Help please!! How to power my external HDD connected to TV

[thegeeman]

Hi all
Been some years since I last posted and there's no better place than here to get an answer to my problem.

What I want to do is very simple - I want to simply plug my external hard drive into my TV (https://www.lg.com/uk/tvs/lg-65SM9010PLA) via USB to watch the files I have on it. But I need an approx. 2 metre distance between the TV and the HDD via a trailing USB (male to female) from the TV.

The problem is - my TV is wall mounted and sits within a frame and the thought of constantly pulling my tv away to plug and unplug my HDD is an absolute pain. So what I have done is the following:

1. I connected a 3 metre USB 3.0 to the TV, fed it through to where I need it, then plugged in HDD. Did not work as insufficient power from USB port to run it. As a side issue I also tried a second USB lead just in case I had a faulty one. Still didn't work.
2. Tried a 'powered' USB splitter by using the 2 USB ports I have on the TV to power the HDD (again via the 3m USB lead); still didn't work.
3. Thinking I needed more 'juice', I bought an Atolla USB charging dock https://www.amazon.co.uk/ATOLLA-Extension-Transfer-Charging-Adapter/dp/B01J7LF5PW. Plugged the USB lead in from the dock direct into tv then plugged my 3metre usb lead into the dock itself. Weirdly this still did NOT power my HDD. Struggling to understand since the dock is mains powered.If I plug the HDD direct into the dock, it works fine.But the lead is not very long and still sits behind the tv which is not what I want.
4. tried it the other way around; i.e. plugged dock directly into mains to power it. Then attached my 3m USB lead to the usb lead on the dock; then trailed that to the tv. Plugged my HDD directly into the dock. Still did not work.

TV has 2 USB ports; both USB 3.0. My hard drive is a Buffalo 1 TB Mini Station, USB 2.0 (approx 8 yrs old but works perfectly fine).Cant think that USB 3.0 lead would be an issue as I naturally assume they are backwards compatible.

And yes, the HDD works perfectly fine if I connect direct to the TV.

Please any help on how I can set up my HDD would be great. Please, please be quite simplistic as I am a total newbie tech idiot so no mention of circuit boards and wiring

Many thanks in advance

[ProWo]

http://www.yourcablestore.com/USB-Cable-Length-Limitations-And-How-To-Break-Them_ep_42-1.html

[thegeeman]

Thanks for that. I stumbled across that site also. Think I may look at an active/repeater cable as a possibility. Is it possible to use a Y splitter along with an active cable simply to boost as much power as I can?

[ProWo]

Is it possible to use a Y splitter along with an active cable simply to boost as much power as I can?

No idea. Try it

[DB83]

Maybe I over-simplify the 'solution'.


You already stated that you can connect the tv direct to the HDD. Is that cable not long enough ?


If it is then can you not remove the cable at the HDD end leaving the cable plugged in to the tv ?


Of course you will still need another cable for the HDD when you come to populate that with new content.

[thegeeman]

Maybe I over-simplify the 'solution'.


You already stated that you can connect the tv direct to the HDD. Is that cable not long enough ?


If it is then can you not remove the cable at the HDD end leaving the cable plugged in to the tv ?


Of course you will still need another cable for the HDD when you come to populate that with new content.

Hi
Sadly not. The cable/lead on the HDD is that very short integral, built into the HDD chassis type and only about 10cms long. I’m going to try a 2m USB lead and failing that a 2m USB active repeater cable. If they don’t work, then I’m at a loss. Thanks for your help

[dfisher052]

Do you happen to have a bluray player with a usb input on it? That's how I connect my external hard drives. As a bonus it upscales my movies into 1080p.

[thegeeman]

Do you happen to have a bluray player with a usb input on it? That's how I connect my external hard drives. As a bonus it upscales my movies into 1080p.

Hi. Yes I do have one with a USB output. And that does work. But it doesn’t like files that are x265 or audio files with E-AC3. Direct through TV they play ok. I suppose as a last resort I may have to go back to that option. Thanks for reminding me

[lingyi]

Thanks for that. I stumbled across that site also. Think I may look at an active/repeater cable as a possibility. Is it possible to use a Y splitter along with an active cable simply to boost as much power as I can?

Assuming by active/repeater cable you mean an extension cable (there's no repeating, it's simply an extension), then yes, a Y-splitter with one lead going to a USB power source should solve your issue which is that the amperage on USB 2.0 (500mA) is lower than USB 3.0 (900mA - 1500mA).

[thegeeman]

Thanks for that. I stumbled across that site also. Think I may look at an active/repeater cable as a possibility. Is it possible to use a Y splitter along with an active cable simply to boost as much power as I can?

