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  1. Hello,

    I converted progressive FULL HD MP4 25fps video clip from GoPro to progressive PAL MPEG2 (av. 7Mb/s VBR) and
    when played on (hardware) standalone DVD players (Thompson and HomeTech), I can see on all moving object's edges
    horizontal lines (like an interlaced video with wrong field order would be played?).

    This is not visible on computer.

    Tried conversion with ffmpeg, mpeg2enc, AviSynth + HCenc - all the same.

    Any hints?
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  2. I'm a MEGA Super Moderator Baldrick's Avatar
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    Do you have a short mpg/vob sample?

    Are you using the those command line programs directly or with a frontend like avstodvd?
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  3. there should be progressive flag in video and DVD authoring should just mux VIDEO_TS together:

    - in HCEncoder ,settings1 tab, check progressive and leave TFF even if it is progressive
    - check HC.ini (on the right in the same TAB) make sure there is *PROGRESSIVE , because I'm not sure what overrides what now ...
    - DVD authoring should not re-encode again, but just mux that DVD together
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  4. Originally Posted by Baldrick View Post
    Do you have a short mpg/vob sample?

    Are you using the those command line programs directly or with a frontend like avstodvd?
    Do you mean video of what it looks like on TV or the mpg file which was authored onto DVD?
    I use command line (ffmpeg, mplex, dvdauthor, mpeg2enc, ....) except HCenc (I use HCgui.exe).
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  5. Originally Posted by _Al_ View Post
    there should be progressive flag in video and DVD authoring should just mux VIDEO_TS together:

    - in HCEncoder ,settings1 tab, check progressive and leave TFF even if it is progressive
    - check HC.ini (on the right in the same TAB) make sure there is *PROGRESSIVE , because I'm not sure what overrides what now ...
    - DVD authoring should not re-encode again, but just mux that DVD together
    This is my HC.ini (HC26) file (without *FILE options):

    *BITRATE 7000
    *MAXBITRATE 8500
    *FRAMES 0 43943
    *PROFILE best
    *GOP 12 2
    *DC_PREC 10
    *PROGRESSIVE
    *PROG_SEQ
    *CLOSEDGOPS
    *AVSMEMORY 1024
    *MPEGLEVEL MP@ML
    *COLOUR 5

    I then use mplex to mux it with audio (I mux it directly during encoding when using ffmpeg, when I use mpeg2enc it has an option to reserve some bitrate for non-video streams - HCenc does not, but mplex did not complain).

    mplex -o output.mpg -f 8 -r 9000 -b 224 -V -h output.m2v output.ac3
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  6. Originally Posted by Nyyr View Post
    I can see on all moving object's edges
    horizontal lines (like an interlaced video with wrong field order would be played?).

    This is not visible on computer.
    Can you make available a 10 second sample, one with steady movement? Baldrick has already asked you once.
    ...I then use mplex to mux it with audio...
    Can you try authoring with the much better Muxman to see if there's any change?
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  7. Tried MuxMan, no difference.

    I directed my camera on TV during playback on DVD, but it is more visible with naked eye than on the camera, even when recorded at 1080p/50fps (TV.MP4: http://leteckaposta.cz/391875643)

    I have also uploaded short part of mpg that I authored onto the DVD (dvdauthor.mpg: http://leteckaposta.cz/391875643)
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  8. I see nothing like wrong field order, which is impossible anyway with progressive video. But if what I do see (the little bit of movement followed by a freeze in the motion) is what you're seeing, then you have a big problem. And I, for one, have no idea what that problem is. Can you try on a friend's different DVD player and television? The MPG looks fine to me. The MPG is before authoring, right, or was it repackaged as an MPG while being cut? So the authored DVD when played on the computer is okay?

    The DVD looks fine to me. I'd guess the problem has to be with either the players or the television. Your other DVDs play fine? The retail ones and the home-made ones? This is the first DVD made using your GoPro camera as a source?
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  9. Originally Posted by manono View Post
    I see nothing like wrong field order, which is impossible anyway with progressive video. But if what I do see (the little bit of movement followed by a freeze in the motion) is what you're seeing, then you have a big problem. And I, for one, have no idea what that problem is. Can you try on a friend's different DVD player and television? The MPG looks fine to me. The MPG is before authoring, right, or was it repackaged as an MPG while being cut? So the authored DVD when played on the computer is okay?

