Advice on conveting mp4 to mpeg2 for dvd

[littlebase22]

Hey all first post here. Sorry if this has been answered numerous times but what is the best free progam to convert mp4 to mpeg2 to author on a dvd? I really don't want to lose any quality at all. The quality of the video is excellent to begin with. The file size is 2.79 gb and the total bitrate is 4446.

Is there a free program that converts mp4 to mpeg2 without any quality loss? I experimented alittle with avstodvd but got confused with either making a mpeg2 stream or directly making a dvd structure cause making a mpeg2 stream than doing a file structure it would recode again right? I tried just making a dvd structure with the mp4 and I think it just didn't look right.

Appreciate all the input I get.

[redwudz]

AVStoDVD It's freeware. But you will lose quality. You always will when you do a conversion and re-encode.
If you want DVD format, you need convert to MPEG2 at about 4GB to fit on a single layer DVD.

I would try it and see if the quality is good enough for you. You might get a bit better quality with a pay program like ConvertXtoDVD, but it's $50US.

And welcome to our forums.

[littlebase22]

Thanks for your input redwudz. Im going to give avstodvd another try.

[Detmek]

Also, with 4000+ bitrate it seams your mp4 file is 720p or 1080p. DVD resolution is 480p for NTSC or 576p for PAL. So, you will loose quality juse because of lower resolution.

[littlebase22]

Thanks for the reply detmek I didn't think of that it makes sense. When using the ffmpeg in avstodvd should I tick the high quality box?

or should I use hcenc? when using mp4 to mpeg2?

[Detmek]

Use HCEnc, it should give you a better quality for given file size.

[Cornucopia]

No, there is some faulty calculations going on above.

If your source file is 2.79GB and its bitrate is 4446kbps, that means your runtime is ~83.667min. or ~5020sec.

A full SL disc is 4.37GB and dividing that by 5020sec gives 6964kbps (or ~6.8Mbps). That should be your AVERAGE bitrate, while your max should still be ~9Mbps. You should be using HCEnc to encode and use 2pass VBR to get the best quality out of that encode. Then author after encoding. AVS2DVD can also use HCEnc (as well as QEnc, ffmpeg, etc), but I don't know if it gives you full access to all the necessary settings to fully optimize your quality. From the guides (I don't use the app myself, having pro apps), it doesn't look like it allows inputting both MAX and AVG bitrates, nor "2pass".

Scott

<edit>Don't forget the audio, either, which should be ~192kbps AC-3 (aka Dolby Digital) 2.0 (most commonly and most supported).</edit>

[_MrC_]

@littlebase22

by default, with your mp4 source file, AVStoDVD will select FFmpeg as video encoder, using a CBR (Constant Bit Rate) approach. You can activate high quality settings to get the best result. Then start the project and make your own evaluation.

If you are not satisfied you can switch to HCenc VBR 2-pass ('Edit Title'/'Video'/'Video Encoding Profile') and even customize some HCenc Advanced Option and/or average/max bitrate.

If your source file needs some 'restoration', you can have a look to 'Edit Title'/'AviSynth' section.

To deepen AVStoDVD options, do use the Help file (press F1).



Bye

[littlebase22]

Thanks for the replies. So I tried hcenc 2 pass and the video looks the same as the original source but theres one problem. When I use hcenc 2 pass it wont encode the whole video ive tried it twice with regular default hcenc 2 pass setting and with the profile at normal and set max bitrate at 6990 thought that would be the problem but no still ended up with 9000 bitrate and incomplete video. Any idea why it wont encode the whole video?

The video is really high quality its from the wwe network(that I pay for) so would it matter what codec I use? Heres a screen cap

[_MrC_]

Can you upload the AVStoDVD project log file?



Bye

[Cornucopia]

Again, the MAX should be ~9000kbps, the AVERAGE should be ~6990. If you set 6990 as the max, you are losing out on quality unnecessarily.

You could, like I suggested, bypass AVStoDVD for the encoding and just use it for authoring. When I use HCEnc, I use it's own GUI and have NEVER experienced what you are describing. And I use 2pass VBR all the time.

