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    I have just authored and burned a DVD, and tried it both on my Samsung computer player and on a Sony standalone player. On the Sony the playback stucks. It goes until like 3-4 minutes, than the player head gets stuck and the TV reports no signal from the players and you can hear the head struggling. On the computer Samsung player the playback is flawless.

    I have tried a DVD that my friend authored, he set even higher bitrates, his DVD plays fine on the Sony, too. Both DVD's are written DVDs, not factory pressed.

    What can be the reason to that the Sony is struggling with my DVD? My video have lower bitrates, maybe I should burn it on 4x speed instead of 8x? Or maybe the mpeg format is incompatibile?


    Here is the video info of my DVD, that has problems on the Sony. I can see that the bitrates in my case are odd. It reports 111Mb/sec, however my source files are coded to 5957 kb/s average and 8000 kb/s maximum each. I set the authoring program not to reconvert the files, it does not reconvert, so I do not understand this. Maybe this confuses the Sony? Or this is just a software glitch and irrevelant in my case?

    General
    Complete name : Y:\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_1.VOB
    Format : MPEG-PS
    File size : 1 024 MiB
    Duration : 1 min 17 s
    Overall bit rate mode : Variable
    Overall bit rate : 111 Mb/s

    Video
    ID : 224 (0xE0)
    Format : MPEG Video
    Format version : Version 2
    Format profile : Main@Main
    Format settings : CustomMatrix / BVOP
    Format settings, BVOP : Yes
    Format settings, Matrix : Custom
    Format settings, GOP : M=3, N=12
    Duration : 1 min 16 s
    Bit rate mode : Variable
    Bit rate : 109 Mb/s
    Maximum bit rate : 8 000 kb/s
    Width : 720 pixels
    Height : 576 pixels
    Display aspect ratio : 16:9
    Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
    Standard : PAL
    Color space : YUV
    Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
    Bit depth : 8 bits
    Scan type : Progressive
    Compression mode : Lossy
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 10.515
    Time code of first frame : 00:00:00:00
    Time code source : Group of pictures header
    GOP, Open/Closed : Closed
    Stream size : 999 MiB (98%)

    Audio
    ID : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
    Format : AC-3
    Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
    Commercial name : Dolby Digital
    Muxing mode : DVD-Video
    Duration : 1 min 17 s
    Bit rate mode : Constant
    Bit rate : 192 kb/s
    Channel(s) : 1 channel
    Channel layout : C
    Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
    Frame rate : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
    Bit depth : 16 bits
    Compression mode : Lossy
    Stream size : 1.76 MiB (0%)
    Service kind : Complete Main



    Here is the info of my friend's DVD, that plays fine on the Sony:

    General
    Complete name : D:\VIDEO_TS\VTS_02_2.VOB
    Format : MPEG-PS
    File size : 1 024 MiB
    Duration : 18 min 2 s
    Overall bit rate mode : Variable
    Overall bit rate : 7 936 kb/s

    Video
    ID : 224 (0xE0)
    Format : MPEG Video
    Format version : Version 2
    Format profile : Main@Main
    Format settings : CustomMatrix / BVOP
    Format settings, BVOP : Yes
    Format settings, Matrix : Custom
    Format settings, GOP : M=3, N=12
    Duration : 18 min 1 s
    Bit rate mode : Variable
    Bit rate : 7 586 kb/s
    Maximum bit rate : 9 000 kb/s
    Width : 720 pixels
    Height : 576 pixels
    Display aspect ratio : 16:9
    Frame rate : 25.000 FPS
    Standard : PAL
    Color space : YUV
    Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
    Bit depth : 8 bits
    Scan type : Progressive
    Compression mode : Lossy
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.732
    Time code of first frame : 00:18:46:02
    Time code source : Group of pictures header
    GOP, Open/Closed : Closed
    Stream size : 978 MiB (96%)
    Color primaries : BT.601 PAL
    Transfer characteristics : BT.470 System B/G
    Matrix coefficients : BT.601