    The DVD looks fine to me. I'd guess the problem has to be with either the players or the television. Your other DVDs play fine? The retail ones and the home-made ones? This is the first DVD made using your GoPro camera as a source?
    I have two DVD players - old Thompson and a cheap and newer HomeTech (which can play DivX as well). The problem is visible on both (equally). It is connected to Toshiba SmartTV.

    The MPG is the ouput of mplex. Yes, when the DVD is played on computer there is no problem. The other DVDs play fine, commercial ones and other home-made are OK. No, this is not the first DVD made using GoPro, the other ones were just 720p and 50fps. This one is 1080p and 25fps.
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  10. give this a try, with a bit different flag settings ...
    Image Attached Files
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  11. Originally Posted by _Al_ View Post
    give this a try, with a bit different flag settings ...
    Well, it seems a little bit different to me, can't say if its better of worse, but generaly it is the same (bad). And there is a great tear on the tree at the beginning.
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    Having read thru all this, looks like there's something haywire with the encoding. Acts like dropped frames, even with all the camera jitter. Lordy, that motion drives ya nutty. I tried some stab() and DeShaker, but.....it don't clear well and you lose some detail on all four borders. There are some Avisynth motion filters that might do a cleaner job, but this is a toughie.

    How well 25p MPEG plays seems IMO a matter of how good the player is. People do it with varying results. But with that much motion and nervous jitter, I dunno. I made a 25i version that looks a little more noisy than 25p.

    What happened to the original movie? Bright levels on the DVD sample were a little blown out.
    Image Attached Files
    Last edited by LMotlow; 30th Mar 2015 at 14:04.
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    Originally Posted by manono View Post
    I see nothing like wrong field order, which is impossible anyway with progressive video. But if what I do see (the little bit of movement followed by a freeze in the motion) is what you're seeing, then you have a big problem. And I, for one, have no idea what that problem is. Can you try on a friend's different DVD player and television? The MPG looks fine to me. The MPG is before authoring, right, or was it repackaged as an MPG while being cut? So the authored DVD when played on the computer is okay?

    The DVD looks fine to me. I'd guess the problem has to be with either the players or the television. Your other DVDs play fine? The retail ones and the home-made ones? This is the first DVD made using your GoPro camera as a source?
    You're talking, I guess, about the authored DVD from post #7? Yep, problems aplenty. Not just motion stutter, but the buildings in the background are warped.

    This was originally 1080p/50fps, right? Why aren't we working with a sample of the original? There are a number of threads with 1080p/50 downsampled to 720x576 DVD interlaced. There are a few tricks to it. The roof tiles in those buildings have a lot of line twitter that can often be cleaned up.
    - My sister Ann's brother
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  14. Originally Posted by LMotlow View Post
    Originally Posted by manono View Post
    I see nothing like wrong field order, which is impossible anyway with progressive video. But if what I do see (the little bit of movement followed by a freeze in the motion) is what you're seeing, then you have a big problem. And I, for one, have no idea what that problem is. Can you try on a friend's different DVD player and television? The MPG looks fine to me. The MPG is before authoring, right, or was it repackaged as an MPG while being cut? So the authored DVD when played on the computer is okay?

    The DVD looks fine to me. I'd guess the problem has to be with either the players or the television. Your other DVDs play fine? The retail ones and the home-made ones? This is the first DVD made using your GoPro camera as a source?
    You're talking, I guess, about the authored DVD from post #7? Yep, problems aplenty. Not just motion stutter, but the buildings in the background are warped.