Scott

[littlebase22]

@_MrC_ Here you go

<12/30/2014 5:57:37 PM>
START PROCESS
<>

<12/30/2014 5:57:37 PM>
PROJECT SETTINGS

DVD Video Standard: NTSC
DVD Titles number: 1
DVD Size: 4450/4450 MB (100%)
DVD Output Setup: MPEG2 Streams
DVD Label: DVD
DVD Menu: No Menu
Output Folder: C:\Users\user\Videos
Delete Temp Assets Files: Yes
Delete Temp Working Files: Yes
Edit Command Parameters: No
Post Process Task: Show Progress Status window

PREFERENCES

MultiThread: 1
AVS Video Source Filter: A2DSource
AVS Audio Source Filter: A2DSource
AVS UpSize/DownSize Filter: Lanczos4Resize/Spline16Resize
Frame Adjust Strategy: 1
PAL SpeedUp: 0
NTSC SlowDown: 0
Video Resolution: 0
Video BitRate Min: 2500
Video BitRate Level 1: 6500
Video Profile Level 2: 4500
Video BitRate Max: 8500
Keep DVD Compliant Video: 1
AC3 Audio Encoder: 0
Force FFmpeg for Long Audio: 1
DVD Audio Format: 0
DVD Audio BitRate: 192
Keep DVD Compliant Audio: 1
Normalize Audio: 0
Auto Delay Audio: 1
DVD Audio Language (Primary): EN - English
DVD Audio Language (Secondary): EN - English
DVD Subs Language (Primary): EN - English
DVD Subs Language (Secondary): EN - English
DVD Subs Font: Tahoma 16pt (255,255,255)
Chapters Interval: 5
Use Source Chapters: 1
DVD Burning Drive: E: MATSHITA DVD+-RW UJ-875S D200
DVD Burning Speed: 4x
Auto Erase DVD RW: 1
Unload ActiveMovie library: 0
Adjust ffdshow at runtime: 1
Save General Settings: 0
<>

<12/30/2014 5:57:37 PM>
TITLE 1 SOURCE FILES
Video: C:\Adownloader\downloads\Raw 8-24-98\wwe37077017_TheHighwaytoHellsfinalstopbeforeS24 1998typem3u8_4500.mp4
Info: AVC - 4352 kbps - 1280x720 - DAR 1.778 - 29.97 fps (CFR) - Progressive - 1:29:44 hours - 161363 frames
Audio 1: C:\Adownloader\downloads\Raw 8-24-98\wwe37077017_TheHighwaytoHellsfinalstopbeforeS24 1998typem3u8_4500.mp4
Info: AAC LC - 93 kbps - VBR - 2 ch - 48000 Hz - 1:29:44 hours (0 ms delay)
[MediaInfoLib - v0.7.69]
<>

<12/30/2014 5:57:37 PM>
AVISYNTH SCRIPT
Import("C:\Program Files (x86)\AVStoDVD\Lib\A2DSource.avsi")

Video = A2DVideoSource("C:\Adownloader\downloads\Raw 8-24-98\wwe37077017_TheHighwaytoHellsfinalstopbeforeS24 1998typem3u8_4500.mp4", CacheFolder="C:\Users\user\AppData\Local\Temp", FrameRate=29.97, VFR=false)
Audio = A2DAudioSource("C:\Adownloader\downloads\Raw 8-24-98\wwe37077017_TheHighwaytoHellsfinalstopbeforeS24 1998typem3u8_4500.mp4", CacheFolder="C:\Users\user\AppData\Local\Temp")

Video = Video.ConvertToYV12()
Video = Video.Spline16Resize(720,480)

AudioDub(Video, Audio)
<>

<12/30/2014 5:57:37 PM>
START VIDEO ENCODING OPERATIONS
Encoding Profile: HCenc VBR 2-pass
Target Video FileSize: 4238 MB
Encoding Parameters: -ini "C:\Users\user\AppData\Local\Temp\DVD_0_wwe3707701 7_TheHighwaytoHellsfinalstopbeforeS241998typem3u8_ 4500.HCenc.ini"
HCenc ini file:
*INFILE C:\Users\user\AppData\Local\Temp\DVD_0_wwe37077017 _TheHighwaytoHellsfinalstopbeforeS241998typem3u8_4 500_1.avs
*AVSRELOAD
*OUTFILE C:\Users\user\Videos\DVD_0_wwe37077017_TheHighwayt oHellsfinalstopbeforeS241998typem3u8_4500.m2v
*LOGFILE C:\Users\user\AppData\Local\Temp\DVD_0_wwe37077017 _TheHighwaytoHellsfinalstopbeforeS241998typem3u8_4 500.HCenc.log
*MAXBITRATE 9000
*BITRATE 6603
*PROFILE NORMAL
*ASPECT 16:9
*PROGRESSIVE
*TFF
*BIAS 70
*DC_PREC 10
*MATRIX MPEG
*AQ 1
*LUMGAIN 1
*SMP
*PRIORITY IDLE
*DBPATH C:\Users\user\AppData\Local\Temp
*WAIT 2
<>


And @Cornucopia I have no idea how to work the progam don't even know how to select the video in that program lol

[littlebase22]

Update: got it to work wm player just messed up and doesn't display the length right or play right. plays fine in vlc. just one more question after im done encoding to mpeg2 and muxing video and audio together. after that I do a dvd folder structure right? will it have to encode it again using hcenc 2 pass? wouldn't that compress it more?

