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  1. I'm thinking of getting some Stetzerizer filters to eliminate interference on my VCRs, stereo equipment and TVs. After googling dirty electricity, most links talk about health issues. Not much about electronics. This sounds like a scam.
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  2. Member netmask56's Avatar
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  3. Filters are common way to reduce interferences or to clean signal. Not sure how this device works but seem producer frequently use term 'filter' as such it doesn't mean that this is scam or something but way how device is advertised and price asked for it may be considered as scam.
    There is large amount commercial power line filters without any marketing hype or ideology behind and prices are usually fair.
    http://eu.mouser.com/Power/Power-Condition/Power-Line-Filters/_/N-axgnp?P=1ydntbyZ1yzs...5&Ns=Pricing|0

    btw some types of distortions can be eliminated only by using galvanic separation (transformers) and/or inverter - usually they are more expensive than filters.
    another topic is type of signals we trying to eliminate some of them are conducted and there is area where filter will work and some of them are radiated and this is area where filter will not work - for radiated signals we need to use shielding or best something called Faraday cage.
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  4. I've worked in electronics, including power distribution systems for half a century and can quite categorically state it is complete bunkum and a scam. The web site is full of technical nonsense, refers to measurement units that don't exist and curious regulations from various places that probably (=shouldn't) exist. Referring to 'Volts per second' is like saying 'feet per cubic gallon'.
    Only one part makes sense:
    At 60 Hz the filters act as capacitors and normally marginally improve the power factor of the customer load, which are normally slightly inductive.
    which reveals what is inside the boxes - a capacitor. You can buy one at a fraction of the cost of one of the filters but in almost every case it will be completely ineffective anyway and in most countries there are laws about permissible 'power factor' limits which would make the filter worsen conditions instead of making them better. For anyone who doesn't understand power factor, as simply as I can explain it: AC voltage and currents change over time, typically cycling through positive and negative peaks either 50 or 60 times a second, power factor is a measure of the skew between the two as in some loads the current may peak slightly earlier or later than the voltage. As power (in Watts or VA) is calculated by multiplying voltage and current together, if the two don't coincide the wrong result is reached, the power factor can be used to correct the figure.

    As for eliminating interference on video or audio equipment, unless you have some very serious issues with your house wiring, these things will make no difference whatsoever but might increase your electricity bills.

    Brian.
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  5. Thanks for the inputs. I won't be buying any.
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  6. ½ way to Rigel 7 cornemuse's Avatar
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    Make your own, , , ,

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    BEWARE OF COMMERCIAL AFDBS: Since you should trust no one, always construct your AFDB yourself to avoid the risk of subversion and mental enslavement. Sometimes, AFDBs will be sold on places like eBay. Do not purchase these pre-made AFDBs, even if the seller seems trustworthy. They may contain backdoors, pinholes, integrated psychotronic circuitry or other methods that actually promote mind control.
    Last edited by cornemuse; 11th Aug 2017 at 10:35. Reason: feng shui
    Cross (kros) n: A thing they nail people to.
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  7. Wouldn't a AC Line Conditioner from a manufacturer such as APC do the same thing?
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  8. Originally Posted by rbivi11572 View Post
    Wouldn't a AC Line Conditioner from a manufacturer such as APC do the same thing?
    Probably will be way better but... you can't forbid people to invest thousands $ in silver or rhenium power cables and gold plated power sockets even if main power line is made from Aluminium.
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  9. Dinosaur Supervisor KarMa's Avatar
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    If you are in the US were two 120 volt legs come into your house (which can be combined for 240 volt appliances) then its usually best for your equipment to be on one of the legs only. Otherwise some of your equipment might be out of phase with the other equipment on the other 120v leg.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-phase_electric_power
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  10. Originally Posted by KarMa View Post
    If you are in the US... its usually best for your equipment to be on one of the legs only.
    Yes. And try to put noise-generating appliances (like refrigerators) on the other leg.

