Will there be interference if you stack VCRs and entangled av cables?

[digicube]

I have several vintage stereo equipment like VCRs, DVD players, LD players stack on top of each other and the audio video cables coming out of them have become entangled. Will this cause interference? Sometimes when I watch VHS tapes, I can hear buzzing noise coming in and out.

[redwudz]

Not so likely with good quality cables. Mine are always tangled. But it's better if they are not.
Usually shorter cables are best. 10ft or longer cables have more of a chance of interference.


Try moving them around slightly during playback. If the noise disappears or gets worse, maybe a better cable or cable arrangement.


VHS players can have that type of noise just from the tapes.

[KarMa]

This probably is not the root cause of your buzzing noise problem but I'll post it anyway.

My experience with an old Sony Hifi VCR from the early 90s was giving me trouble relatively recently. Basically it would give me a layer of snow on top of the original video, where it was simply passing on the composite signal from a DVD player or if the VCR was playing a VHS itself, outputing to composite. After reading around on archived usenet groups, I found mentions that the RF modulator can go bad and give off a lot of RF noise. So with the Sony unit I opened it up and removed the RF modulator (which is what handles the coax in and out of the VCR). On many machines the RF modulator is soldered in place but with my Sony it had a simple connector slot and came right out. It worked like new after I removed it, and did not have a need for the coax in and out anyway.

Having a bunch of units with old RF modulators (anything that handles coax) right next to each other is probably not going to be the best case scenario.

Might also just be HiFi noise in your situation, with your VCR not perfectly picking up the HiFi signal on the tape. It's a pretty unforgiving audio source compared to the linear track.

[raffriff42]

[I'm pretty sure that] from an interference & cross-talk point of view, loosely tangled cables are better than tightly wrapped, parallel cables.

[JVRaines]

I've always let my cables lie randomly, although I do try to route AC cables away from signal cables. VHS buzzing that comes and goes is usually HiFi mistracking, which can be corrected by slightly adjusting the manual tracking control. Sometimes it's in the recording, though, if it was made from a poorly adjusted analog television tuner.

[digicube]

Might also just be HiFi noise in your situation, with your VCR not perfectly picking up the HiFi signal on the tape. It's a pretty unforgiving audio source compared to the linear track.

Nice to know. I'll buy a shelf to separate the VCRs.

Might also just be HiFi noise in your situation, with your VCR not perfectly picking up the HiFi signal on the tape. It's a pretty unforgiving audio source compared to the linear track.

Turning off the Hi-fi feature does eliminate the buzzing noise on some tapes. Too bad not all VCRs can be turned off.

although I do try to route AC cables away from signal cables.

My AC cables are also entangle with my av cables. I can separate them but they will still be touching each other.

Thanks for all the help everyone.

[KarMa]

I'd also keep any AC->DC power bricks away from your set up, by at least a few feet if not completely moved. I would be more scared of those power bricks giving off RF noise than a simple AC cable.

[digicube]

You mean bricks like these? Yes I have them close to my stereo equipment. I will try and move them further away.

[KarMa]

Yes, both of those.

[jagabo]

Turning off the Hi-fi feature does eliminate the buzzing noise on some tapes. Too bad not all VCRs can be turned off.

You almost never want to turn off the HiFi audio track. The LowFi track is mono, very low bandwidth, and has a terrible signal-to-noise ratio. You're much better off using the tracking adjustment to get eliminate the buzzing.

[digicube]

But if the tape is not Hi-Fi, there is no benefit turning the feature on, right?

[jagabo]

If the tape is not Hi-Fi there will be no sound on the Hi-Fi track. Obviously, you need to use the linear track.

[digicube]

Here is an example of the buzzing sound I'm talking about. I know it's not the tape because when I play it on another VCR in another room, there is no buzzing sound.

[KarMa]

That's a HiFi problem, which may or may not be fixed with tracking adjustments. And if you adjust too much one way or the other, then it will lose the signal and just default to the linear mono track. Heavy tracking adjusting will also affect the picture quality. Some VCRs work better than others on a given tape, really just trial and error. I've certainly had my fair share of that kind of problem. Also playing the same tape at different times (lets say days apart) can give different results on the same machine, with one play through being horrible with noise and the next play through being at or near perfect. It's really just up to the VHS Gods and if they wish you to suffer.

