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  1. I transferred some .mov files from my iphone to my laptop using Dropbox. In Dropbox, there is a green check meaning the file is completely transferred. When I open Dropbox on my iphone, I can access the .mov files. However, when I open Dropbox on my Windows 7 laptop, some .mov files work but some .mov files only have audio but no video. What is the issue?
    Last edited by jyeh74; 9th Oct 2017 at 01:12.
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  2. Member
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    If you have FFDshow you probably need the haali splitter, or LAV filters which replaces both the splitter and FFDshow.
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  3. I do have FFDshow. But the .mov files dating from Sept. are fine. I noticed it is all the .mov files dating from Oct 1 and on, do not play video. The Oct .mov files - the thumbnails don't have the "preview picture" and have the generic icon, but all the Sept. .mov files have the thumbnail. Under "Tools" and "folder options" and "view" I unchecked "Always show icons, never thumbnails". But it only applied this to the Sept .mov files and not the Oct .mov files. The Oct .mov files still show an icon. How do I make them all show thumbnail?


    Did something on the iphone change on all .mov dating from Oct 1 on, that causes it not to be able to play video/audio and only show the icon in Windows 7?
    Last edited by jyeh74; 9th Oct 2017 at 02:01.
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    Could be that they use a different video codec which the outdated ffdshow does not support anymore, but LAV Filters may.

    Always show a MediaInfo report when asking questions about suspicious clips.
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  5. Installed LAV filter and uninstalled FFDShow and now can view the oct .mov files on my laptop. Thanks!

    However, that still doesn't explain why my settings show thumbnails for all the sept .mov but show icons for the oct .mov. I tried restarting the computer and dragging the files to the desktop out of dropbox but the oct .mov still show icons. This icon issue only applies to the oct .mov files. The sept .mov correctly show thumbnails. I can't get the oct .mov files to show thumbnails. Help?
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    I don't know which constraints the Windows Explorer thumbnailer has, for which formats (content as well as container) it may be picky; a different codec may also mean different GOP sizes, new obstacles retrieving a random frame instead of playing a clip from the beginning; even a lack of keyframe indexes may be a reason to fail. I experience the same: Freshly encoded videos in MP4 or MKV containers don't have a preview, despite perfectly valid settings, right next to others where it works. Blame Microsoft...
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  7. Originally Posted by LigH.de View Post
    I don't know which constraints the Windows Explorer thumbnailer has, for which formats (content as well as container) it may be picky; a different codec may also mean different GOP sizes, new obstacles retrieving a random frame instead of playing a clip from the beginning; even a lack of keyframe indexes may be a reason to fail. I experience the same: Freshly encoded videos in MP4 or MKV containers don't have a preview, despite perfectly valid settings, right next to others where it works. Blame Microsoft...
    I have no idea what you just stated. But I donít have mp4 or mkv, only mov.

    Can someone shoot a video with their iPhone, transfer it to their laptop and see if Windows also shows an icon for the mov file?
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    In the meantime, you could create MediaInfo reports of one that works and another which doesn't.
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  9. Originally Posted by LigH.de View Post
    In the meantime, you could create MediaInfo reports of one that works and another which doesn't.
    I have never used MediaInfo. But let's see if this works. I opened both mov files and exported both, as a text. I named one "Thumbnail" for the sept mov files that show thumbnails and I named one "Icon" for the oct mov files that don't show thumbails.
    Image Attached Files
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    Thumbnail:

    Code:
    Video
    ID                                       : 1
    Format                                   : AVC
    Format/Info                              : Advanced Video Codec
    Format profile                           : High@L4
    Format settings                          : CABAC / 1 Ref Frames
    Format settings, CABAC                   : Yes
    Format settings, RefFrames               : 1 frame
    Format settings, GOP                     : M=1, N=15
    Codec ID                                 : avc1
    Codec ID/Info                            : Advanced Video Coding
    ...
    Icon:
    Code:
    Video
    ID                                       : 1
    Format                                   : HEVC
    Format/Info                              : High Efficiency Video Coding
    Format profile                           : Main@L4@Main
    Codec ID                                 : hvc1
    Codec ID/Info                            : High Efficiency Video Coding
    ...
    So there is at least a difference between the video codecs (AVC vs. HEVC). Seems the indexer is not able to handle HEVC in MOV just as easily as AVC in MOV.

    Why? ó Ask Microsoft. LAV Filters are probably not to be blamed, as the movies play. Maybe the indexer skips a file when seeking to a specific frame takes too long (the video has to be decoded from the previous GOP start to the desired seek position, which takes a lot longer for HEVC than for AVC); just a guess.
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  11. So does that mean from now on, all my videos shot from my iPhone wonít show thumbnails when I transfer them to my computer?

    Apple!!!! Why????
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    RTFM if you can switch between HEVC and AVC when recording videos in your mobile device.

