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  1. Member
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    I've used every Microsoft O.S. since Windows 95. Most of my desktops and laptops are somewhat older, running Windows 7 Pro. Also have 8.1 and Windows 10.
    With Windows 10, it takes 10-15 minutes or longer before the hard drive stops spinning (furiously) because of updates and other crap running in the background.
    Windows 8.1 is similar, but not as bad. Now I've noticed that even my Windows 7 Pro desktops or laptops are doing the same thing..... as I sit there waiting and waiting and waiting for the hard drive light to end it's madness. I use the Windows Sidebar (CPU & Memory) to see what's going on, on all my machines, including Windows 10, and it infuriates me that I no longer have control over my computers.

    SO.... I took an older desktop that originally came with Vista, which worked fine for me, and installed WINDOWS XP PRO on it. It practically boots up instantly, no muss, no fuss and no waiting. Getting on line is still possible, although most websites won't display properly, or at all, because of the age of the browser. Some versions of Firefox still work with Windows XP, so if I wanted to, I could use Firefox as an alternative to Internet Explorer. A lot of my older Windows programs do not work properly on 8.1 and 10.

    After the release of Windows 10 in 2015, Microsoft created so many problems for older operating systems that didn't exist before, that I'm completely sick of it !
    I DON'T NEED "Anti Malware Executable" or "Windows Defender" or "Microsoft Edge" and things like "scheduled scan" and a host of other nonsensical BLOATWARE as part of the operating system.

    Obviously, things are not going to change in the near future. I've read that suport for Windows 7 will end in 2021. So Windows 7, my favorite O.S., will become the
    new "XP", obsolete and unsupported.

    I don't need to use my XP machine daily, just once in a while to run older software...... that I don't want to give up. Yes, I know Windows 10 has "Compatibility Mode", and it does work in certain circumstances, but it's just not the same, and much easier to use software that was originally designed for a specific operating system.
    Am I crazy ? definitely yes.....

    END OF RANT
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  2. Member hech54's Avatar
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    Windows 10 blows for people with less than stellar internet speed. My wife and son have 10 and my son often bitches about the internet slowing to a crawl. I tell them "Hey....find a way to turn Automatic Updates off."
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  3. Microsoft started down the path of making their OS work across multi-platforms and would not listen to the consumer in what he wants.
    I did try out W10 a little while back and found out beneath the facade, it is still fairly much works like Vista and W7.
    One just has to figure out the paths to get to where he wants to go.
    I am a tinkerer though and want to get into the control panel and C drive within it to the directories.

    One thing to remember with the newer OSs is they like to take more power and somewhat more memory to operate.
    You may need to get an edited hosts file to cut down on where your computer is trying to dial out to.

    But a question, are you still running spinner hard drives?
    If yes then you should invest in solid state drives.
    That should make it more snappier in getting everything done quickly.

    Of course you could just use W7 offline and forgo all the update junk that happens to it.
    That should make the operating system perform the way it used to.
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  4. Member
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    You could always install Firefox in XP, it still gets security updates. Panda Cloud & avast A/V still support XP
    Also don't forget the recent updates,
    kb2347290
    KB4012583
    KB4012598
    kb4022747
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  5. Member
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    You don't say which version of Windows 10 you have, but by description I guess Home and yes, that's what it does. Win 10 Pro on the other hand, allows you to defer updates until a convenient time and boot-up time is quite reasonable. My wife has Win 10 Pro, she had to have Windows for work to be fully compatible with her office system, and when I sourced a laptop for her, I went through all the information I could find on Win 10 and decided to order it with Pro, the update policy being just one reason, more expensive (!), but more convenient. She has to allow some time every few days for updates, they can't be stopped, but she does it when she can spare the time.

    I don't know all the vagaries of Win 10 having been a Linux user for a few years, but I believe I remember reading that there is an application to prevent this constant updating and bring Home more into line with Pro.
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  6. Member Cornucopia's Avatar
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    Internet - No problem with internet here.