Assuming by active/repeater cable you mean an extension cable (there's no repeating, it's simply an extension), then yes, a Y-splitter with one lead going to a USB power source should solve your issue which is that the amperage on USB 2.0 (500mA) is lower than USB 3.0 (900mA - 1500mA).

I tried a Y splitter with my original 3 mtr USB cable, hoping to get 2 x 500ma, but still no joy on getting HDD to work. I could feel a slight spinning of the drive but that lasted about 5 seconds and then stopped. My understanding is that an ‘active’ USB cable is totally different than a ‘typical’ USB extension cable due to the circuitry at the ‘power’ end. https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00P0ES0YE/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_YT1aFbX0RYWXX

[Cornucopia]

Even though it is advertised as workable, and you can see it working in action, I would STRONGLY advise against using usb to power your HDD. Get it's own dedicated power supply.

Then the 3m length for usb shouldn't be an issue, and you won't need to keep un/re-plugging it. Just keep it nearby the TV and always plugged in, powering up when you need to.

My 0.02$


Scott

[october262]

Thanks for that. I stumbled across that site also. Think I may look at an active/repeater cable as a possibility. Is it possible to use a Y splitter along with an active cable simply to boost as much power as I can?

Assuming by active/repeater cable you mean an extension cable (there's no repeating, it's simply an extension), then yes, a Y-splitter with one lead going to a USB power source should solve your issue which is that the amperage on USB 2.0 (500mA) is lower than USB 3.0 (900mA - 1500mA).

I tried a Y splitter with my original 3 mtr USB cable, hoping to get 2 x 500ma, but still no joy on getting HDD to work. I could feel a slight spinning of the drive but that lasted about 5 seconds and then stopped. My understanding is that an ‘active’ USB cable is totally different than a ‘typical’ USB extension cable due to the circuitry at the ‘power’ end. https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00P0ES0YE/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_YT1aFbX0RYWXX

get a sata to usb adapter like this - https://www.ebay.com/itm/USB-3-0-to-SATA-III-HDD-SSD-2-5-Hard-Drive-Adapter-Cable-22-P...MAAOSwF79dyOnz
i have one and it works perfect for what i need for and requires no external power supply to run.

[usually_quiet]

I tried a Y splitter with my original 3 mtr USB cable, hoping to get 2 x 500ma, but still no joy on getting HDD to work. I could feel a slight spinning of the drive but that lasted about 5 seconds and then stopped. My understanding is that an ‘active’ USB cable is totally different than a ‘typical’ USB extension cable due to the circuitry at the ‘power’ end. https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00P0ES0YE/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_YT1aFbX0RYWXX

I bought a USB Y splitter cable (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07FGDWM7B) to use with a USB 3.1 to SATA power and data adapter so I could temporarily connect a bare internal 2.5" HDD to a laptop and be sure of having enough power for the bare HDD. The Y splitter worked perfectly and I was able to successfully make a backup copy of the laptop's boot drive.

However, one side of my USB Y splitter only supplies power while the other side supplies both data and power. If that is also true for your Y splitter, it would be necessary to ensure that the data side of the split is connected to the USB extension cable from the TV and the power side is connected to a USB power source.

If you are certain that the Y splitter was connected correctly, then maybe the 3 meter extension cable is the problem. Have you tested it with something other than the external HDD to make sure that the extension cable is not faulty?

[DB83]

Even though it is advertised as workable, and you can see it working in action, I would STRONGLY advise against using usb to power your HDD. Get it's own dedicated power supply.


Scott

Of course some external HDDs do not have the means for an external power supply. I have both types.


And it just might be the case that even pushing to the limit that usb 2.0 allows (even with that other cable type) is too long for sufficient power for the device.


Could an external HDD be damaged by insufficient power ?

[usually_quiet]

Even though it is advertised as workable, and you can see it working in action, I would STRONGLY advise against using usb to power your HDD. Get it's own dedicated power supply.

Then the 3m length for usb shouldn't be an issue, and you won't need to keep un/re-plugging it. Just keep it nearby the TV and always plugged in, powering up when you need to.

My 0.02$


Scott

For what it's worth none of my external HDDs are USB powered. All of them are 3.5" desktop drives in external enclosures which plug into wall outlets for power.

[aedipuss]

it's probably not a power issue. usb 3.0 has more than enough watts to power any external hd at 6 feet. more likely the drive is dying/dead. buffalo doesn't make hd's and only buys the slowest cheapest crap drives it can get it's hands on. if you got 2 or 3 years out of it you are lucky.

[DB83]

^^ The OP did state that the drive is usb 2.0. (Using a usb 3.0 cable is not gonna make it a usb 3.0 device) Am I right in thinking these have less power and the longer the cable the more that could be compromised.

