Seek advice regarding graphics card upgrade

[jgg]

Hi from Berlin, and Happy New Year,

I have a Lenovo ThinkStation S20 with a Xeon W3520 (4x2.66Gh) CPU, 18 Gb RAM, and an Intel 520 SSD. The graphics card is an nVidia Quadro FX1800 graphics card with 768MB GDDR3 RAM.

I generally use it for surfing, watching YouTube movies, a Blu-Ray disk every once in awhile, etc. I've had it for about 5 years now, and it works fine and is very quiet.

Now to the point: I occasionally make short videos (5-20 minutes) to send to family and friends - nothing heavy duty at all. I film them using my Sony RX1 digital camera (at 1920x1440) and then work on them using one or more of the many free editing and converting programs available.

Although there's really no pressing need to do so, I'm thinking of upgrading the graphics card. I did a bit of reading and, though maybe I'm wrong, came to understand that "workstation" graphics cards like the FX1800 are supplied with machines of this type because the owners usually run CAD and do "high-end video rendering", which apparently require special features usually found in the software for the workstation cards.

Anyway, just for something concrete to bite on, I can get a used Palit KalmX passively cooled card (PCI-e x16, 2GB GDDR5, 2x DVI, mini-HDMI) for 60 euros (about US$70) or a used NVIDIA Quadro K2000 (PCI-e x16, 2GB GDDR5, 1x DVI-I, 2x DisplayPort) for 95 euros (US$112).

Thank God, the price difference isn't the issue; I'd just like to get the card that better serves my needs.

From what I've described, (1) Does upgrading make any sense at all? and if so, (2) which of the two cards I've described is better suited to the tasks I've described?

Thank you.

[usually_quiet]

You might want to consider an NVIDIA GeForce GT 1030 card instead. These have relatively low power requirements, support the use of 2 monitors and have the ability to decode VP9 and HEVC.

There are passively cooled options if there is room for them and you think air circulation in that part of the case is good enough:
https://www.gigabyte.com/Graphics-Card/GV-N1030SL-2GL#kf
https://www.evga.com/products/product.aspx?pn=02G-P4-6332-KR
https://www.msi.com/Graphics-card/GeForce-GT-1030-2GH-LP-OC.html

[jgg]

You might want to consider an NVIDIA GeForce GT 1030 card instead. These have relatively low power requirements, support the use of 2 monitors and have the ability to decode VP9 and HEVC ...

Thank you very much for your reply. Maybe I should have mentioned that I'm 71 years old and, sorry to have to confess, not particularly "future oriented".

[flashandpan007]

1050ti is a killer for its price, but it must be a ti

[jgg]

1050ti is a killer for its price, but it must be a ti

Thanks. The only passive version available is from Palit. It has 4Gb GDDR 5 and costs about 160 €, which is twice as much as the GTX 750Ti version. Of course the smaller card only has 2Gb.

Anyway, I'll keep it in mind.

[usually_quiet]

You might want to consider an NVIDIA GeForce GT 1030 card instead. These have relatively low power requirements, support the use of 2 monitors and have the ability to decode VP9 and HEVC ...

Thank you very much for your reply. Maybe I should have mentioned that I'm 71 years old and, sorry to have to confess, not particularly "future oriented".

YouTube is already using VP9 for WebM. HEVC isn't rare now, especially for 4K videos.

[jgg]

YouTube is already using VP9 for WebM. HEVC isn't rare now, especially for 4K videos.

Thanks, but my monitor, an NEC PA272W, doesn't have 4K capability.

I've just looked at a couple of "4K" YouTube vids, and the maximum I'm offered is 1440p.

[jagabo]

No video card is going to help your video rendering if your software doesn't support it. See what your software supports first.

If you only make occasional 5 to 20 minute videos do you really care how fast you encode?

And all the hardware encoders deliver lower quality than the better (free) software encoders.

[usually_quiet]

YouTube is already using VP9 for WebM. HEVC isn't rare now, especially for 4K videos.

Thanks, but my monitor, an NEC PA272W, doesn't have 4K capability.

I've just looked at a couple of "4K" YouTube vids, and the maximum I'm offered is 1440p.