    HD - You should be using an SSD.

    Concur, get Win10 pro.

    Older OSes - Historically, each os has required more resources to boot with similar speed. No surprise there. Win10 IMO does it better than most.

    There are plenty of reasons to be perturbed by Win10 (updates, UI/UX changes, forced security), but I would NOT include your examples as indicative of most peoples' complaints. But you might as well get used to it - 10 will be with us for a long time.

    Scott
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  7. The only reasonable Win10 is Enterprise. Only that version gives you full control (like in win7/8 LoL over updates and telemetry bullshit. Every version below that is just crappy Service10 OS for peasants.
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  8. Member
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    Originally Posted by davexnet View Post
    You could always install Firefox in XP, it still gets security updates. Panda Cloud & avast A/V still support XP
    Also don't forget the recent updates,
    kb2347290
    KB4012583
    KB4012598
    kb4022747
    security support updates for Firefox for windows xp / vista ends sometime this year - http://www.myce.com/news/mozilla-ends-support-firefox-windows-vista-xp-81885/
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  9. Mod Neophyte Super Moderator redwudz's Avatar
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    I still run XP on one of my older PCs. I don't worry much about MS security updates because my anti-malware program and a separate firewall program keeps the PC safe.

    My newest PC runs Windows 10 Pro with Start 10 to get back my menu, and Avast for malware. The W10 updates are a bit of a PITA, but Pro lets you schedule or delay them.

    And if you really dislike MS OS's, there are some nice Linux OS's you can try out.
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  10. Member
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    Originally Posted by Cornucopia View Post
    Internet - No problem with internet here.

    HD - You should be using an SSD.

    Concur, get Win10 pro.

    Older OSes - Historically, each os has required more resources to boot with similar speed. No surprise there. Win10 IMO does it better than most.

    There are plenty of reasons to be perturbed by Win10 (updates, UI/UX changes, forced security), but I would NOT include your examples as indicative of most peoples' complaints. But you might as well get used to it - 10 will be with us for a long time.

    Scott
    ummmm...... I have SEVEN desktops and FIVE laptops.... I'm NOT going to invest in SSD drives for now. They may be much faster, but too expensive for my taste. YES, I am talking about Windows 10 PRO (32bit) not HOME. I included my examples as a "rant" and not indicative of most user complaints. I have been using 10 since July 2015, and I really don't see any benefit to this overbloated software as opposed to my 'older' Microsoft operating systems. I've also experimented using Win 10 PRO as an update to Windows 7 or 8.1, and also as fresh installs. To me it's too time consuming to go through each and every setting that I want changed. Sure, Win 10 updates can be deferred, but they are there whether you want them or not. Each new 'version' update takes hours and hours to load and install, which to me is a ridiculous waste of time.
    So, yes, I am used to it, but I'll never be happy with Windows 10, no matter what form it takes.
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  11. Member
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    Originally Posted by Atak_Snajpera View Post
    The only reasonable Win10 is Enterprise. Only that version gives you full control (like in win7/8 LoL over updates and telemetry bullshit. Every version below that is just crappy Service10 OS for peasants.
    So that enterprise version will be rare on a gaming laptop I guess?


    Can't disabling services in pro version stop updates & telemetry?
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  12. Member n8tvm's Avatar
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    If I can get ever get everything I do working I switching to Linux.
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  13. Member
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    To me it's too time consuming to go through each and every setting that I want changed.
    So if you haven't made the adjustments, I don't see that you have anything to complain about. Don't you think it would be quicker to change the settings on each computer once than wait for slow boot-up each time? As for the time it takes to do the updates, how about doing them over night?
    Last edited by DeJay; 18th Aug 2017 at 00:57.
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  14. Member jgg's Avatar
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    On download Tuesday (actually, I usually wait till Wednesday), I check the internet for the KnowledgeBase numbers of the monthly updates. Then I download 'em from the Windows catalog and install them manually. I still ain't fast, but it's faster than using MS Updates.