    A solid ground connection (for example, directly to a cold water pipe) can be helpful as it gives the line noise a place to go. I can verify this from personal experience. But you better know what you are doing.
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    LOL don't apply to be electricians. U.S. 120v current 3 pole connectors have one hot, one neutral and one ground. you can't only plug in one leg. you might not get any current as neutral is grounded.
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  12. Dinosaur Supervisor KarMa's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by aedipuss View Post
    LOL don't apply to be electricians. U.S. 120v current 3 pole connectors have one hot, one neutral and one ground. you can't only plug in one leg. you might not get any current as neutral is grounded.
    Talking about different equipment on different legs, like one VCR on one leg while your audio amp and speakers are on a different leg on a second (maybe nearby) outlet. Which is why I said " its usually best for your equipment to be on one of the legs only. Otherwise some of your equipment might be out of phase with the other equipment on the other 120v leg. "
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  13. aBigMeanie aedipuss's Avatar
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    there is no "phase" for 120v current outlets. you either have 120v or you have none.
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  14. Originally Posted by aedipuss View Post
    LOL don't apply to be electricians. U.S. 120v current 3 pole connectors have one hot, one neutral and one ground. you can't only plug in one leg. you might not get any current as neutral is grounded.
    Correction 2 hot, one neutral, one ground.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Split-phase_electric_power#North_America
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  15. aBigMeanie aedipuss's Avatar
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    bullshit moron. there are only 3 poles in a 120v outlet. hot, neutral(grounded) and ground(if it's even connected)
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  16. When you're in a hole, stop digging.
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  17. As described in the Wikipedia article, there are two 120V "hot" wires coming into the home. They are 180° out of phase. "Phase" is a property of an alternating current/voltage power line, in that the voltage changes cyclically over time. Each leg alternates in a sinusoidal wave 60 times per second (in North America). "120 volts" is an RMS (root mean squared) value by the way, peak to peak is something like 170V. When one leg is at -120V (to take an example, remember the voltages vary continuously), the other is at +120V. Appliances that require 240VAC take power from both wires, aka "legs" aka "phases."(+120 + -120 = 240) Appliances that require 120VAC take power from one of the two legs and return through the neutral connection. If both legs draw an equal amount of power, the neutral has very little load on it. If the power draw is not balanced, the neutral takes up the difference. This is not considered ideal -- power should be drawn from both phases about equally. 120V outlets around the home connect to one or the other leg; sometimes a dual outlet connects to one leg on each outlet; sometimes both outlets connect to the same leg, and outlets connecting to one leg or the other are scattered around the home in various ways.
    Last edited by raffriff42; 11th Aug 2017 at 19:56.
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  18. aBigMeanie aedipuss's Avatar
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    believe that nonsense if you wish, but please leave all electrical wiring in your home untouched or you may perish as usa home are single phase.

    Building wiring[edit]

    See also: Electrical wiring
    In many countries, household power is single-phase electric power, with two or three wired contacts at each outlet. Neutral and line wires carry current and are defined as live parts.[3][4]
    • The line wire (also known as phase, hot or active contact, and commonly, but technically incorrectly, as live), carries alternating current between the power grid and the household.
    • The neutral wire completes the electrical circuit—remaining at a voltage in proximity to 0 V—by also carrying alternating current between the power grid and the household. The neutral is connected to the ground (Earth), and therefore has nearly the same electrical potential as the earth. This prevents the power circuits from increasing beyond earth voltage, such as when they are struck by lightning or become otherwise charged.
    • The earth wire or ground connects the chassis of equipment to earth ground as a protection against faults (electric shock), such as if the insulation on a "hot" wire becomes damaged and the bare wire comes into contact with the metal chassis or case of the equipment.
    Last edited by aedipuss; 11th Aug 2017 at 20:05.
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  19. That nonsense got me through college and a career in audio (built a recording studio) and video (Hollywood telecine / post-production).
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  20. http://www.oempanels.com/what-does-single-and-three-phase-power-mean
    What is 2 (Dual / Split) Phase Power ?