    This was originally 1080p/50fps, right? Why aren't we working with a sample of the original? There are a number of threads with 1080p/50 downsampled to 720x576 DVD interlaced. There are a few tricks to it. The roof tiles in those buildings have a lot of line twitter that can often be cleaned up.
    No. The original was 1080p/25fps. Strange to me is that on computer it plays fine, though no explicit post-processing is enabled. IŽll post cut from the original MP4 tomorrow. BTW colours donŽt bother me much right now
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    I see, I just have misread something about the frame rate. Thanks for that info.

    True, color is another subject but there's no great problem here. The color looks rather nice, just some slight levels adjustment but that's no hassle. More imprortant is to see what the original video is doing.
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  16. There is the cut from the source MP4: http://leteckaposta.cz/835398448
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    Originally Posted by Nyyr View Post
    There is the cut from the source MP4: http://leteckaposta.cz/835398448
    Please use a tripod next time you film something, the shaking is unbearable.
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  18. try this, now, that player should play it correctly:
    Image Attached Files
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  19. Originally Posted by newpball View Post
    Originally Posted by Nyyr View Post
    There is the cut from the source MP4: http://leteckaposta.cz/835398448
    Please use a tripod next time you film something, the shaking is unbearable.
    That wasnŽt me who filmed that.
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  20. Originally Posted by _Al_ View Post
    try this, now, that player should play it correctly:
    It seems A BIT better to me, but it is still there
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    Originally Posted by Nyyr View Post
    It seems A BIT better to me, but it is still there
    You mean the "interlace lines" and edge noise you mention? I don't see that on the original or anywhere else. I do see really bad camera shake, but what's worse is the motion stutter and image distortion. In some places it looks like missing frames. Play the frames one by one or at slow speed and you'll see the tree and the buildings warp and twist and stutter in frames 64, 66, 84, 104, the 140 series, the 170's, to mention a few. The landscape and the figures twist and warp, too. So does the tree in the center, and the contours in the green landscaping change shape as well, even when the camera doesn't move as much. Got some real problems there, folks.

    I used DeShaker for the attachments below. I didn't even try to smooth the rotation, it just made the warping worse. ReplaceFramesMC steadied frames 80, 102, 108, 115, 155, 159, 169, 172, 177, 336, 339, 359, 177. The ending frames are the worst -- as soon as the camera swings to the left the video stutters and hops like crazy. No telling what the rest of it looks like. With fast or complicated motion like at the end, ReplaceFramesMC won't be worth much.

    The mpg and the video_ts played pretty steady on my 'puter and on my TV with OPPO and DENON players.

    Your original mp4 sample: I didn't know the GoPro encoded with lav.
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  22. Originally Posted by LMotlow View Post
    Originally Posted by Nyyr View Post
    It seems A BIT better to me, but it is still there
    You mean the "interlace lines" and edge noise you mention? I don't see that on the original or anywhere else. I do see really bad camera shake, but what's worse is the motion stutter and image distortion. In some places it looks like missing frames. Play the frames one by one or at slow speed and you'll see the tree and the buildings warp and twist and stutter in frames 64, 66, 84, 104, the 140 series, the 170's, to mention a few. The landscape and the figures twist and warp, too. So does the tree in the center, and the contours in the green landscaping change shape as well, even when the camera doesn't move as much. Got some real problems there, folks.

    I used DeShaker for the attachments below. I didn't even try to smooth the rotation, it just made the warping worse. ReplaceFramesMC steadied frames 80, 102, 108, 115, 155, 159, 169, 172, 177, 336, 339, 359, 177. The ending frames are the worst -- as soon as the camera swings to the left the video stutters and hops like crazy. No telling what the rest of it looks like. With fast or complicated motion like at the end, ReplaceFramesMC won't be worth much.

    The mpg and the video_ts played pretty steady on my 'puter and on my TV with OPPO and DENON players.

    Your original mp4 sample: I didn't know the GoPro encoded with lav.
    Yes, that "motion stutter" and warp is what troubles me most (still even in the video you posted last). If your DVD players handle that as well as computer (on which there is NO "motion stutter" or warp visible), then I assume my DVD players are simply crap... I'll try it on a different one when I get access to it.
    Last edited by Nyyr; 1st Apr 2015 at 13:19.
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  23. LAV?