    The only "trick" is to remember to stop Windows Update in Local Services. Also, sometimes it takes awhile to load the files into the "update cache", but if it appears to be stuck, just cancel and try it again.

    I do this for both Win 7 and 10 (my wife has Win 10 home on her laptop).
    Win7pro x64 on Lenovo S20, Xeon W3520, 18gb RAM, nVidia Quadro FX1800 and Lenovo S20, Xeon L5506, 12gb RAM, Matrox C420 and Matrox M9120. NEC PA272W and 2xNEC 2490WUXi.
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  15. Has noone here heard of O&O Shut Up 10? Not that I really care if someone has PC problems, usu user error anyway. FWIW, I hve run with it since upgrading a year ago, when I click on update history it says "No updates have been installed yet." Windows only gets the updates I deploy. Just how I like it! Full disclosure: Win10 Pro user (although that is presumptuous because real pros use *nix).
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    Has noone here heard of O&O Shut Up 10?
    So that's what it's called! It's what I was eluding to in my first post.
    Last edited by DeJay; 19th Aug 2017 at 06:53.
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  17. Member
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    Originally Posted by joecass View Post
    YES, I am talking about Windows 10 PRO (32bit) not HOME.
    This could be part of the problem. 32bit won't use more than 3.5GB of RAMM. So the hard drives are probably constantly writing and reading the pagefile.
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  18. I have an old duel core AMD CPU with 4 GB of memory running Win10 Pro 64 bit off an old hard drive. From the time Windows starts booting (ie, not including the BIOS initialization and the "press any key for BIOS" delay) it's about 10 second until the login screen appears, in about 5 more seconds the Desktop is visible. The drive light flickers a little for the next 10 or 15 seconds but the computer is usable during that time.

    Try disabling the Windows Search indexer. Or at least set it to "delayed start".
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  19. Originally Posted by jagabo View Post
    I have an old duel core AMD CPU
    those cores must really hate each other...
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  20. Originally Posted by SameSelf View Post
    Originally Posted by jagabo View Post
    I have an old duel core AMD CPU
    those cores must really hate each other...
    What's really funny is I saw someone else make the same mistake a few days ago and chuckled at it. At least I can argue that the mistake was at 5:30 in the morning!
    Last edited by jagabo; 21st Aug 2017 at 21:43.
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  21. win7 ultimate for me, still knockin'
    i've installed win10 for a lady once like 1year ago i couldn't believe all the things u have to disable: updates & telemetry and to optimise boot etc.. took me like 1 hour

    win7 should be the last microsoft os for me
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  22. Member
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    win7 should be the last microsoft os for me
    It was my last one too! I still have it as a VM to run my scoring softwares, but that's all.
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  23. Originally Posted by themaster1 View Post
    win7 ultimate for me, still knockin'
    i've installed win10 for a lady once like 1year ago i couldn't believe all the things u have to disable: updates & telemetry and to optimise boot etc.. took me like 1 hour
    Strange thing, the less I mess with Windows 10 settings and services, programs for optimization, the better and more stable Windows 10 works.
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  24. Windows 10 certainly isn't perfect, and the updates are the most irritating part, but with a little bit of tweaking you can quickly get it running at quite a lick. I found that Win10 gave me around an 11% to 15% increase in encoding speed after upgrading from Win7 on my ageing Intel Core2-Quad desktop.

    First off, don't run AVG as it will faff around for a good 5-20 mins after the desktop appears on even a quick, modern PC.

    If you're connecting via wifi then you can set the connection as a 'metered connection' which will reduce (if not completely stop) the Windows updates. (You take responsibility if you get infected with something nasty!). ** I think you can do this with wired network connections on more recent versions of Win10 as well. If you do this then it's probably worth getting into the habit of turning this off and leaving your PC on overnight once a fortnight/month to allow updates to install. (Don't forget that you might need to change the sleep settings as well.)