[aedipuss]

the output from a usb 3 source device is more than enough for any usb 2 receiving device. same 4 wires, just more juice. backwards compatible.

[johnmeyer]

The key sentence from the OP's #1 above is:

the HDD works perfectly fine if I connect direct to the TV.

This clearly shows that the drive is OK and is compatible with the TV when connected with a much shorter cable.

A three meter (ten foot) cable is not extraordinarily long and shouldn't be a problem.

To determine if this is so, I wanted to find out what sort of voltage drop you'd get across a ten foot USB cable that is carrying power to a disk drive. The charts on this page:

https://goughlui.com/2014/10/01/usb-cable-resistance-why-your-phonetablet-might-be-charging-slow/

provide some useful information. Since most USB-powered disk drives consume at least 500 mA. The chart suggests that a three meter cable would drop about 0.3 volts at that current draw.

I don't think this would cause the drive to not work.

So I think the cable itself has to be suspect. To test the cable, I would try connecting a thumb drive to it. Put some video on that thumb drive and see if it plays on the TV set.

[usually_quiet]

the output from a usb 3 source device is more than enough for any usb 2 receiving device. same 4 wires, just more juice. backwards compatible.

The hub in the initial post is USB 3.0 but are the LG TV's USB ports actually USB 3.0? The specs on LGs webpage for the TV and the TV's user guide only say USB, which usually means USB 2.0. The rtings.com review for a similar US LG 2019 model says it has no USB 3.0 ports. I don't think I have seen any TVs with USB 3.0 ports other than some top-of-the-line Sony OLED UHDTVs.

[johnmeyer]

the output from a usb 3 source device is more than enough for any usb 2 receiving device. same 4 wires, just more juice. backwards compatible.

The hub in the initial post is USB 3.0 but are the LG TV's USB ports actually USB 3.0? The specs on LGs webpage for the TV and the TV's user guide only say USB, which usually means USB 2.0. The rtings.com review for a similar US LG 2019 model says it has no USB 3.0 ports. I don't think I have seen any TVs with USB 3.0 ports other than some top-of-the-line Sony OLED UHDTVs.

I am no USB expert, but I'm pretty sure that USB 2 or 3 drives can connect and work with USB 2 or 3 inputs. Everything is backwards and forwards compatible, and the only thing is that you won't get high speed unless you connect a USB 3 device to a USB 3 port.

Within the USB spec, there are several power levels permitted, and if enough isn't provided, that can cause problems. As one example, I just returned an older iPad which the client thought was broken because it wouldn't take a charge. Turned out he was using a 500 mA charger and the iPad is not happy until you get at least twice that amount of current, preferably 2000 mA. It didn't just take longer to charge; it simply didn't charge at all.

I'm still betting that the OP's problem is a bad cable.

[lingyi]

Thanks for that. I stumbled across that site also. Think I may look at an active/repeater cable as a possibility. Is it possible to use a Y splitter along with an active cable simply to boost as much power as I can?

Assuming by active/repeater cable you mean an extension cable (there's no repeating, it's simply an extension), then yes, a Y-splitter with one lead going to a USB power source should solve your issue which is that the amperage on USB 2.0 (500mA) is lower than USB 3.0 (900mA - 1500mA).

I tried a Y splitter with my original 3 mtr USB cable, hoping to get 2 x 500ma, but still no joy on getting HDD to work. I could feel a slight spinning of the drive but that lasted about 5 seconds and then stopped. My understanding is that an ‘active’ USB cable is totally different than a ‘typical’ USB extension cable due to the circuitry at the ‘power’ end. https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00P0ES0YE/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_i_YT1aFbX0RYWXX

Definitely sounds like a power issue. A 1TB USB 2.0 drive should be easily powered by a USB 2.0 or 3.0 port (for reference, larger capacity 4 and 5TB portables require more power).

An active cable should work, but be sure to get one with a external power supply as your TV USB ports seem to be unable to supply enough power.

A question and something to try. When you used your Y-splitter, did you connect the extra connector directly to the TV ports or to an external charger or the powered USB hub you have. Just because your TV (or PC or laptop) has two ports, they may be bridged to the same controller internally, so you're not getting 2x 500mA, but 500mA/2. Same with an unpowered hub, each port shares the same available power.

[usually_quiet]

I am no USB expert, but I'm pretty sure that USB 2 or 3 drives can connect and work with USB 2 or 3 inputs. Everything is backwards and forwards compatible, and the only thing is that you won't get high speed unless you connect a USB 3 device to a USB 3 port.

