressed, and YUY2 for 8bit 4:2:2 uncompressed
Adobe (and most Windows NLE's) require 8bit 4:2:2 "UYVY" to get true lossless uncompressed YUV treatment, otherwise they get converted to RGB . There are no lossy compression losses, but there are rounding lossless and colorspace conversion losses. Most NLE's do not support 4:2:0 uncompressed, and if they do, they require "IYUV" fourcc
In Adobe, most lossless YUV codecs are not truly "lossless", in that they also get converted to RGB
If you need a truly mathematically lossless workflow for input/output, it's a bit technical. You'd have to upsample 4:2:0 to 4:2:2 using nearest neighbor algorithm, then export in 4:2:2 UYVY configuration, then downsample back to 4:2:0 using nearest neighborLast edited by poisondeathray; 13th Aug 2020 at 13:05.
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Yes, video > compression > uncompressed RGB/YCbCr means uncompressed video. Huffyuv is a lossless codec, it applies lossless compression. Lossless compression means when you decode or decompress it, you get back the original uncompressed file. It's similar to zip or rar file archive compression .
(These VHS videos are, to us, very important family videos. So long as it is not incomprehensibly difficult, I would like to begin my Adobe Premier Elements editing with the best source material reasonably possible, thus my willingness to redo my MP-4/H.264 captures to AVI/Huffyuv.)
A final question: In VirtualDub2, I observe the following three relevant options ----
File > Save Project
File > Save Project As
File > Save Video
My I assume that the two “Save Project” options are for temporary/intermediate saves, where one is later going to return to work on the project, and thus there is no re-encoding . . .
Whereas, the “File > Save Video” re-encodes the project then saves it in AVI format?
Save Project As - just saves an additional iteration of a project. It's like manually doing an incremental backup copy of the project file with a different name. Nothing is being encoded either
Save Video encodes the video (and not necessarily as AVI if you 're using vdub2)
Re-encoding an uncompressed or lossless video with uncompressed, or lossless codec results in no degradation, provided the involved software handles everything properly, not additional colorspace or sampling conversions
eg. Adobe does not handle huffyuv as YUV, it gets converted to RGB . This is potentially problematic for several reasons. If your capture has usable highlight data >Y=235 - that will get clipped, that's the biggest one you might notice. If your captures were all within Y 16-235, you should be safe. The other issues like rounding errors are not really noticable , but you can measure the differences, it's more of an academic thing and on VHS material you won't notice the difference -
They are about the same, but lagarith offers higher compression (smaller filesizes).
But most lossless YUV codecs , including lagarith, huffyuv, ut video, magicyuv get converted to RGB in Adobe, so you will encounter the same problems. Some older versions of Premiere Pro CC accepted lossless x264 as YUV, but I doubt elements does, and newer versions have changed behaviour as well
If your captures are adjusted to Y 16-235, using huffyuv won't be a big problem . For the minor rounding error issues, you won't notice the difference in the final export if you view it on DVD, or web video, those sorts of things. It's negligible. But the levels issue can potentially be important, if you have usable data Y<16, Y>235. Those are salvagable in YUV. You're going to keep the original huffyuv and archive it anyways (or you should be), so what you bring into Premiere is less important
"Uncompressed" has the same problems too; unless it's one of the "special" versions. That's what the little speech above was about . "UYVY" in 8bit 4:2:2 configuration gets treatment as YUV in Adobe . If you just save "uncompressed" from vdub2 as 4:2:2 , it will be "YUY2" and get RGB treatment -
MP4/h264 can be lossless too . h264 can be placed in AVI as well. MP4 is just a container. AVI is just a container.
I recommend lossless for important things like family videos , so you can archive them . Make multiple backups. This is a separate issue than what is being done later.
Most commercial NLE's have this issue with "lossless" YUV codecs. (They are not truly lossless because of the colorspace conversions, and that has potential ramifications, some minor but the levels clipping can potentially be bad, because that can be "good" data you're throwing away, like shadow detail, or bright cloud detail)
The biggest quality loss is going to be from MPEG2 DVD encoding.
Most VHS is "noisy". The biggest subjective quality improvement you can do is process it with filters, clean it up, sharpen it, those sorts of things. At least it will be more enjoyable to watch. You still have the lossless original backup copies stored somewhere -
Yes, you can just adjust your levels during capture ~ Y16-235, either in hardware or software during capture , or after (but before Adobe) and you should be ok
x264 (AVC encoder) using QP0 is still lossless in Adobe. It's really the only "lossless" YUV codec that works in Adobe, as YUV . But that might not apply to Elements. For example it's lossless in Resolve too, but only the "studio" version. The "free" version can't import it.
It's more difficult to check in Elements, because you don't have a waveform monitor. As soon you import a known video with overbrights/darks (ie. values Y<16 , or >235) , you will see them clipped on a waveform if it's not being handled as YUV . It will be impossible to bring values >235 down, or values <16 up into range. For Elements, you'd have to adjust the levels and check (see if you can recover the superbrights), or export and check
You got to ask yourself if you really "need" lossless, when the final format is something like DVD. It won't make a difference on the DVD if you use a high quality intermediate for editing (Of course use lossless for archival purposes, store it somewhere, multiple copies) -
Beware that many of the filters in VirtualDub(2) work in RGB after a rec.601 conversion. So you may have the same crushing problems there.
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It's one of the standards for (among other things) converting YUV to/from RGB.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rec._601
It performs the contrast stretch that poisondeathray is warning you about.
Just be sure to adjust levels with one of the filters that works in YUV, not RGB. On the Filters dialog you can enable the Show Image Formats option to see what color format the filter is working in. One filter that works in YUV is Brightness/Contrast. The Histogram filter shows levels after a conversion to RGB -- so it crushes Y<16 and Y>235.
If you don't want to lose the darkest darks and brightest brights you care about this. -
Here's an extreme example. See what you can get out of the attached Lagarith AVI.
[Attachment 54548 - Click to enlarge] -
Every pixel in that AVI file has a luma value of less than 16. It's possible to recover those pixels with the right filters. That's what I showed in the screen cap. Obviously, you wouldn't capture a VHS tape like this. But if your VHS cap contains Y<16 values they can be made visible as very dark shades of grey, not just a flat black.
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