    Audio
    ID : 189 (0xBD)-128 (0x80)
    Format : AC-3
    Format/Info : Audio Coding 3
    Commercial name : Dolby Digital
    Muxing mode : DVD-Video
    Duration : 18 min 2 s
    Bit rate mode : Constant
    Bit rate : 192 kb/s
    Channel(s) : 2 channels
    Channel layout : L R
    Sampling rate : 48.0 kHz
    Frame rate : 31.250 FPS (1536 SPF)
    Bit depth : 16 bits
    Compression mode : Lossy
    Delay relative to video : -480 ms
    Stream size : 24.8 MiB (2%)
    Service kind : Complete Main

    Text
    ID : 189 (0xBD)-32 (0x20)
    Format : RLE
    Format/Info : Run-length encoding
    Muxing mode : DVD-Video
    Delay relative to video : 3 s 840 ms
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  2. Member DB83's Avatar
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    That reported bitrate is probably calculated from the running time (which appears wrong) and the file size. In fact no dvd could support a bitrate of 111 Mb/s

    It is known that stand-alone players are more sensitive to burnt dvds especially if the media is poor quality and/or burnt at too high a speed.

    Generally, you should burn at no more than 50% of the rated speed (8x for a 16x) and, of course, use good media.
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    Which program encoded the mpeg-2 and what is the running time. The medaainfo says its only 1 minute 17 seconds
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    The movie was originally MTS 1080p 24mbps, was edited in Sony Vegas, project settings were okay, and video was rendered through frameserver with HCEnc. Bitrate was set to 5644 average, 8000 max. The audio was exported from Vegas as wav. Then the video and audio was feeded to AWStoDVD, and muxed in that software to mpeg2. The m2v was left untouched, but the audio was converted to ac3. Because this was the only software that didn't affect the audio volume of the output, but only when feeding wav to it. Then the mpeg2 was loded to DVD Styler and compiled to DVD.

    I also tried DVD lab pro, the same problem. Only Womble editor outputs a DVD image with correct data in the VOB.

    When I open this vob in VLC, it doesn't display the time correctly. The VOB includes a title plus the beginning of the another one. The file is still playing, but VLC resets the timer to 0 when the new Title starts, and start counting again. Approximately the VOB plays during 24:02, but VLC reports it is 1:17 in length. In spite of it is counting more on the timer.

    The same oddity when muxing the mpeg in the authoring software.
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    I have just checked on the standalone player, and the info display shows data is running correctly anyway during playback. There is a bitrate meter, and in spite of that mediainfo reports higher bitrate, the player info shows the correct average bitrates, it is streaming around 5.5-6.0. Never really goes above 6.0. The time for each title is correct too. I have a suspicion anyway that the time mediainfo reports is actually the lenth of the part of the second title that is stored in the same vob as the first title. Because that part is also about 1:17.

    I have burnt the DVD at 8x speed onto Verbatim 16x printable DVD-R. I also tested on a Fujitsu 4xDVD-RW, the same problem, and interestigly it also sucks at the same place, around 4:00 during playback. I guess it is not a DVD media error then, or is it?
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    Is it possible to have more than one title in a single vob? Do you mean chapter?
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    I put 6 video clips on the timeline, and DVD styler refers to them as Titles. You can add them as Chapters, but in my case it is not like that, I need it this way. In spite of it, it compiles them into various vobs, sometimes putting a part of it to one, and the remaining part to the next. Womble may be different, I did not check. In case of DVD styler only the last vob has correct timing info in Mediainfo.

    Isn't it possible that I gave too big headroom for the peakig, setting max bitrate to 8000 when average is only 5644? Maybe at certain moments the bitrate jumps high and the player cannot handle such a big leap? I read somewhere that 5-10% headroom is useful, but I thought I set it as high as possible for the quality to be at the maximum for these file sizes.
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    I use 9000 kbps
    in AVStoDVD without issues. What is the complete file list for this dvd? Can you post a Windows explorer view of
    The video-ts folder
    in details view
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    No problem having multiple titles in a series of the same vts. I once authored a dvd with over 20 single titles .

    The avg bitrate should also not be an issue.