I own a Dell S2718HN 1080p monitor which does accept 2160p video. (The monitor itself can downscale UHD input.) My Internet connection is too slow to stream UHD video, so to test the monitor and my i5 processor's performance I had to download UHD videos for testing. Software decoding works well enough for 2160p VP9, but not 2160p HEVC. However, having the ability to use GPU assisted decoding for both would still be useful to take the burden off the CPU.

I have also downloaded some HD videos encoded with VP9 from OTA broadcasters to watch a missed episode of some TV shows. YouTube is supposedly encoding HD and QHD (1440p) video with VP9 if it is heavily viewed.

[pandy]

Anyway, I'll keep it in mind.

1050 use one one the most recent NVidia chips and as such offer more than decent hardware video encoder and decoder.

[lordsmurf]

I'm extremely happy with the Intel HD 530 graphics built into the i7-6700K using an Asrock board. I do some pretty intense video editing and video restoration on this system. I do not want the heat or wind-tunnel noise from a whizbang fancy graphics card. Those are for gamers, not serious work.

Point is, integrated works well these days.
And you can get cheapo $50-range cards (+/- $25) that do just as well, if integrated isn't an option.
The above NVIDIA GeForce GT 1030 looks to be such a card.

[flashandpan007]

newer cards are semi passive cooled, the fans only spin when needed

[Bernix]

You might want to consider an NVIDIA GeForce GT 1030 card instead. These have relatively low power requirements, support the use of 2 monitors and have the ability to decode VP9 and HEVC.

Unfortunately it is exception from the rule. It is Pascal card, but doesn't support pascal features for encoding decoding that others Nvidia Pascal (10) offer.
Here is citation from wikipedia:

The Nvidia gt 1030 does not support nvenc. It is a gp108 chip.

<- but citation needed
AAAAh now I see, you suggest it as decoder. Then O.K. . But to be able also encoding would be also important.

EDIT: Good page to compare graphics card is here, you have in the link compared your card and 1030 HERE
And I wouldn't buy used card. And the price for card you mentioned, is in my country almost same for this but new card.

Bernix

[usually_quiet]

You might want to consider an NVIDIA GeForce GT 1030 card instead. These have relatively low power requirements, support the use of 2 monitors and have the ability to decode VP9 and HEVC.

Unfortunately it is exception from the rule. It is Pascal card, but doesn't support pascal features for encoding decoding that others Nvidia Pascal (10) offer.
Here is citation from wikipedia:

The Nvidia gt 1030 does not support nvenc. It is a gp108 chip.

<- but citation needed
AAAAh now I see, you suggest it as decoder. Then O.K. . But to be able also encoding would be also important.

EDIT: Good page to compare graphics card is here, you have in the link compared your card and 1030 HERE
And I wouldn't buy used card. And the price for card you mentioned, is in my country almost same for this but new card.

Bernix

Yes, I suggested a GT 1030 because jgg wants an inexpensive, low-wattage video card and watches a lot of YouTube video. I thought that having hardware decoding available for the newer web video formats could be helpful to someone who watches a lot of video online, but apparently, he doesn't care about having a video card which is able to decode VP9 or HEVC.

Now to the point: I occasionally make short videos (5-20 minutes) to send to family and friends - nothing heavy duty at all. I film them using my Sony RX1 digital camera (at 1920x1440) and then work on them using one or more of the many free editing and converting programs available.

I had read the GT 1030 doesn't provide NVENC but jgg is using free software for editing and only producing short clips. As jagabo already noted, speeding up video encoding with NVENC won't make a huge difference for his type of use, and may or may not be possible with his editor. We don't know what software he uses.

[Bernix]

Hi Usually_quiet,
I noticed this during writing and therefore I made bold text to be it more visible. I didn't want to delete it all.
Nvenc is supported in many free software but not in some very popular (Handbrake, Vidcoder)
And last thing - do something on CPU like deinterlace, denoise etc, advantage of nvenc is less noticeable.

Bernix

[jgg]

... And I wouldn't buy used card. And the price for card you mentioned, is in my country almost same for this but new card.