    HEVC is encoded more efficiently, should be able to require less space at a similar quality. But it requires also a lot more computing power. Would probably drain your battery faster.
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  13. Both codecs should play. Which player are you using to play them back with? Try using VLC (portable edition).
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  14. Windows media player is my preferred. The issue now is with icons vs thumbnails. The new videos only show icons in Windows.
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  15. Have you associated the files with a player (right-click, Open With)?
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    That won't be relevant for the thumbnail preview feature as a Windows Explorer extension. It supports all displayable video formats, more or less; but there are restrictions you may not be able to specify easily. Could be a timing problem. Could be a problem with the decoded colorspace not being converted to RGB with default filters. I know videos which appear distorted in the thumbnail preview but play correctly in media players. Some little details are handled differently in the thumbnail extension, compared to a generic DirectShow player.
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  17. If it won't associate with anything and show a picture then the codec is missing. The file can't be decoded. Is that not so?
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    No. Whether you associated a filename extension with an application should not matter much. And both AVC MOV and HEVC MOV files are *.mov, so they are associated with the same application. The fact that thumbnails are displayed for AVC MOV, but not for HEVC MOV, proves that not the association of the extension is relevant, but the content format.

    The "codec" (or more precisely: DirectShow splitter for MOV and DirectShow decoder for AVC and HEVC) is installed and working, as the thread starter confirmed that both files play in WMP.

    The thumbnail extension will possibly use DirectShow as well. Or Media Foundation. I don't know for sure. But support in a DirectShow player alone is obviously not sufficient for the thumbnail feature.
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  19. Ah. Thanks for that.
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  20. Originally Posted by transporterfan View Post
    I just tried this. It did not work.
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  21. Originally Posted by LigH.de View Post
    That won't be relevant for the thumbnail preview feature as a Windows Explorer extension. It supports all displayable video formats, more or less; but there are restrictions you may not be able to specify easily. Could be a timing problem. Could be a problem with the decoded colorspace not being converted to RGB with default filters. I know videos which appear distorted in the thumbnail preview but play correctly in media players. Some little details are handled differently in the thumbnail extension, compared to a generic DirectShow player.
    I decided to move both mov files to my external HD. I wanted to see how these files would work with my work laptop, which is running on Win 10. Surprisingly, both mov files show thumbnails on my Win 10 laptop. I donít even have LAV Filter installed on my Win 10 work laptop and all the mov files play in WMP!!!!!!

    So does the issue have to do with Win 7 not being able to read thumbnails on the "icon" mov file (essentially any video shot on my iphone and transferred to my Win 7 laptop after October 1). Win 10 has no problems but the Win 7 has problems. Confused.....
    Last edited by jyeh74; 9th Oct 2017 at 14:05.
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  22. its because win10 has the codecs that win 7 doesn't.. thats why you need codecs or additional software for the latter
    Last edited by teodz1984; 9th Oct 2017 at 15:25.
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  23. But the codecs donít affect the way they show thumbnails versus icons in Win 7. They only affect whether or not they actually play the video.

    The icon versus thumbnail issue in window 7 for MOV files after October 1 is still a mystery.
    Last edited by jyeh74; 9th Oct 2017 at 15:00.
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  24. Originally Posted by teodz1984 View Post
    Not sure if I am doing this correctly but I installed it. Dragged the mov file to the application. Nothing happened.
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  25. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Here's the answer:

    Apple in one of their recent updates changed their capture encoding engine such that photos & videos default to being encoded in HEVC (hevc codec in MOV/MP4 for vid and hevc codec in HEIF pic format for photo). This was touted as a great space/quality saver. Supposedly, if you told the Apple apps that you were copying to other recent Apple devices, they would just copy, but if you told them to copy to apps/devices known to not support hevc, they were supposed to automatically transcode to AVC-in-MOV/MP4 or JPG, respectively.
    You uploaded to dropbox, which apple apps didn't think would be a problem so no transcoding.

    I knew the moment I read Apple's announcement that there would be issues much like this. Stupid Apple, again.
    Suspect your earlier good files were pre-update, and your later problematic files were post-update.

    On the Windows side, you have apps that use codecs to decode & play their content. Some utilize system-wide codecs using the standard system media architecture(s), some utilize other 3rd party codecs & media architectures (sometimes open source, sometimes proprietary), some use their own internal codecs and are portable, not relying on any shared mm architecture.
    Thumbnail generation will sometimes use those same codecs in those same architectures, but often will travel a separate path, using their own sets of codecs & architectures. Because often, the app doing the rendering of the thumbnails is different than standard player/editor apps. Often, they are just certain DLLs called by the file manager shell (e.g. Explorer), and rely only on stock, system codecs.

    Thus your issue is entirely logical, predictable, often reproduceable, probably even expected. And changes in base OS version would certainly account for compatibility & support differences.

    I don't use Icaros (regularly), so I couldn't tell you if it could be the best/only solution. But MS would very likely have an update coming down the pipeline that natively solved this problem, if you are patient enough to wait for it.

    If you aren't, you will have to do further analysis and trial & error to pin down satisfactory solutions for both the playback and the thumb gen decoding chains (which may well be comprised differently).

    Scott
    Last edited by Cornucopia; 9th Oct 2017 at 20:41.
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  26. Icaros only affects the way thumbnails show on your file browser... If you dont want video thumbnails, just ignore the icons,

    Actually playing the videos requires a codec like LAV FILTERS.. which should play HEVC if your pc is capable (fast enough) of playing it...
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  27. Just a thought ever try installing Quicktime and/or Itunes... these usually provide device codec and thumbnail support for your OS...
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  28. VLC or Quicktime - same results. No thumbnails for the newer mov files.......player does not matter.
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