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  1. Member
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    After tons of research I'm settling on buying a capture device to capture HDMI at a minimum of 60FPS, ideally one which also supports composite.

    My friend recommended the Black Magic Intenity, but it requires a PC or Mac and my Mac doesn't support any software made later than OS 10.7.5.

    I don't have a PC with a high enough spec to capture using a computer and I can't upgrade my mac in order to use the Black Magic Intensity due to conflicts in software I have which only run on 10.7.5.

    So I've spent almost 2 years coming back to this, had my heart set on the Intensity, but can't risk upgrading my mac to capture with it it as its only supported on OS later than 10.7.5.

    Does anyone know of a prestige, or suitable device similar to this, which supports composite video and HDMI in at 60FPS, capturing to USB or HD? If so I would like to hear if any of the brands out there running as stand alone could achieve this.
    I intend to rip Atari ST demos which are very fast visuals, some above 60-80FPS, but can't afford to invest time in calibrating screen capture software & I"m not sure my hardware could support it. People on here have been super awesome in helping me so far (MASSIVE THANKS TO YOU JAGABO, you was a great help recently in figuring out how to achieve this via screen capture, if yr reading this, thanks once more, you really helped me out)

    I also want to record circuit bent AV toys, to create wild glitchy effects for a show I"m working on. Then I could also back up my betamax tapes + more using the same device, but compatibility is preventing me from buying it due to me OS problem (if I upgrade, ableton, dragon frame, all those apps will likely stop working properly).

    I like the Black Magic Intensity coz its a high frame rate, well supported for HDMI & Composite, recommended by a friend who works in AV. But does anything else compare to it which is stand alone/captured to USB or a HD?
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  2. Member
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    You can see if one of these Magewell capture cards are right for you

    USB Capture HDMI 4K Plus
    USB Capture HDMI Plus
    USB Capture HDMI Gen 2
    USB Capture DVI Plus
    USB Capture AIO

    I do have a PCIe version for over a year and I am a satisfied client. The cards are of excellent quality, do have excellent features and work almost flawless. The DVI version as hdmi and component,the AIO version do have all the possible connections, the others do have only hdmi. And they are plug and play, and do work with windows, mac and linux.They are expensive however.
    Last edited by FLP437; 9th Dec 2017 at 21:21.
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  3. Member
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    You probably need separate devices for capturing composite video and HDMI. An SD capture device with a 3D comb filter would be best for composite video captures, but I don't know of a stand-alone capture device with a 3D comb filter for composite video capture. Not many capture devices with a 3D comb filter are still being made in 2017.

    I can only find two stand-alone capture devices (AVerMedia Live Gamer Portable 2 and AVerMedia Live Gamer Portable 2 Plus) which capture 1080p60 as 1080p60, but they only capture via HDMI and can only record video on microSDHC Class 10 cards.

    All of the Magewell devices mentioned above are supposed to be excellent but need to be connected to a computer to capture anything. Also, FLP437 mentioned in another thread (where he wrote about his experiences with the Magewell Pro Capture HDMI) that Magewell did not implement the advanced time-base correction (TBC) with frame synchronization or 3D comb filter that are supported by one of the chips used to make that card.
    Ignore list: hello_hello, tried, TechLord
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  4. Member
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    Cheers 'usually quiet'
    Yeah I looked into the Avermedia capture devices in stand alone. I had a check list to eliminate each model I was researching & those we're close to suit my needs, I can't remember exactly what it was which made me steer away from them (where that list went is a mystery!) But yeah, they we're the only models which we're anything close to what I hope exists.

    Thanks for the headsup about the Magewell cards FLP437. I haven't had chance to spend a good few hours on this like I prefer to, but I've been looking them up briefly and they look really good, but unfortunately a bit above my budget. Perhaps in months to come I could fork out but its looking like the black magic intensity might be the best budget range for now to achieve this.