Thanks for your feedback, but I actually mentioned two cards:
"...I can get a used Palit KalmX passively cooled card (PCI-e x16, 2GB GDDR5, 2x DVI, mini-HDMI) for 60 euros (about US$70) or a used NVIDIA Quadro K2000 (PCI-e x16, 2GB GDDR5, 1x DVI-I, 2x DisplayPort) for 95 euros (US$112)."

Which one are you talking about? Here in Germany, it's rather hard to even find the Palit GTX 750ti card new. And the cheapest new K2000 costs €300.

And as for my current card, the Quadro FX1800, I guess I don't really need to compare it with anything; I know it's very old and underpowered by current standards.

Furthermore, I don't think nVidia is making any new drivers for it (the last one was at the end of Oct 2016). This is one of the main reasons I want to replace it, although it functions perfectly well and has handled anything I've thrown at it.

[jgg]

newer cards are semi passive cooled, the fans only spin when needed

Thanks. I didn't know this. I guess I'll have to dig a bit deeper.

[jgg]

... Yes, I suggested a GT 1030 because jgg wants an inexpensive, low-wattage video card and watches a lot of YouTube video.

Thanks for your message. Actually, "watches a lot of YouTube video" isn't really accurate; I'd say two hours a week is max.

"... jgg is using free software for editing and only producing short clips. As jagabo already noted, speeding up video encoding with NVENC won't make a huge difference for his type of use, and may or may not be possible with his editor. We don't know what software he uses.

I do have one "paid" program: Corel VideoStudio 10.5 Ultimate, which I got for €21 euros or so. I use it 2-3 times a month.

For the very simple stuff I do, I use an old version (1.4.0) of X-Win-FF and the newest versions of Handbrake, VidCoder, VidCutter, and Video to Video, depending on what I'm trying to do.

In any case, they're films that only a family member would like, or even tolerate.

By the way, I very much appreciate the time all of you have taken to respond to my post.

[lordsmurf]

newer cards are semi passive cooled, the fans only spin when needed

It still generates needless heat. That may be fine if you live in cold, but it's hell if you live in a hot area -- ie, paying to heat up room (computer) AND paying to cool down room (AC), while you sit a sweat yourself trying to do work. Only 3 months are cold, while 9 are not.

So "as needed" fans = 24/7.

[Bernix]

Don't know how semi passive is meant. Probably as on my card. There are two fans for active cooling. And in software I can choose 3d active fan on/off. Turned ON it means it starts fans when temperature reaches about 55 degree of celsius. But i have it on OFF because of inside temperature and it keeps higher temperature when ON is turned on.
So I have about 20% of fans till 56 degree of celsius is reached. Even if temperature is about 30 degrees. And temperatures in case and gpu are much better.

Add to Palit, you didn't mentioned what series. So I was wrong as usual. Tell me what exactly GPU you can buy (Palit).
Here is comparison of your card and Quadro K2000 Check if improvement is good einough for you. Effective speed and users benchmarks.

Bernix

[jgg]

It still generates needless heat ...

Thanks very much for the info. Then I guess I'll stick to the passive cards, which means I'll have to find an alternative to the K2000.

[usually_quiet]

... Yes, I suggested a GT 1030 because jgg wants an inexpensive, low-wattage video card and watches a lot of YouTube video.

Thanks for your message. Actually, "watches a lot of YouTube video" isn't really accurate; I'd say two hours a week is max.

That is more YouTube video than I watch.

"... jgg is using free software for editing and only producing short clips. As jagabo already noted, speeding up video encoding with NVENC won't make a huge difference for his type of use, and may or may not be possible with his editor. We don't know what software he uses.

I do have one "paid" program: Corel VideoStudio 10.5 Ultimate, which I got for €21 euros or so. I use it 2-3 times a month.

For the very simple stuff I do, I use an old version (1.4.0) of X-Win-FF and the newest versions of Handbrake, VidCoder, VidCutter, and Video to Video, depending on what I'm trying to do.

In any case, they're films that only a family member would like, or even tolerate.

By the way, I very much appreciate the time all of you have taken to respond to my post.