    If you have an older PC/Laptop, or just an older hdd, then you might want to try disabling the 'Superfetch' service - you may well find that boot up takes a bit longer but it's often this service that causes your hdd to thrash for long periods of time as it 'pre-loads' files into memory that you *might* want to open in the future. (If you've got a quick hdd then you're probably better off leaving it running.)

    Tweaking the indexing options can also improve matters on slower systems as well. (preventing it from indexing your internet history is often well worth it.)

    Oh, and turn off the sidebar/desktop gadgets as they're a Major resource hog! Use the TaskManager instead.

    Defragging & optimising with AusLogics' free defragger - IIRC choose custom install and untick any offers for any of their other software. In the 'Settings/Algorithms' select skip fragments bigger than 10MB and less than 50KB, move system files to the beginning of the disk and optimize file placement by Prefetch layout and then choose to 'Defrag & Optimize' your boot drive. Fixing Windows' swap file's size to the recommended size can also help on some systems. (Preferably before defragging.)

    Obviously, culling the installed programs of unused programs is always a good idea, as is reducing those programs that autostart with Windows to just those that need to. (e.g. Java updater, flash updater, Yahoo/AOL/Google toolbars etc., printer updates - ESPECIALLY HP updates!!! - probably don't need to autorun.) If you've ever had anything AVG or McAfee installed then check the services to make sure that you haven't got any remnants still running - the respective removal tools are no guarantee that everything is gone!

    If you haven't got Autoruns on your system then you really should, especially if you upgraded to Win10 from 7 or 8/8.1 'cos you will definitely have entries in the registry pointing to files that are no longer on your hard drive.

    I know it a PITA that we have to do all this, but a little time spent setting things up properly can certainly pay dividends in the long term.

    Failing that, if your requirements aren't too great then have a look at the Linux Mint Live DVD/USB distros. Mint looks similar to Windows (menus etc.) so it's fairly easy to find your way around. It also works well with most modern graphics chipsets and many network adapters without having to do anything special. Booting from the live dvd/usb you can try it before installing on a hard drive as either a replacement or in a dual-boot configuration with Windows.

    Good Luck!
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  25. Member
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    Failing that, if your requirements aren't too great then have a look at the Linux Mint Live DVD/USB distros.
    Not sure what you mean by that, you can do everything on Linux that you can on Windows. Not trying to pick a fight, just saying.

    Having been a Linux user for a few years, I have recently changed to Linux Mint KDE (after having tried to avoid anything Ubuntu-ish because I didn't like it!) and, setting my prejudice aside, find it works very well, both on a modern Intel laptop with UEFI, which I ordered with no OS installed and my older, several times home upgraded AMD PC with BIOS. I do everything on Mint including video editing.
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  26. ½ way to Rigel 7 cornemuse's Avatar
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    FireFox-52 is last version to work with XP

    This machine is XP & this is FF-29 (portable) I'm using right now. Rarely, a web page will not work for me, but screw them! Biggest annoyance is that 'bar' telling me my browser is out of date. I figure I'm just missing out on some new advertising ploy set up by some knerd programmer, , , ,

    And, I have a few computers with W-7 and one with '10' and some old ones with various linux flavors, (prefer Ubuntu 11.xx). I overwhelmingly prefer XP, über alles, , , ,
    Cross (kros) n: A thing they nail people to.
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  27. Originally Posted by DeJay View Post
    Failing that, if your requirements aren't too great then have a look at the Linux Mint Live DVD/USB distros.
    Not sure what you mean by that, you can do everything on Linux that you can on Windows. Not trying to pick a fight, just saying.
    If you're an experienced Linux user and prepared to spend time looking for alternatives to your preferred Windows software, or find ways to reliably run them from within your chosen Linux, that's probably true. But most of us (I hope) have some sort of a life away from our Computers (obviously, I'm not talking about myself here ) and who can be bothered to go through all of that? Again!