Also have to ask the question of if this other VCR in the other room is even a HiFi unit. If this other VCR only has mono output (white RCA audio jack only, no red RCA) then it's a mono linear machine and so does not even deal with the finicky HiFi audio.

[digicube]

All my VCRs are Hi-Fis, I got all of them from Goodwill. I'm still convinced it's interference from somewhere in close proximity because like you said, sometimes I don't hear any buzzing sounds.

[KarMa]

Mess with the tracking when you hear it, or you can even induce that noise by messing with the tracking when the HiFi is playing fine as it is that sensitive. I promise you this is HiFi audio sourced noise. It's a pretty well known problem and something I regularly fight.

[digicube]

OK but wouldn't it also mess with the picture? I thought auto tracking means I'll get the best picture and sound.

I think it's time for me to get a mono VCR for situations like this.

[KarMa]

OK but wouldn't it also mess with the picture? I thought auto tracking means I'll get the best picture and sound.

I'm not a VCR or analog video expert but the video heads and HiFi heads are fixed and different parts of the same spinning drum. The video heads pick up the video signal off the video track on the tape, and the HiFi heads pick up the FM signal deeper under the same video track. This entire system does not have much wiggle room and so things like tape shedding on the heads, old tapes that resist turning freely, and things like slight differences between the machine can cause problems. Usually the original machine that recorded the tape will tend to play it the best (omitting side things like TBC).

The linear track is recorded or read on a separate head mounted away from the drum, and is recorded similar to something like a cassette tape on one thin edge of the tape. But these recordings are much worse than an average cassette because the tape speed is quite a bit slower on VHS.

http://www.broadcaststore.com/pdf/model/793700/TT190%20-%204626.pdf

[digicube]

Thanks for the pdf.

[orsetto]

I thought auto tracking means I'll get the best picture and sound.

Not necessarily. Auto tracking typically locks onto the video track while ignoring the hifi audio. This works out OK with tapes the VCR recorded itself, but when playing other tapes manual tracking is often necessary to reduce or eliminate that infuriating audio static and buzzing. The HiFi system is a near unworkable concept when it comes to tape interchange compatibility: because you can't adjust audio and video tracking separately, the best you can hope for is a compromise setting with the least degradation to either. That it works as often as it does is a minor miracle, but too often it doesn't work and no amount of tracking tweaks will help.

Trying wildly different brands of HiFi vcr helps sometimes, because you might just hit on the same brand that recorded the tape, which can make a huge difference in video+audio combo tracking. But as KarMa noted, a depressing number of tapes simply have crap HiFi azimuth thats impossible to track without degrading the video performance, or impossible to track period. You wouldn't believe how many Panasonic, JVC and Sony VCRs were staggeringly off-spec straight from the factory (esp early HiFi models and Hollywood commercial duplicators).

I think it's time for me to get a mono VCR for situations like this.

No need to limit yourself to non-HiFi models. All VCRs with the HiFi feature include some way to disable it and default to the mono linear audio track, even if it may not seem so at first. Usually theres an Audio Select button buried on the remote, a button or switch under a front panel flap, or (most annoyingly) you dig thru the Menu screens until you find the setting (which lets you choose between Stereo Hifi, Left Channel Only HiFi, Right Channel Only HiFi, Linear Mono Audio, or a mix of HiFi + Linear (awful).

Several expert members here have posted of running multiple captures of their difficult tapes: one pass at the best video tracking setting, one at the best audio HiFi tracking setting, one of the linear mono audio, then combining all three into a final optimized file. This can get pretty time consuming, as you edit the audio tracks to swap in the linear audio when the HiFi is particularly poor, etc. But it is perhaps the only way to deal with extreme HiFi mistracking. Of course, even this method won't work unless you can get the HiFi to track reasonably well (while ignoring the video). Some HiFi tapes are just hopeless, so you tolerate the dull-but-reliable linear mono option.

[KarMa]

On my JVC HiFi unit, the linear mono track is called "NORM" for normal I guess. And I do it by pressing the "Audio" button on the remote to cycle through all the options. So different brands might call the linear mono track by different names. Just have to read the manual which can usually found be found by googling your model number.