[Cornucopia]

If you have already encoded to mpeg2, and it is dvd-compliant, and you find it of acceptable quality, there is no need to re-encode. With hcenc or anything else. The hcenc suggestion was just a alternate, bypass method of encoding that had a good chance of providing high quality. Yes, it is NOT preferable to re-encode, as that does lose quality.

In general, the workflow goes like: create/record->edit->encode->author->burn.

You may or may not need to mux your V + A together, depending upon your authoring application (which ends up having to remux to DVD spec anyway).

Creating the "folder structure" is something that the authoring app does for you (and you should not attempt to do it manually). Once you have created the navigation logic, menus, links, etc., you "compile" the DVD and it generates the structure during compilation.

Scott

[manono]

just one more question after im done encoding to mpeg2 and muxing video and audio together. after that I do a dvd folder structure right?

Once you have DVD-compliant audio (AC3 audio, I'll assume) and video (the MPV or M2V) load them into Muxman and author for DVD. It will do the muxing and other things to create the DVD. If one or the other isn't compliant, Muxman either won't load one or the other to begin with, abort with a message while muxing, or complete the authoring but with an error message.

If you're using AvsToDVD, it should be doing those things for you

[littlebase22]

What I did was I loaded my MPEG 2 video in avstodvd and it automatically picked the audio file. Clicked dvd folder structure. Then it demuxed the audio and then the muxman program automatically came up and muxed and made the dvd folder structure. No quality loss that way is that right?

[manono]

What I did was I loaded my MPEG 2 video in avstodvd and it automatically picked the audio file. Clicked dvd folder structure. Then it demuxed the audio and then the muxman program automatically came up and muxed and made the dvd folder structure. No quality loss that way is that right?

That's right. It can author DVD compliant assets without reencoding. The authoring might take 15 minutes or so, reencoding and authoring maybe an hour or more. So the time difference alone should tell you if you set it up correctly and if it's only being authored and not reencoded. I don't use the program myself so Mr. C (the developer) or one of its regular users can provide more details. You can also set it up to burn the DVD to disc if you install ImgBurn and set it up in AvsToDVD, but you might want to check out the DVD first, before burning. Also, there's a whole thread devoted to AvsToDVD-specific questions:

https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/277852-AVStoDVD-Support-Thread

[littlebase22]

Just got done watching my dvd and ive got to say its amazing quality. Hcene outputs amazing quality and the program avstodvd is great. But heres my thoughts on the video with hcene and ffmpeg. The hcene video had amazing quality but the motion didn't seem so smooth it didn't look smooth like a dvd would. The ffmpeg video had great quality aswell i couldn't tell the difference in quality wise between hcene and ffmpeg. Maybe im wrong there but it looked almost identical to me and the motion was smooth like a dvd would be. That's just my take i don't know if ffmpeg is known for encoding smoother motion or not it seemed like it to me.

[_MrC_]

With high bitrate (more than 6000) FFmpeg delivers very good quality even in CBR mode, as you have noticed. For low bitrate for mpeg2 (lower than 4000), usually HCenc (natively VBR) is to be preferred.

BTW your eyes are the best judge. Try experimenting with some AVStoDVD options to get the best visual yield.



Bye

[Cornucopia]

Smoothness of motion has to do with the interaction between:
1. Motion within the video
2. Framerate of the video + whether it is interlaced or not
3. Settings in the encoder (multiple areas) and design of encoder
4. Capabilities of the player/decoder, in particular interlacing (or deinterlacing) capability
5. Whether the display is interlaced or progressive

You are trying to make a comparison based on only #3 without reference to any other factors.

Scott

[littlebase22]

@mrc Yeah im going to experiment with more options I love the program. What do you recommend?

@cornucopia Very true and to answer clarify those factors

1. Usually fast motion cause its wrestling
2. Framerate of original and mpeg2 video 29 and im guessing its not interlaced because its ripped from wwe network and there stuff is hd. This video is like that letterbox 16:9 where the black bars on the sides are part of the video
3. Really just left everything default ffmpeg without the high quality box ticked
4. I have no idea lol
5. Im guessing its progressive
.