    Ideally I want a stand alone device as my PC isn't up to scratch & I've read that my mac OS won't support most hardware, unless theres a way my mac running on 10.7.5 (the OS from 2012) can support such a device. But thanks for suggesting the Magewell, compatibility wise that would be just what I need, although it'd be an investment, so weighing it up, if my OS can't run with the black magic intensity, I might buy my Brother's PC which is a nice spec & save up for the black magic so I can benefit from the investment a bit further.

    Thanks for the tips peeps, theres so much to know in the world of video capturing & I've learnt a hell of a lot here
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  5. There aren't many HDMI capture devices because virtually all HDMI sources are HDCP protected. If a company produces a device that decrypts those sources and records them Intel (HDMI/HDCP license violation) and Hollywood (copyright violation) will send an army of lawyers to destroy them. If the device doesn't record HDCP protected sources the return rate is very high because most people have no idea what HDCP is, they just see that the device doesn't work. Only companies based in China can get away with producing HDCP-ignoring devices, and only companies that operate below the radar can get them out to the rest of the world (before the lawyers catch up to them).
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  6. Member
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    Originally Posted by jagabo View Post
    There aren't many HDMI capture devices because virtually all HDMI sources are HDCP protected. If a company produces a device that decrypts those sources and records them Intel (HDMI/HDCP license violation) and Hollywood (copyright violation) will send an army of lawyers to destroy them. If the device doesn't record HDCP protected sources the return rate is very high because most people have no idea what HDCP is, they just see that the device doesn't work. Only companies based in China can get away with producing HDCP-ignoring devices, and only companies that operate below the radar can get them out to the rest of the world (before the lawyers catch up to them).
    Cheers Jagabo.

    I understand what yr saying there. For my purposes, I won't be capturing anything copyrighted as its purely for my own betamax, vhs & Atari ST Demos (converting the RF signal to composite into the device, or HDMI out from my laptop running an emulator). Hopefully I should be ok, I'm also going to capture glitchy visuals with it using AV based toys I'm circuit bending, so theres little I'd be risking violation with.

    If I did wish to capture something copyrighted (I admit I never knew the term HDCP but knew there was a format or data type which prevents copying), I heard you can use a HDMI splitter to bypass copyright laws. Funnily enough, I heard this whilst researching Avermedia devices. Not sure if the warning is a practical advertisement to let people know how to do it! It's mentioned here http://www.avermedia.com/gaming/product/game_capture/live_gamer_portable
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  7. That warning is pretty funny. By the way, I don't think you'll have much luck finding a capture device that works with non-standard frame rates like 80 fps.
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  8. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    What you have to worry about with ANALOG sources is Macrovision encoding (as opposed to HDCP which works with digital HD sources). It will mess up your signal stability and gain-sensing circuits.
    What you need to fix MV is something that strips the MV signal and replaces it with a clean, regular sync. That usually means a TBC (time-base corrector), as one of the means that it uses to stabilize is sync stripping & resynthesis.

    Scott
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  9. Macrovision will generally only apply to VHS and DVD. And the latter is better decrypted, then copied or converted.
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  10. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Macrovision applies to betamax and vhs, 2 of the 3 categories of things he cited as needing to transfer...sounds pretty pertinent. Unless those vhs/beta are all camera-originated home movies (his post wasn't clear about that).

    Scott
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  11. Member
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    Originally Posted by jagabo View Post
    That warning is pretty funny. By the way, I don't think you'll have much luck finding a capture device that works with non-standard frame rates like 80 fps.
    That is certainly true for every consumer capture device I can remember looking at, but there are pro devices which are less constrained. The specs for a couple of Magewell PCI-e cards (Pro Capture HDMI & Pro Capture DVI) say they can capture 1920x1080 at approximately 80fps, and lower resolutions at even higher frame rates. ...but as mentioned elsewhere in this thread they don't fit within Neil-Betamax budget and are not stand-alone devices.
    Ignore list: hello_hello, tried, TechLord
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    Thanks peeps. I think an all rounder device for my needs is pretty far fetched to find, unless I go for something on the pro industry level like a magewell product.
    Macrovision is new to me, thanks for mentioning that. I might save up for something better, as I'm planning to buy a high spec PC from my Brother which could be compatible & decent enough to support a good PCI capture device, that would give me more to work with.
    But if the non standard frame rate captures don't distort too badly, for my purpose it might not be such as issue.
    I want to capture HDMI out from a laptop which will be capturing Atari ST Demo's (emulated using a Atari ST emulator) at anything between 60-80fps.
    But then I also want to capture Betamax and VHS which are home recordings, animations I did when I was a wee bit younger.

