1080p 25fps (PAL) to 1080p NTSC?

[digitalfreaknyc]

Creating region free Blu-ray disc not an option for your customers?

Region coding and framerate are two totally different things

Maybe for DVD, But for Blu-ray the region coding is exactly the difference in frame rate and that's all what differs a US Blu-ray disc from a European Blu-ray disc, Frame rate only, What's your raison behind converting from a European standard to a US standard, Isn't it compatibility with Blu-ray players, If so why the hassle of messing up the frame rate when there is a way to make the disc playable on every player in the world.

No. That's 100% incorrect. Most U.S. Players won't play 25fps PAL and the fps has absolutely nothing to do with the region coding.

[dellsam34]

Creating region free Blu-ray disc not an option for your customers?

Region coding and framerate are two totally different things

Maybe for DVD, But for Blu-ray the region coding is exactly the difference in frame rate and that's all what differs a US Blu-ray disc from a European Blu-ray disc, Frame rate only, What's your raison behind converting from a European standard to a US standard, Isn't it compatibility with Blu-ray players, If so why the hassle of messing up the frame rate when there is a way to make the disc playable on every player in the world.

No. That's 100% incorrect. Most U.S. Players won't play 25fps PAL and the fps has absolutely nothing to do with the region coding.

Can you name one U.S. blu-ray player model that doesn't play European 25p region free disc? And can you name a blu-ray movie region A and has 25p frame rate assuming that frame rate has nothing to do with region coding, Ofcourse the raison behind region coding that we all know is availability and pricing bullshit.

[digitalfreaknyc]

Creating region free Blu-ray disc not an option for your customers?

Region coding and framerate are two totally different things

Maybe for DVD, But for Blu-ray the region coding is exactly the difference in frame rate and that's all what differs a US Blu-ray disc from a European Blu-ray disc, Frame rate only, What's your raison behind converting from a European standard to a US standard, Isn't it compatibility with Blu-ray players, If so why the hassle of messing up the frame rate when there is a way to make the disc playable on every player in the world.

No. That's 100% incorrect. Most U.S. Players won't play 25fps PAL and the fps has absolutely nothing to do with the region coding.

Can you name one U.S. blu-ray player model that doesn't play European 25p region free disc? And can you name a blu-ray movie region A and has 25p frame rate assuming that frame rate has nothing to do with region coding, Ofcourse the raison behind region coding that we all know is availability and pricing bullshit.

Sure. PS3. And no region A discs would have 25fps material because they won't play them. But if you want a region free disc, check out Keane live. It's all regions and doesn't play. When they released it in the US, they changed the frame rate.

You're wrong

[dellsam34]

I'm playing a French pressed region free on my PS3 as I'm typing, And PS3 don't play BD-R's anyway no matter what frame rate you burn it too. And if you don't like suggestions what's the point of starting a thread?

[digitalfreaknyc]

I'm playing a French pressed region free on my PS3 as I'm typing, And PS3 don't play BD-R's anyway no matter what frame rate you burn it too. And if you don't like suggestions what's the point of starting a thread?

Is your PS3 from the US? I'm guessing not so it has no bearing on this discussion. I tried to play it and it didn't work at all. In fact, even region-free discs where the main feature is 24p DO work but sometimes they start with a preview or a studio logo that is 25fps and the disc will lock up completely.

Also, they 100% absolutely DO play BD-R's. That's all I burn and BOTH of my PS3's play them.

So, once again, you're wrong.

I like suggestions. I LOVE suggestions. But all of your information thus far has been incorrect and inaccurate.

[manono]

Most U.S. Players won't play 25fps PAL and the fps has absolutely nothing to do with the region coding.

Yes, the majority of US Blu-Ray players won't play region-free progressive 25fps Blu-Ray sources, but there is a significant minority that will. Here's a list:

http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=95245

And if I had to convert one such source to play on a US player, I'd do it as described earlier by KarMa and pdr. It's nothing TMPGEnc can do natively as it'll repeat frames to make it play more jerky (I think). But a basic AviSynth script can do it, keeping the length the same and the audio untouched in a kind of hard-telecine process.

Yadif(Mode=1)
ChangeFPS(59.94)
SeparateFields()
SelectEvery(4,0,3)
Weave()

pdr mentioned that not all players can extract the progressive frames out of that and most will just deinterlace it. If encoded as MPEG-2 you could encode as progressive 25fps and run a soft 3:2:3:2:2 pulldown afterwards and I believe most players wouldn't need to deinterlace it.

[digitalfreaknyc]

Most U.S. Players won't play 25fps PAL and the fps has absolutely nothing to do with the region coding.

Yes, the majority of US Blu-Ray players won't play region-free progressive 25fps Blu-Ray sources, but there is a significant minority that will. Here's a list:

http://forum.blu-ray.com/showthread.php?t=95245

And if I had to convert one such source to play on a US player, I'd do it as described earlier by KarMa and pdr. It's nothing TMPGEnc can do natively as it'll repeat frames to make it play more jerky (I think). But a basic AviSynth script can do it, keeping the length the same and the audio untouched in a kind of hard-telecine process.

Yadif(Mode=1)
ChangeFPS(59.94)
SeparateFields()
SelectEvery(4,0,3)
Weave()

pdr mentioned that not all players can extract the progressive frames out of that and most will just deinterlace it. If encoded as MPEG-2 you could encode as progressive 25fps and run a soft 3:2:3:2:2 pulldown afterwards and I believe most players wouldn't need to deinterlace it.

Thank you. Now THAT was very helpful. Unfortunately, I'm a bit simple minded when it comes to video (I'm an audio guy) so I know next to nothing about Avisynth I'm useless without a good GUI. Thank you anyway.

[poisondeathray]

If you're going the avisynth route, you shouldn't need yadif coming from a 25p source . I would use 60000,1001 to be exact , and AssumeTFF() to specify for the proper field order.

ChangeFPS(60000,1001)
AssumeTFF()
SeparateFields()
SelectEvery(4,0,3)
Weave()

To be clear, that script creates "hard" 3:2:3:2:2 pulldown, so the repeated fields are encoded into the bitstream. The content is still progressive but you need to encode MBAFF or PAFF

I'm not sure how BD players will handle MPEG2 and soft pulldown for BD. It works for DVD, you would think they should be able to for DVD, but stranger things have happened. The "negative" for MPEG2 in general is the compression/quality is lower than for AVC. If you use enough bitrate it will look ok.

Since this is probably audio oriented, I can see why you want to stay away from altering duration. But 24p and 23.976p is the only way it will 100% play properly everywhere , every country, on every player at 1920x1080 resolution. All the other options have a chance of failing (not necessarily fail in playback like the US PS3, but playback could be lower quality) in a significant percentage of players. That's why it's the most common choice and least headaches from a production standpoint. Nobody wants to deal with complaints. Pros/cons - those are the choices you have to make

[ackboo]

Thank you. Now THAT was very helpful. Unfortunately, I'm a bit simple minded when it comes to video (I'm an audio guy) so I know next to nothing about Avisynth I'm useless without a good GUI. Thank you anyway.

The thing about avisynth is there is nothing to know about avisynth. It is a frameserver. It is only useful in conjunction with another software able to make use of it, such as megui and virtualdub. You need to install avisynth and another software able to use AVS scripts. You might need some plugins, you just have to copy paste them in the plugins directory of avisynth.
Megui comes with a script creation tool, it helped me a lot when I needed to understand the concepts. And if you don't mind using x264 it might solve your problem.
I'm no expert but give it a shot, you'll be glad you did.