    If you’re not electrically minded, think of 2 (Dual / Split) phase power like a bicycle where one leg (phase) can push on one pedal, or both legs (phases) can push on both pedals (180 degrees out of phase with one another) rotating around a crankshaft axis (neutral).
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  21. aBigMeanie aedipuss's Avatar
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    good god can you count? there are 3 wires to a standard 120v USA outlet. one hot, one neutral(connected to ground at the breaker box) and one ground. that's why it's called single phase. there is one live wire.
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  22. This is to support only one small part of what I said above: "sometimes a dual outlet connects to one leg on each outlet"

    http://www.electrical101.com/split-receptacles.html

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    Note Ground is not shown in the diagram. Like I said: two hot, one neutral, one ground.
    Last edited by raffriff42; 11th Aug 2017 at 21:00.
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  23. Standard kitchen outlets - two hots, one common, one ground, connected to two-pole circuit breakers. The hots are 180° out of phase, with 240v between them.
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  24. Member netmask56's Avatar
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    Here in Australia we have 240 vac to the power point - very rare these days to have 415 volts

    Looking at the socket Active on the left and neutral on the right with earth in the middle at the bottom.

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  25. I'm envious of your 240v kettles - they're so much faster.
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  26. Final (I hope) words....

    In areas with 230/240V appliances there are three phases and neutral delivered to (or near to) the property but only neutral and one of the phases is wired to the fuse box and outlets . There is nominally 230/240 between neutral and each of the phases and if wired properly, the neutral connects to all properties on the line but the phases are cycled from one property to the next (ABCABCABC...). Some properties, especially where high power is used, may have all three phases in which case there is still 230/240V from each to neutral but also 415/440V available to 3-Phase equipment.

    In areas where 115/120V is standard, there are two phases and neutral delivered to the property. Both phases are 115/120V compared to neutral and the connection to outlets is between neutral and one or the other phase. Sometimes properties use both phases with one feeding some outlets and the other phase feeding the remainder but they share the same neutral. Some higher power appliances use 230V/230V and are connected across the two phases but such equipment needs connection directly back to the incoming feed where both the phase wires are available together.

    Neutral and Earth wires are usually bonded together at the distribution transformer and each property normally has its own individual Earth connection as well. Grounding to water pipes is only effective if the pipes are metal and buried in the ground or wired to a ground rod somewhere along their length. As most water pipes are now plastic it isn't safe to assume there is a good ground connection, even if the place you connect to is metal it may not be so all the way to the planet.

    So in a sense, everybody so far is correct but not seeing the big picture.

    Line filters are only really effective if wired in series with the power feed (between the socket and the equipment). The idea behind them is they let the low frequencies (50Hz/60Hz) pass through unhindered but the higher frequencies that cause interference are trapped in their inductive and capacitive components. The rather silly concept in the original post places a capacitor in parallel with the line so it is not only less effective but it is shares it's effect with the whole neighborhood.

    Brian.
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  27. Maybe it will be easier for you guys to use proper terminology to avoid confusion - highly recommend reference to earthing system https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthing_system - "hot" "phase" etc can be confusing if separated from other factors.
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  28. Member
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    Originally Posted by KarMa View Post
    If you are in the US were two 120 volt legs come into your house (which can be combined for 240 volt appliances) then its usually best for your equipment to be on one of the legs only. Otherwise some of your equipment might be out of phase with the other equipment on the other 120v leg.
    Does this matter for electronic equipment which rectifies the current into DC?
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  29. Dinosaur Supervisor KarMa's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by JVRaines View Post
    Originally Posted by KarMa View Post
    If you are in the US were two 120 volt legs come into your house (which can be combined for 240 volt appliances) then its usually best for your equipment to be on one of the legs only. Otherwise some of your equipment might be out of phase with the other equipment on the other 120v leg.
    Does this matter for electronic equipment which rectifies the current into DC?
    That's the thing, I really don't see it mattering much for completely DC electronics (which would include standard computers). So if you try to play a VCR with one leg and your computer capturing the video is on the other leg, it really should not technically matter.
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