    It's not crucial it's 98%+ accurate, but just enough not to stand out as the end result will be - Visuals displayed on a projector in a night club (Atari ST Demo & recordings from AV based toys I've 'circuit bent'/tampered with to create flashy visual effects). I will likely make small video files from good footage to VJ with using archaos or resolume. Or perhaps just a long running video I have playing in the back whilst I play my music, for a performance piece.

    I don't intend on capturing DVD or commercial VHS footage, although that would be a bonus to back up a lot of VHS I have so I can sell them on or give away & make some space in the house without loosing out on what I have. The black magic intensity seems to be ok for both purposes. As 60fps maximum with HDMI in I'd hope that I wouldn't experience unsightly distortion whilst capturing a non standard frame rate like 70fps when capturing Atari ST demos. I'm imagining that if the frame rate isn't standard it would display lines or distorted frames on play back. I think it has a TBC included, it's manufactured to be adjusted to support various definitions and frame rates for composite and digital in, but the result I'd get from it might not be accurate enough or pleasing to watch from what I understand, since capturing at 60fps with a 70 or 80fps video might not give good results.

    If digitally the intensity is no good for this purpose, I'd hope I could use it for VHS & Betamax in SD composite, then I'd look into screen capturing again with a better machine in order to capture the Atari ST demos. It seems that stand alone devices don't exist for my needs on this one. Looking clearer as to which direction to go though. Thanks for all your support on this everyone
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  13. Originally Posted by Neil-Betamax View Post
    But if the non standard frame rate captures don't distort too badly, for my purpose it might not be such as issue.
    If the signal is really 80 fps it's most likely the capture device won't sync and will refuse to capture.

    Originally Posted by Neil-Betamax View Post
    I want to capture HDMI out from a laptop which will be capturing Atari ST Demo's (emulated using a Atari ST emulator) at anything between 60-80fps.
    Are you sure the HDMI output is really 80 fps? More likely the emulator is generating 80 fps but the HDMI output is 60 fps -- you simply don't see 20 of the frames every second.
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    I'm not sure to be honest. If HDMI outputs are 60fps, like you say if the source is 80fps or something non standard I'd imagine that the capture device would capture what ever I'm seeing with the naked eye on the screen. So if the image is clear enough and doesn't distort then I think I'd be good to go. This clears a lot up.
    If the HDMI out was at 80fps for example, I'd have wondered if frames would be skipped, or if the result would be partial frames or distorted frames which could look noticably wrong.
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    I bought a black magic intensity! I got a good deal so thought I better snap it up while I had chance. 140 & p&p.
    I'll feed back my results on here. As the HDMI out from my laptop handles various definitions I think I'll be safe to record with it and then I'll have something good for analogue too, hope it all goes well thanks for all your help everyone!
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  16. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Just hope that your laptop doesn't add HDCP to the HDMI output feed (most Macs do), or you can have it off for certain kinds of material. Its presence would make capturing fail.

    Scott
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  17. Originally Posted by Neil-Betamax View Post
    I bought a black magic intensity! I got a good deal so thought I better snap it up while I had chance. 140 & p&p.
    I'll feed back my results on here. As the HDMI out from my laptop handles various definitions I think I'll be safe to record with it and then I'll have something good for analogue too, hope it all goes well thanks for all your help everyone!
    I'm looking forward to hearing about your experience with the BMIP. But FYI, it's one of the most finicky capture devices. It will not work with many inputs. And, as mentioned, will not capture anything protected by HDCP (cable/satellite TV, DVD, Blu-ray, many game consoles, etc.). Of course, HDCP is a problem for most HDMI capture devices and it's easily worked around with an (illegal) splitter that strips HDCP.
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