    The authoring process is quite complicated using 3 different mpeg-2 encoders even if no change occurs in the later ones (if you have dvd-compliant assets)

    Avstodvd can handle multiple titles and create a simple menu.

    There are other 'oddities' in your mediainfo report. The bits per pixel kinda stands out.

    Would it be possible to upload two titles and the intro and I'll take a closer look.
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  10. I would start by rendering them as MPEG2 from Vegas and use those in DVDStyler and see if the error persist (If you're working with NTSC you may have to force using "Copy" for the video).
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    This is the DVD video folder:

    Image
    [Attachment 50549 - Click to enlarge]
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    I tried changing the HDMI cable on the DVD player, and oddly now it works, no playback error. But I still find it strange why the Sony played my friend's DVD without issue even with the first cable, and both of my DVD's with error?
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    I get an intermittent issue with my Sony HDDRecorder/DVD Player with a loss of signal over HDMI.

    I think it's down to a build up of heat since once the player cools down all is well again (til the next time)

    In your case the player could be generating more heat since it struggles to read those disks.

    I changed my HDMI input - not the actual cable - and that solved it for a while and, possibly, your old cable may work tomorrow when the heat has cooled.

    It points to either an authoring issue - my comment about the bits per pixel still stands - and/or a burn issue.

    What program do you use for that ?
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    I author to iso and burn with image burn. Onto Verbatim DVD-R printable 16x

    when I author with Womble, that bits per pixel is significantly lower, a value around 0.4 or even lower. But in that case the bitrate count is also correct.

    I am thinking about rendering new m2v-s at 7000kb/s max, and author them with Womble. My only problem is that when I load those vobs that it creates back to the Vegas Project, you can see that the audio is shifted compared to the position of the project audio with about 40ms. In case of DVD Styler, the shift is significantly less, around 5ms.
    Last edited by Bencuri; 15th Oct 2019 at 19:04.
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    Today I ran a test using unmuxed files to compile the DVD from, so the original m2v that came from the mpeg encoder (HCEnc) and the wav from Vegas. The same result, that is: the bitrates in the vobs are unreally high. So in case this playback problem originates from the project source files (and not from a player problem), it can only be the encoder, that made an error. However, I remember that many years ago I used HCEnc to encode mpegs for a DVD project, and that DVD played fine on this same Sony player. Considering this, in case the m2v files are indeed incorrect in the recent case, it should be my recent settings that may cause the problem. I just want to sort out this possibility. These are my recent settings for this project, do you think there is anything that may be problematic for the player?

    Image
    [Attachment 50559 - Click to enlarge]


    Image
    [Attachment 50560 - Click to enlarge]


    Image
    [Attachment 50561 - Click to enlarge]


    Image
    [Attachment 50562 - Click to enlarge]


    Image
    [Attachment 50563 - Click to enlarge]
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    It's quite difficult to track down potential issues. But one such issue in your first screen-cap is that you do not appear to be making dvd-compliant assets. Import these at an actual authoring stage and re-encoding will take place. And I really do not understand a 12 2 GOP.

    Like I already stated, and since this source, at 1080 I/P, is not dvd-compliant, is to upload two such original HD samples and, but may not be required, an into, especially if it is not authored from these HD sources, and one can then take a closer look.

    Yet avstodvd, in my experience of the s/w, can take a non-compliant HD source and still author compliant dvd assets beit mpeg2, folders or whatever.
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    The mpeg that the encoder creates is 720x576, not 1080p, and the gop is m=3 i=12 (2B frames as the setting says and 12 length). This is the same in case of my friend's DVD as well, that played without issues. HCEnc reports automatically in case the result will not be DVD compliant, in my case it found everything okay. Also DVD lab pro reports incompatibility, it found no problem.

    If this gop is not compliant, what could be compliant?
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    DB83 said:
    Yet AVStoDVD, in my experience of the s/w, can take a non-compliant HD source and still author compliant dvd assets beit mpeg2, folders or whatever.