Bernix wrote that Handbrake and VidCoder don't use NVENC. The product page for Corel VideoStudio X10.5 Ultimate mentioned Intel Quick Sync, but not NVENC. I didn't find any mention of NVENC for VidCutter of Video to Video. It doesn't look like NVENC will be useful to you with the software that you use at present.

[jgg]

Add to Palit, you didn't mentioned what series. So I was wrong as usual. Tell me what exactly GPU you can buy (Palit).

Thanks for your reply.

Here's the card I was referring to.
http://www.palit.com/palit/vgapro.php?id=2378

[jgg]

...It doesn't look like NVENC will be useful to you with the software that you use at present.

OK, thanks.

[Bernix]

It seems to me better GTX 750 ti then Quadro k2000 Here is comparison of them
It seems the 750ti is twice better than ordinary Quadro K2000, but you have to be sure it is plain 2000. Also in test is GTX 750ti with active cooler, don't know how much is it handicap to have just passive, but I think not much.
I'm not expert but you can get new GT 1030 for less than 78 euro. Which is bit slower, but also passive cooling and new. Better then used. GT1030 vs GTX750 HERE
And I asked to specify what Palit because KalmX name share several series from Palit.
Software I know supporting NVENC encoding both h264 and h265 Avidemux and Hybrid, or FFmpeg of course. Player supported decoding both also Potplayer.
But as mentioned earlier, 1030 supports only decoding.
pros for 750 ti bit faster TDP 60W
pros for 1030 lower energy consumption TDP 35W

Just be sure the card can run on your Motherboard etc.

Bernix

[usually_quiet]

But as mentioned earlier, 1030 supports only decoding.
pros for 750 ti bit faster TDP 60W
pros for 1030 lower energy consumption TDP 35W

Just be sure the card can run on your Motherboard etc.

Bernix

The GT 1030 also decodes more types of video than the GTX 750 ti. The GTX 750 ti can drive more monitors than a GT 1030. Should "faster" be much of a consideration for those not playing video games on their PC?

[flashandpan007]

newer cards are semi passive cooled, the fans only spin when needed

It still generates needless heat. That may be fine if you live in cold, but it's hell if you live in a hot area -- ie, paying to heat up room (computer) AND paying to cool down room (AC), while you sit a sweat yourself trying to do work. Only 3 months are cold, while 9 are not.

So "as needed" fans = 24/7.

It does not generate needless heat. I may be even more efficient in everyday use!
Only if you force the 1050ti, it needs probably more power, like gaming.
I have already seen models without an power connector -> bus powered -> only power from bus is used -> PCIe -> efficient power design of the graphic processor

Let's summarize:

• 1050ti is the best choice for the money
• in everyday use it is passively cooled
• only if you game the fan may spin
• If the fan may spin, it will not spin high, only low. -> quiet

-> Computer tech has come a long way!

I'm out on this thread, I was giving tips on the latest refresh (-> ti) on Nvidia, but some think that there's a need for recommending outdated old stuff for jgg, because this and that is bad of the 1050ti. It IS the newest evolution of nvidia graphic cards.
I simply can't see how people, like jgg waste their money for hopeless outdated hardware. The hardware is not getting younger, as far as I remember.

Last but not least: I was also thinking that a huge cooler (passive cooling) is great, but I tested it and got disappointed.
If you don't have any airflow, it will be always heat in the case.
For quiet airflow simply use quiet big PWM fans and let them run on their minimum, then it's always cold in your case.

[flashandpan007]

https://www.caseking.de/msi-geforce-gtx-1050-ti-gaming-4g-4096-mb-gddr5-gcmc-163.html

Der Shop ist in Berlin, da kannst du auch vor Ort kaufen
https://www.caseking.de/kontaktformular

[Bernix]

For quiet airflow simply use quiet big PWM fans and let them run on their minimum, then it's always cold in your case.

I think is better to use some program to control fans in case. I have asus, so using Fan Xpert, there are also 3rd party softwares for brands that do not developed its own software, advantage is, that heat is not acumulated in some parts of case. The program run test of all fans CPU, Case (motherboard) and makes profiles, silent, normal end with full speed. So the speed of fans and temperatures are optimal.

Bernix

[flashandpan007]

Yes, I agree. There are several ways to do control fans and get quiet, fans. I can‘t hear any here