Does anyone have the HP DVD200i???

[Kusanagi]

Hello everyone,

There is a lawsuit against HP over DVD+R issue.

It looks like Phillips may be next.

Information on this (and a good theory on why early DVD+RW drives will not burn DVD+R) in this dvdplusrw thread --

http://www.dvdplusrw.org/cgi/ikonboard/topic.cgi?forum=2&topic=1262


Kusanagi

[shardison]

CJGS,

The topic is "anyone have a 200i?"

There is no compatibility problem with +R discs and the 200i or the 100i.

In the case of 100i, it didn't hit the shelves as writing +R, but the 200i did.

The lawsuit says that HP deceived buyers by saying that a simple free upgrade would make the 100i write +R discs some day. However, HP backed down quickly when the +R specs were made available, but not before the public relations damage was done. For myself, I knew a 100i would not write +R back in early December 2001, and I bought one in February 2002 anyway. I didn't care. Now for only $100 I can get a new upgrade drive that does something that I never expected to be able to do...write +R. I'm a happy camper.

Please stop spreading misinformation. Besides, your link is from dvdplusrw.org, which as everyone knows is a self-serving commie propaganda machine for the +R front.

[ChrisX]

CJGS,

The topic is "anyone have a 200i?"

There is no compatibility problem with +R discs and the 200i or the 100i.

In the case of 100i, it didn't hit the shelves as writing +R, but the 200i did.

The lawsuit says that HP deceived buyers by saying that a simple free upgrade would make the 100i write +R discs some day. However, HP backed down quickly when the +R specs were made available, but not before the public relations damage was done. For myself, I knew a 100i would not write +R back in early December 2001, and I bought one in February 2002 anyway. I didn't care. Now for only $100 I can get a new upgrade drive that does something that I never expected to be able to do...write +R. I'm a happy camper.

Please stop spreading misinformation. Besides, your link is from dvdplusrw.org, which as everyone knows is a self-serving commie propaganda machine for the +R front.

To shardison

I am not spreading misinformation and there is lawsuit against HP. The information was orginally from www.cdrlabs.com in their news section and this is how I got the dvdplusrw.org forums link. You know about it, way back in December, so some other people don't know about it. Some unhappy people taking a class action against HP and this is what is happening.

I don't support the +R and so don't attack me.

[shardison]

So sorry, but I'm tired of +R/RW slamming. And I do think that you had the info wrong, wrong in a way that was a tad unfair.

[Kusanagi]

And I do think that you had the info wrong, wrong in a way that was a tad unfair.

I don't see anything wrong and unfair with the info CJGS posted about the lawsuit against HP. What CJGS posted about, was spot on. Maybe you haven't seen all the information and those involved in the case. I suggest you read the following --

http://forum.vcdhelp.com/viewtopic.php?t=89016

http://www.geek.com/news/geeknews/2002apr/gee20020430011462.htm

http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/54/25093.html


Kusanagi

[ChrisX]

So sorry, but I'm tired of +R/RW slamming. And I do think that you had the info wrong, wrong in a way that was a tad unfair.

My info is a fact, there is a lawsuit against HP over DVD+R issue. This is all I am saying on the DVD+R affair with unhappy customers. They take class action against a computer company. They feel cheated and being ripped off.

I am not in favour for HP, I am not in favour for dvdplusrw.org and I am not supporting DVD discs with problems of compatibility. The onus is the consumer.

[JBC2002]

It seems to me that the topic, as of now, is pointless!
If you want an excellent medium for pure data storage, buy an HP DVD200i. If you want video medium compatible with most (if not all) standalone dvd players, than the choice is the Pioneer A03/A04!
I also find it somewhat unfair that the people who are expressing their OPINIONS are being bashed into submission by supporters of one format or another. If you like -R/RW....fine! If you like +R/RW....also fine! But don't berate someone just because they prefer one format over another. This is, after all; a forum for the expression of opinions; not a boxing ring!
Be kind to each other! :wink:

[shardison]

Let me clarify one last time:

There seem to be compatibility problems with the less expensive DVD+R discs. The discs aren't writable using the HP DVD100i.

This is misinformation. It's not a compatibilty problem, they were released without +R support, period. The HP box never said they did.

The consumers of the HP 100i would have to fork out an extra $99.00 to get the features of DVD+RW+R capability.

This is inflammatory. Anyone who got an HP100i early or lately, if they had paid attention to what they were buying and not what they wished they were buying, would have known that they were getting +RW only. The extra $99 is for a new drive, software, and warranty. A cheap upgrade deal.