[LMotlow]

@mrc Yeah im going to experiment with more options I love the program. What do you recommend?

@cornucopia Very true an DDd to answer clarify those factors

1. Usually fast motion cause its wrestling
2. Framerate of original and mpeg2 video 29 and im guessing its not interlaced because its ripped from wwe network and there stuff is hd. This video is like that letterbox 16:9 where the black bars on the sides are part of the video
3. Really just left everything default ffmpeg without the high quality box ticked
4. I have no idea lol
5. Im guessing its progressive
.

The info in post #12 says that the source and the new encode are progressive.

RE: your statement #2, above -- the source is progressive likely because it's formatted for web streaming, NOT because it's an HD frame size. The HD specs for non-web HD authored video and DVD @29.97 fps is for interlaced video, not progressive.]

[littlebase22]

@mrc Yeah im going to experiment with more options I love the program. What do you recommend?

@cornucopia Very true an DDd to answer clarify those factors

1. Usually fast motion cause its wrestling
2. Framerate of original and mpeg2 video 29 and im guessing its not interlaced because its ripped from wwe network and there stuff is hd. This video is like that letterbox 16:9 where the black bars on the sides are part of the video
3. Really just left everything default ffmpeg without the high quality box ticked
4. I have no idea lol
5. Im guessing its progressive
.

The info in post #12 says that the source and the new encode are progressive.

RE: your statement #2, above -- the source is progressive likely because it's formatted for web streaming, NOT because it's an HD frame size. The HD specs for non-web HD authored video and DVD @29.97 fps is for interlaced video, not progressive.]

So what should I set the frame rate to?

Edit: Why should I edit the frame rate? the frame rate for the original video is 29.97 and should I convert to interlaced?

[_MrC_]

Leave it @ 29.97 progressive which is definitively compliant with NTSC DDVD standard.



Bye

[Cornucopia]

It may be compliant but 29.97progressive will give you reduced temporal resolution (aka choppier motion), unless your original footage WAS 29.97p to begin with. I say this because most 720p footage is supposed to be 59.94p, and the smoothest conversion for DVD would be interlaced.

Scott

[littlebase22]

It may be compliant but 29.97progressive will give you reduced temporal resolution (aka choppier motion), unless your original footage WAS 29.97p to begin with. I say this because most 720p footage is supposed to be 59.94p, and the smoothest conversion for DVD would be interlaced.

Scott

Heres the properties for the original file

So its 29.97. So I should change it to interlaced? Ive read somewhere else that you shouldn't change the source type. You should leave it as is? Some more on this would be appreciated.

[Cornucopia]

That doesn't say if it's already interlaced or not. Use MediaInfo to tell.

If it's 29.97 interlaced (aka 59.94 interlaced), you should LEAVE it that way.

If it's 59.94 progressive, you should do something like:

AssumeFrameBased
SeparateFields
SelectEvery(4, 0,3)
Weave()

That will make it 29.97 interlaced.

If it's 29.97 progressive, you should leave it as it is, and there is no proper way to get better TRUE motion (there are a few ways to fake it, but might look fake). For DVD encoding, you would want to encode as PsF with a flag (because DVD expects it to act like it's interlaced). This can be done like a 2:2 pulldown.

What are you talking about, "source type"? There are things you shouldn't do without good reason. Depending, it's possible this might be one of those good reasons.

Scott

[littlebase22]

That doesn't say if it's already interlaced or not. Use MediaInfo to tell.

If it's 29.97 interlaced (aka 59.94 interlaced), you should LEAVE it that way.

If it's 59.94 progressive, you should do something like:

AssumeFrameBased
SeparateFields
SelectEvery(4, 0,3)
Weave()

That will make it 29.97 interlaced.

If it's 29.97 progressive, you should leave it as it is, and there is no proper way to get better TRUE motion (there are a few ways to fake it, but might look fake). For DVD encoding, you would want to encode as PsF with a flag (because DVD expects it to act like it's interlaced). This can be done like a 2:2 pulldown.

What are you talking about, "source type"? There are things you shouldn't do without good reason. Depending, it's possible this might be one of those good reasons.

Scott

Im sorry I said source type I meant scan type. Heres the properties



So it looks like its 29.97 progressive.

[Cornucopia]

29.97p it is then. Wow, what a shame for a sports clip.

Scott

[littlebase22]

29.97p it is then. Wow, what a shame for a sports clip.

Scott

When encoding with avstodvd should I change it to interlaced? Or should I do that 2:2 pulldown and how would I be able to do that?

Would that raw video file be good for a blu ray disc?