    Just as a matter of interest, which software are you using in Mint? I'm a frequent dabbler with Linux, but am still more comfortable with Windows. Having said that, I am looking to set up an old Dell Intel dual-core that's currently running Vista 32-bit to dual-boot with Mint, and have a more serious play with it. Any guidance would be appreciated.
    Last edited by TimA-C; 27th Aug 2017 at 10:36. Reason: Request for additional info.
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    Good points Tim, I guess it all depends how p****d off someone is with Windows. Then again, the more popular Linux distros come with a selection of often used applications, so most of the searching is not that onerous.

    To pick up on your previous post, my wife runs Windows 10 Pro on a modern laptop (quad core i7, 16gb RAM, 250gb SSD + 1tb HDD). I made settings that we deemed necessary, including deferring updates which she does, I believe, weekly and it works well. Boot-up is quite fast, it's no slouch opening and running software, but the main thing is, she's happy with it. Also, being Windows, she has no problems logging into her office server when she works from home.

    The problem for me is, I am happier in Linux land and now find Windows a bit foreign, it takes me a while to get back into the swing of things.

    Edit: You posted while I was typing this. I'm currently using Mint on this laptop and my editing PC. The laptop has not too many extra packages over what it came with, Chromium web browser for the odd time it is necessary, Cherrytree which I use a lot for notes, Calibre, Gramps, Ancestris and Bleachbit.

    The PC just has the additions I need for video editing. I changed k3B for Bombono DVD because k3b crashes the system each time I try it, Cinelerra-GG 5.1, Handbrake, Mediainfo, mpv Media Player, SMPlayer, Transmageddon Video Transcoder (no longer needed, just tried once when I had a small problem), Winff and Bleachbit. When I changed to Mint due to recent Manjaro updates repeatedly breaking my ethernet connection, the driver is no longer included, I dumped Blender, Kdenlive, AVIDemux, Flowblade and Shotcut. AVIDEmux and Blender may creep back later.
    Last edited by DeJay; 27th Aug 2017 at 11:43.
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  29. For the normal stuff like browsing the web, writing a letter, sending an e-mail or playing a DVD then I agree with you. But as we're here at VideoHelp, what about capturing from a chosen capture device and being able to tweak the procamp and audio like we finally sussed out how to do in Windows? Or edit that Lagarith .avi file before processing in Avisynth and encoding to mpeg2 or mp4, and then maybe authoring to DVD or AVCHD? Maybe it's just as simple as getting that odd little remote that you've used for years to work properly with Kodi on Linux . . . ? (That's my biggest concern with my little project. I suspect I may be buying a small wireless keyboard with a touchpad to make life easier.)

    Anyway, Linux has certainly become a more viable option in recent years - how many live distros did I give up on when it wouldn't recognise either the graphics card or the network adapter? Pah!
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    Hi Tim,

    I forgot to mention VirtualBox, which contains Windows 7 along with Cinescore and Sonicfire Pro. I've paid for the music, so I figure I may as well use it.

    Both Cinelerra and Kdenlive will capture video (others might), but I don't know which cameras are compatible, I just put the camera card into a reader and copy the files over. As for audio, Cinelerra has a wide selection of effects and if that isn't enough there are several audio processors available, Audacity being the best known. Lagarith is not Linux compatible, although HuffYUV is. Avisynth is compatible with at least some Linux distros although I have never tried it. As for encoding, if ffmpeg can handle it, it can be done.

    Yes, Linux has come a long way in the time I have been using it. Several years ago I tried Linux for video editing, but I had to go back to Windows and Sony Vegas then as I couldn't get anything to do what I wanted. This time I had no such need, I'm staying and Cinelerra-GG 5.1 has cemented that.
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