Why should a consumer have to pay the extra $99.00 no fault of the purchaser. HP is to blame - BAD MARKETING.

There are many examples in the computer electronics world where the customer buys something and the next week the item comes out as a new improved model with more features. Bad marketing, yes, but hardly unfair. It is the fault of the purchaser. I'm one of them. Anyone with an HP 100i today could have opted for a -R/RW instead.

I am not going to purchase any DVD burner with the plus - compatibility problems. Not 100% with every DVD player and DVD-ROM.

What is this statement good for? It's a repeat of your previous misleading compatibility statement. It's aimed at scaring would-be +RW purchasers. And then you allude that a +RW DVD burner DVD disc should work in 100% of players and ROMs, as if -RW did. I guess you won't be buying ANY DVD burners, ever.

This is what I call +R bashing and I don't really understand the why of it. It's not informative, and it's not fair reporting.

[Tez12345]

I agree with shardison in that regard. We all have to make choices regarding this topic. I have had my HP for about a week and at first was so frustrated in the drive that I was considering returning it. But after working with it I found that it serves the purpose I bought it for very well. I burned my first dvd+r and it played perfect on my dvd player. I took it to work and let about 12 people try it on their machines and ALL 12 said it worked FlAWLESSLY. That is all I wanted the whole time, COMPATIBILITY. I didn't care if it was a dvd+r or dvd-r. So if your DVD-RW/R works for you then you shouldn't have a problem and shouldn't bash the +RW/W users. I stated in a earlier post that what helped make my decison in buying a HP 200i was Microsoft's decision to back the +RW/R standard. I got alot of flack for that statement but I was looking at the this issue from the present perspective not the past. Many of you may not agree but if Microsoft jumps on the bandwagon with heavy hitters like Dell, Sony, and HP, it is a very very good chance that this standard my win out. I can also understand the grip the the HP 100i users have also, because I know I couldn't spit out $500 dollars everytime there is an upgrade in technology. I feel they should be kind of grateful that HP is offering an upgrade at all. Maybe I'm wrong but I never read any articles stating that the 100i was +R compatible before the announcement of the 200i. Is it HP's or Sony's fault for making a product better!! So I guess I need to call Dell and say the same 800Mhz cpu I bought about a year and half ago now comes with 1.5Ghz processor speed. I demand an upgrade!! What do you think they're going to say.

[Kusanagi]

Wow, you really hate DVD-R/W I can really see it now...do you work for HP? Or the +RW Alliance?

It is not us that are doing any +R 'bashing' of any sort, we are just posting factual information (such as the HP lawsuit) to alert others (so that they can avoid any pitfalls in their first purchases). If you take these posts as insults and they make you cry, then well sorry - I guess when they say the truth can hurt, it rings true for you in this case. When you blame us for '+R bashing', it just weakens your position, serves as a desperate cop-out, and is another one of your many excuses to side-step more important issues.

Let me address some of your so-called 'factual' rebuttals --

The HP box never said they did.

Their box might not have, but from the beginning all literature (PR releases, brochures, and in-store descriptions) always said that the DVD100i would be able to write to the cheaper, write-once +R media with a 'simple and easy to install firmware upgrade'. Even the DVD FAQ and cdrlabs pointed this out multiple times early on when the DVD100i was released. Also, shortly after the DVD100i release, when DVD100i users called in to HP asking about +R support, they continued to stick with the '+R firmware update' story. Only a few short months later, did HP figure out that the DVD100i could not, in anyway, write to +R media. This caused HP to finally yank all reference to +R support in the DVD100i - thus sending many users who shelled up to $600 on a DVD100i to call 'foul'.

I suggest you read these threads on the ripple effect HP had on early DVD100i users when they announced no write capabilities for DVD+R media --

http://www.dvdplusrw.org/cgi/ikonboard/topic.cgi?forum=2&topic=705

http://theregus.com/content/54/24646.html

http://www.dvdplusrw.org/cgi/ikonboard/topic.cgi?forum=2&topic=1123&start=0

This is inflammatory. Anyone who got an HP100i early or lately, if they had paid attention to what they were buying and not what they wished they were buying, would have known that they were getting +RW only.

Please see above. There were plenty of references that the DVD100i would be able to write to +R media at one point. Both early on in HP brochures and on their website (which has since disappeared). Cdrlabs and both cdrinfo, both early on reported that the DVD100i would get +R write features with a simple firmware update. Even the DVD FAQ still reports that most DVD+RW drives can be upgraded to +R with a firmware update, see -

http://www.dvddemystified.com/dvdfaq.html#4.3.5

And I quote it - "Most DVD+RW drives will be upgradeable via a firmware download to write DVD+R discs."