    So can Dvdstyler, it uses FFmpeg to re-encode as necessary. I'm playing around with the program myself,
    I added 4 or 5 source videos and the result was a single title set with each video starting on a new chapter.
    I didn't see any other option
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    Here is a video showing how you can add files as Titles or Chapters attached. The difference between the two is that even if they are in the same Title set, when you add clips separately as Titles, on playback, the time bar will revert to 0 when starting a new Title. When you play a group of clips as Chapters arranged under the same Title, the time bar during playback will not revert to 0 when going on the new Chapter.

    This thing differs from editor to editor I think. The way how they build a DVD structure. Some uses this structure, other uses another.

    But I think this is irrevelant now, because I doubt my mpeg are non-DVD compliant. HCEnc would warn, and the GOP structure I set was defined as compliant in various descriptions. In TMPGEnc, M3 N12 is a Standard PAL DVD GOP structure.
    Image Attached Files
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    For the record, I have no issues with 3 12.

    My issue was that I was seeing 2 12 in the images you posted above. Which is not what you initial image shows so those settings may not be what you actually used.

    Of course your final product is a compliant dvd else it would not play as such. The issue is, and always was, why it would not play as expected.
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    HCEnc doesn't ask for the usual format to be added, it asks for the number of B frames you want and the length of GOP, that's why the 2 12 value. That will result in M=3 N=12. I think this confused you.

    At the moment, since I changed the cable I experienced no issues so far, but I will redo the project in Womble to make sure the data is stored correctly on the DVD. It seems even if Mediainfo reports high bitrates, the DVD player is showing the correct bitrate values, yet I will skip the DVDStyler project for now.

    What makes me upset is that DVD lab pro doesn't produce a correct VOB either, it saves incorrect bitrate data as well. That is very upsetting because it is meant to be a professional software. But at least I have a software that can do the job.
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    I have used DVD lab pro but it was quite a few years ago so memory is low.

    I thought it did not re-encode but required compliant assets.

    The project I did had 20+ compliant titles and I specifically used this s/w because I wanted to create a dvd with a very special 'juke-box' menu.
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    Originally Posted by DB83 View Post
    I have used DVD lab pro but it was quite a few years ago so memory is low.

    I thought it did not re-encode but required compliant assets.

    The project I did had 20+ compliant titles and I specifically used this s/w because I wanted to create a dvd with a very special 'juke-box' menu.
    It's possible you are right. I encoded an mp4 @ 23.976 and it plays jerky in mpc-be. It's as if the 3:2 pulldown was not added. But then how/why does dvdauthor accept them? Something seems odd
    Looking at the VOB in Virtualdub2 seems to conform this

    If this is the case encode in AVStoDVD as mpg's and use them as assets for DVDstyler (If you really need it's elaborate authoring capability)
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    I found finally what's the problem with Mediainfo:

    When you create the DVD with a structure like:

    - multiple Titles in 1 VTS, Mediainfo reads the VOB's bitrate incorrectly.

    - 1 Tilte (it can contain multiple chapters) in 1 VTS, Mediainfo will read the VOB bitrate correctly

    That's why the info sheet has the error in my case.

    But it is irrevelant, as anyhow, I need multiple Titles as Titles in the same VTS. I hope it is only Mediainfo that has problems with it and not certain players. But according to the DVD lab pro guide this layout is DVD compliant. So I think it is only a problem for Mediainfo.
    Last edited by Bencuri; 16th Oct 2019 at 18:07.
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    I tried to reproduce it, the bitrate mediainfo states seems to be close to the addition of the two titles,
    rather than some kind of average

    I created 2 DVD compliant mpegs in AVStoDVD, 23.976 source with pulldown added to the mpg
    one @ 4500 kbps and the other @ 6500 kbps.