Within the USB spec, there are several power levels permitted, and if enough isn't provided, that can cause problems. As one example, I just returned an older iPad which the client thought was broken because it wouldn't take a charge. Turned out he was using a 500 mA charger and the iPad is not happy until you get at least twice that amount of current, preferably 2000 mA. It didn't just take longer to charge; it simply didn't charge at all.

I'm still betting that the OP's problem is a bad cable.

USB ports on TVs and optical disc players do sometimes fail to provide adequate power for HDDs and have been known to burn out once in a while when connected to a USB-powered HDD. FWIW, the LG TV's manual suggests using USB HDDs that have their own power supply with drive capacities limited to 2TB or less.

However, I agree that a bad extension cable is a strong possibility and suggested testing the extension cable in another post.

[lingyi]

the output from a usb 3 source device is more than enough for any usb 2 receiving device. same 4 wires, just more juice. backwards compatible.

The hub in the initial post is USB 3.0 but are the LG TV's USB ports actually USB 3.0? The specs on LGs webpage for the TV and the TV's user guide only say USB, which usually means USB 2.0. The rtings.com review for a similar US LG 2019 model says it has no USB 3.0 ports. I don't think I have seen any TVs with USB 3.0 ports other than some top-of-the-line Sony OLED UHDTVs.

I am no USB expert, but I'm pretty sure that USB 2 or 3 drives can connect and work with USB 2 or 3 inputs. Everything is backwards and forwards compatible, and the only thing is that you won't get high speed unless you connect a USB 3 device to a USB 3 port.

Within the USB spec, there are several power levels permitted, and if enough isn't provided, that can cause problems. As one example, I just returned an older iPad which the client thought was broken because it wouldn't take a charge. Turned out he was using a 500 mA charger and the iPad is not happy until you get at least twice that amount of current, preferably 2000 mA. It didn't just take longer to charge; it simply didn't charge at all.

I'm still betting that the OP's problem is a bad cable.

Larger capacity 4 and 5TB portable drives require the 900mA power of USB 3.0 to spin the extra platters. I have some 4TB portables that will continually spin up, then spin down on a single USB 2.0 port. I have to use a Y-spiltter to to two different USB 2.0 ports, either on a powered hub or far enough away from in each other to ensure they're not bridged internally.

[lingyi]

Could an external HDD be damaged by insufficient power ?

I think it would be possible that the heads crash into the platter if the actuator didn't have enough time to return to park because of a lack of power. Unlikely, but anything is possible. As I stated above, some of my 4TB portables spin up and spin down when there's not enough power. In theory, the actuator shouldn't move the heads from park until the drive is fully spinning. In theory.

[thegeeman]

Hi all,

A MASSIVE thanks for all of your input and suggestions. Once again, I am SO glad I am still here as a member on this site.....cant believe it's been 16yrs!!!

The following seems to have worked.......so far!

Managed to acquire a much shorter 1.5 metre USB extension cable (bit of a tight stretch but only just). plugged this into TV and then ran it straight to the mains powered USB Hub and connected to that's own USB. Then plugged my HDD into the port. Drive was spinning and the small blue light on the HDD flickered. TV connection notification kept saying "Unknown Device Connected" and then "Unknown Device Disconnected". So I decided to then add the Y splitter also at the TV end and fit to both USB slots. The HDD shows a constant blue light now and I was able to play a file to check that it was working.

So.....could it have been the 3m cable all along? Maybe. Odd though because I tried a 2nd 3m cable and had the same issue.Why it took the adding of a Y splitter even though the HDD was now mains powered seems strange too! All in all, it was just a nightmare

Now that it is working, I am apprehensive to unplug any cables to tidy them all up in case it stops again......grrrrr. But hey, if I am back again please bear with me.

I may look at changing the HDD at this rate. As the TV sits inside a frame, there is approx a 1-1.5cm gap all around. A new slim HDD may even slip into that and just sit at the front and all I would need to do is gently slide it out, add files to it from pc and slide it back without moving TV at all. Now you tell me

Guys, thanks so much for all of your help, it really is very much appreciated. Take care and stay safe.

[lingyi]

Since it seems it's definitely the power that's the issue, you may want to go with an external SSD since they need much less power because no spinning platters. Much more expensive, but you can save some money by buying a bare drive and an external case.

Edit: BTW, lots of reports of people (including myself) [having problems] getting portable HDDs working directly from the TV's ports. For whatever reason, they're usually seriously underpowered. If you look at your manual, it probably states they're meant only for flash drives.

[johnmeyer]

... If you look at your manual, it probably states they're meant only for flash drives.

I was going to mention this. My [older] Samsung TV makes a big deal about not connecting a spinning drive to the USB ports and to only use a flash memory stick.