I don't understand why you blame the consumer so much. Maybe you really are an HP employee?

The extra $99 is for a new drive, software, and warranty. A cheap upgrade deal.

Not for people who spent up to $600 for the drive when it first came out, and now finding out they have to spend another $100 for something that was initially promised to do. I don't consider $700 after the upgrade exactly "cheap"...

There are many examples in the computer electronics world where the customer buys something and the next week the item comes out as a new improved model with more features. Bad marketing, yes, but hardly unfair. It is the fault of the purchaser.

Again, you are dodging the issue. The HP DVD100i was initially promised to do +R. It was only AFTER people bought the DVD100i did they turn around and then say "No DVD+R for DVD100i". At least when the Pioneer A03 came out, it did what it was promised to do, and lasted 2 years before the A04 succeeded it. The DVD100i was barely 6 months old before it was ditched in favor for the DVD200i by HP.

It's aimed at scaring would-be +RW purchasers.

I think everyone is open to express their opinions after reading all the facts and research available. I don't know why you see this as 'scaring' tactics.

This is what I call +R bashing and I don't really understand the why of it. It's not informative, and it's not fair reporting.

Again, as with the HP lawsuit, if it isn't informative then why has C|Net, The Register, ZDnet, and eMedia all picked up and reported on this story. Seems pretty relative and must be informative and newsworthy if these online news sites are reporting on it. And I really don't think C|Net, ZDnet, etc. have any desire in "bashing" the +R format (or any format for that matter).

It is you, the boy who cries wolf amongst us sheep . Everytime we present the facts you cry foul and accuse us of "+R bashing". That attitude will not be embraced and tolerated here that much longer if you continue, and I'm sure others will agree.


Kusanagi

[Tez12345]

First of all I have never bashed -RW/R users. I just feel +RW/R is better after I did my research, what is wrong with that. If anyone it is you constantly giving info on various sources stating HP's irresponsibility toward HP 100i users. Just because various web sites or taking interest in the issue I'm supposed to have a gripe with HP. So what, those sources did the same thing with those Microsoft lawsuits. Are you going to stop using windows? If it turns out that HP backed out of their claim's and agreement with +R compatibility, then I agree 100% with those 100i users. Maybe the did to some degree and if that is true then they are WRONG. But then what is the $99 upgrade for? I agree with many people stating this topic is old and needs to be discontinued because everyone is taking everyone else's statements out of context. It's one thing to inform and it's another thing to inform to sway opinion. It seems you have some grip with HP that you want everyone to know about. Are you sure you don't work for Pioneer.

[Kusanagi]

First of all I have never bashed -RW/R users.

Really? Well, you just did. It's sad you didn't even realize it with your statement of -

Are you sure you don't work for Pioneer.

I was j/k with the 'HP employee' reference above, but I wouldn't be surprised though if it turns out to be true...

Kusanagi

[shardison]

Nope, I work for a company that is far and away from computer electronics.

Nobody ever accused HP of being a marketing wiz.

DVDRplus.org has good comparative information. Find a -R/RW site chart that directly counters those claims, and then you'll have something to start a debate with; instead of a bunch of out-of-context junk "facts."

In the end, all we want to do is make video DVD's. DVD+ makes DVD's just fine; especially +R.

This thread is dead.

[Kusanagi]

DVDRplus.org has good comparative information.

Not really. This has been discussed before.

...instead of a bunch of out-of-context junk "facts."

I don't understand why you call information and comparisions from the DVD FAQ at dvddemystified.com, articles from C|Net, ZDNet, etc. and multiple threads on how HP mishandeled DVD100i users (even on your dvdplurw.org site) "junk".

It's obvious now that you have been brain-washed by dvdplusrw.org and it is very apparent in your posts now. Go back and stay there with the rest of the DVD+RW fanboys if all your going to do is post here and declare +R is the best without conductive reasoning, dodge issues, and ultimately create more confusion.

In the end, all we want to do is make video DVD's. DVD+ makes DVD's just fine; especially +R.

Newsflash for you, in case you haven't heard: DVD-R does this too...and has been doing it for the past 2+ years already!

This thread is dead.

Perhaps, but not because you declare it to be.


Kusanagi

[newnoiseimage]

how about this...

check compatibility, i myself have decided to get the drive after reading no negative things about +r technology, (except here), one of the biggest pushes however is that my older dvd player isn't compatible with -r whereas it is suppossedly compatible with +r.
check before you buy, and read the info.