    Added these to my DVDstyler project with the "add file" method to give two titles in the same VTS
    and set the process mode to "copy" Ran the project and it gave me this

    Code:
    General
    Complete name                            : I:\dvd-copy\dvd3\VIDEO_TS\VTS_01_1.VOB
    Format                                   : MPEG-PS
    File size                                : 382 MiB
    Duration                                 : 4 min 44 s
    Overall bit rate mode                    : Variable
    Overall bit rate                         : 11.2 Mb/s
    
    Video
    ID                                       : 224 (0xE0)
    Format                                   : MPEG Video
    Format version                           : Version 2
    Format profile                           : Main@Main
    Format settings                          : CustomMatrix / BVOP
    Format settings, BVOP                    : Yes
    Format settings, Matrix                  : Custom
    Format settings, GOP                     : M=3, N=12
    Duration                                 : 4 min 44 s
    Bit rate mode                            : Variable
    Bit rate                                 : 10.8 Mb/s
    Maximum bit rate                         : 9 000 kb/s
    Width                                    : 720 pixels
    Height                                   : 480 pixels
    Display aspect ratio                     : 16:9
    Frame rate                               : 23.976 (24000/1001) FPS
    Color space                              : YUV
    Chroma subsampling                       : 4:2:0
    Bit depth                                : 8 bits
    Scan type                                : Progressive
    Scan order                               : 2:3 Pulldown
    Compression mode                         : Lossy
    Bits/(Pixel*Frame)                       : 1.298
    Time code of first frame                 : 00:00:00;00
    Time code source                         : Group of pictures header
    GOP, Open/Closed                         : Open
    This DVD plays fine in mpc-be, I suspect it's a mediainfo issue as you mention
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    Originally Posted by Bencuri View Post
    I found finally what's the problem with Mediainfo:

    When you create the DVD with a structure like:

    - multiple Titles in 1 VTS, Mediainfo reads the VOB's bitrate incorrectly.

    - 1 Tilte (it can contain multiple chapters) in 1 VTS, Mediainfo will read the VOB bitrate correctly

    .
    Methinks you have nailed this one. Although I created this multi-title dvd many moons ago the folders are still on one of my HDDs and, yes, mediainfo really does misquote the detail.
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    I hope the original problem was caused by the cable indeed, then. Anyway, I connected the bad cable again today, and the playback is fine so far even though. Maybe it had some connection problem in the slot or similar. I know cables sometimes do weird things, once I had a cable that didn't want to work with a camcorder at all, had to buy a new one.

    Strange though that my friend's DVD played fine in spite of it, and that has even higher bitrate. Isn't it possible that this kind of VOB causes the the player to loose the playback position in case of a connection drop-out, and the head gets stuck? VOBS with this kind of structure even cause VLC get confused. When you open one of them, as I mentioned VLC reports a false overall playback time, but the timer is counting punctually. However when the next title comes it resets to 0. But it's only when you open them separately as files.

    Tomorrow I test that I pull the cable out on playback for a second and see what happens.

    I also wonder whether the Matrix that is the default in HCEnc is suitable for DVD? Do you think it can cause problems?
    Last edited by Bencuri; 16th Oct 2019 at 20:05.
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    One way you can test HCEnc is to create the dvd solely within avstodvd but select HCenc as your encoder - it is, AFAIK, no longer the default one. I forget whether you can make any alterations to the settings of HCenc within avstodvd but then if it is not broken why try to fix it.

    The dvd I referred to above was created by mpegs encoded in my video editor but the actual authoring was then with DVD lab Pro.

    The only way a player could baulk with a dvd it can read is if the bit rate is too high. But dvd bitrates can go beyond 8000 - I tend to settle at 6000. And if it was too high the authoring program would tell you it was not compliant and re-encode regardless.
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    I have checked the settings AVStoDVD uses on mpeg creation, there are a few things where it differs from my settings, like: it uses adaptive matrix, lumagain (though I think this is not an important difference), and uses autogop and open gops. Open gops are out of question for me as I need to add chapter indexes on the authoring, so, it has to cle closed.

    Apart from the adaptive Matrix, it seems to me there is no significant difference. What I don't know is that whether the choice of Matrix affects later playability. I know that is does define quality and details, but I am not sure if it has to do anything with file playability.
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    You can undo adaptive matrix by deselecting Lumgain in the HCenc advanced settings.
    Also, you can activate closed GOP by selecting "edit encoder command parameters at runtime" in AVStoDVD and
    adding this to the input command file:
    *Closedgops
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