    This is what ffmpeg returns:

    Input #0, mov,mp4,m4a,3gp,3g2,mj2, from 'GOPR0135.MP4':
    Metadata:
    major_brand : avc1
    minor_version : 0
    compatible_brands: avc1isom
    creation_time : 2014-08-30 11:32:32
    Duration: 00:26:03.60, start: 0.000000, bitrate: 20137 kb/s
    Stream #0:0(eng): Video: h264 (High) (avc1 / 0x31637661), yuvj420p, 1920x1080 [SAR 1:1 DAR 16:9], 20001 kb/s, 25 fps, 25 tbr, 180k tbn, 50 tbc
    Metadata:
    creation_time : 2014-08-30 11:32:32
    handler_name : GoPro AVC
    Stream #0:1(eng): Audio: aac (mp4a / 0x6134706D), 48000 Hz, stereo, s16, 128 kb/s
    Metadata:
    creation_time : 2014-08-30 11:32:32
    handler_name : GoPro AAC
    Stream #0:2(eng): Data: none (tmcd / 0x64636D74)
    Metadata:
    creation_time : 2014-08-30 11:32:32
    handler_name :
    timecode : 11:32:31:00
    At least one output file must be specified
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    Originally Posted by Nyyr View Post
    Yes, that "motion stutter" is what troubles me most (still even in the video you posted last). If your DVD players handle that as well as computer (on which there is NO "motion stutter" visible)
    Yes, there is. Play the same scene in your original mp4 frame by frame or at very slow speed. There's some wrinkly noise at the bottom of the frames, too. Almost looks like it was on tape.

    You'll never get rid of all the problems. There's a little stutter when I played mine, but nothing like the original. There are some fancy motion interpolation filters around, but they all get varying results with this kind of problem.

    Yeah, some players handle noise and motion better than others, but most of the big names do pretty well. Saw some line twitter on my DENON DVD, but not nearly as much on the OPPO BD. Then again, the DENON has better color with DVD's. Pay your money, take your choice.

    Maybe something screwed up with the camera? GoPro isn't all that great, but it shouldn't look as bad as it does. Oh well, you work with what you have I guess.

    I cut HD and mp4 samples with TMPGenc Smart Renderer or VideoReDo. There are others around. I don't know that ffmpeg does smart rendering, but don't have time to learn. Maybe it does. Those who use it can update on that.
    Last edited by LMotlow; 1st Apr 2015 at 14:18.
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  25. Well, first VIDEO_TS I posted, had progressive flag, and you got ghosting on screen, as if your player was deinterlacing that footage, the other one I posted had interlaced flag, I done it in a wrong way , kind of, where I just simply double frame rate that video and re-interlaced it, so it was encoded as interlaced, that is kind of wrong, I realized that second later I posted that,...., I could simply give it interlace flag in ReStream and encoded it as progressive. That is what you can actually do as a last thing (doubt that it helps much), you take your progressive mpg sample , demux it for ReStream, give it interlace flag and mux DVD.
    Last edited by _Al_; 1st Apr 2015 at 16:23.
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  26. Well, I have tried the progressive component YCbCr output of my DVD player and through this output the DVD video plays fine. So the biggest part of this problem was caused by progressive MPG(VOB) being converted to interlaced SCART output by DVD player and then again to progressive inside Smart TV electronics.

    Then I have also stabilized the original video using DeShaker plugin using the best (slowest) possible settings (VERY slow, on my XEON 5470 max 2 FPS ) and then converted it by

    ffmpeg -i stabilized.avi -target pal-dvd -aspect 16:9 -strict strict -q:v 1 -q:a 1 -qmax 9 -flags cgop -g 12 -bf 2 -mbd rd -cmp 2 -subcmp 2 -dia_size 1040 -sc_threshold 1000000 -threads 4 test.mpg

    and this MPG is played well even through SCART (although through YCbCr it it still a little bit better).



    So thank you all for your time and effort, it really helped and directed me to the right direction
    Last edited by Nyyr; 25th Apr 2015 at 08:40.
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