VCD files in TMPGEnc Authoring Works 5

[Mr Chris]

I've got a couple of VCD-compliant files that I'd like to burn to a DVD, while also adding chapter points and a menu - in other words, it should behave just like a DVD-Video, only the sources are MPEG-1s. I could have sworn I managed to do this years ago without issue in an earlier version of TDA, but Authoring Works 5 seems determined to re-encode everything no matter what settings I use.

So, am I going mad? Can this be achieved (without re-encoding) in AW5 or not? I've got this nagging feeling that I'm missing something obvious...

Many thank in advance.

[hech54]

Is your VCD NTSC pr PAL?
https://www.videohelp.com/vcd#tech

Also DVD audio MUST be 48.0, unlike 44.1 found on most VCDs.

[Mr Chris]

Is your VCD NTSC pr PAL?
https://www.videohelp.com/vcd#tech

Also DVD audio MUST be 48.0, unlike 44.1 found on most VCDs.

They're PAL files, 352x288, 25fps. I should have said that the audio's not an issue - I'm happy enough to re-encode that. The stumbling block is that AW5 wants to re-encode the video no matter what - it even lets me re-encode to MPEG-1, but won't output the originals directly! Here's a 10-second sample of one of the originals, with 48kHz sound:

sample.mpg

I'm pretty sure that file meets the PAL DVD specifications, or am I wrong? It imports and plays in AW5 just fine, but I can't output it without re-encoding the picture.

[hech54]

I found this buried in the specs:
MEG-2 transcoding output
Allows you to adapt the MPEG-2 output size of the BD/DVD structure to an arbitrary one/two layer media capacity.
* Transcoding may not reach the specified target size depending on the video material.
* Does not occur on track with a size adjustment exclusion setting.
http://tmpgenc.pegasys-inc.com/en/product/taw5_spec.html#3

[LMotlow]

Did you look at the specs link in post #2? It's been years since I made a VCD but 48KHz audio and variable bitrates are not consistent with VCD.

[hech54]

Yes....VBR video is a NO NO.

[Mr Chris]

Did you look at the specs link in post #2? It's been years since I made a VCD but 48KHz audio and variable bitrates are not consistent with VCD.

I'm trying to create a DVD, not a VCD. (Read my original post again if you need to.)

I'm pretty sure that sample video I uploaded is PAL DVD compliant - isn't it? If it is, why won't AW5 output it without re-encoding? Or am I missing something really obvious?

[roma_turok]

The TDA don't like MPEG1 variable bitrate video

MediaInfo of you sample:


I encoded for test mpeg1 VCD VBR and CBR bitrates
the mpeg1 CBR marked to not re-encode:

[Mr Chris]

The TDA don't like MPEG1 variable bitrate video

Thanks very much, roma_turok, but are you sure that's not just because you've put all three videos in the same track? I mean, it looks like you're probably right, but Authoring Works 5 will happily re-encode my files to MPEG-1 VBR and create a DVD... So why wouldn't it just output the original directly? Seems odd.

Are there any better options for this job than AW5?

[LMotlow]

Thanks very much, roma_turok, but are you sure that's not just because you've put all three videos in the same track? I mean, it looks like you're probably right, but Authoring Works 5 will happily re-encode my files to MPEG-1 VBR and create a DVD... So why wouldn't it just output the original directly? Seems odd.

Nothing odd about it. VBR is not VCD or MPEG1 compliant for what you want for output.

You can probably find an authoring program somewhere that will accept VBR for VCD output. But I don't know what that would be, unless you want a non-compliant video on DVD disc and take your chances with it. The standards are what they are, and most reputable authoring/encoding apps will comply with them.

Your 48KHz audio is also non-compliant.

Are you actually trying to create a "DVD". I mean a real MPEG2 DVD?

[Mr Chris]

Thanks very much, roma_turok, but are you sure that's not just because you've put all three videos in the same track? I mean, it looks like you're probably right, but Authoring Works 5 will happily re-encode my files to MPEG-1 VBR and create a DVD... So why wouldn't it just output the original directly? Seems odd.

Nothing odd about it. VBR is not VCD or MPEG1 compliant for what you want for output.

You can probably find an authoring program somewhere that will accept VBR for VCD output. But I don't know what that would be, unless you want a non-compliant video on DVD disc and take your chances with it. The standards are what they are, and most reputable authoring/encoding apps will comply with them.

Your 48KHz audio is also non-compliant.

Are you actually trying to create a "DVD". I mean a real MPEG2 DVD?

Thanks for your input, LMotlow, but you seem to have missed both my original post and my previous reply to you.

In short, I'm trying to create a DVD using MPEG-1 files. Authoring Works 5 insists on re-encoding the picture, even though I think it's DVD-compliant (PAL). There's a sample above. If it's not DVD-compliant, where have I gone wrong? And if it is, how can I get AW5 to output it directly without re-encoding?

[roma_turok]

AW5 don't have option to skip reencoding if its marked to encode
I tested with Muxman and its make DVD without reencoding
I not tested how its play on DVD player
but Muxman more hard to use and missing menu option

better reencode on AW5 and make DVD
you trying to save time or quality ?

[LMotlow]

You can't force TAW to make a non-compliant VCD or DVD from your MPEG-1 video without some re-encoding.

And it needs to be cleaned up anyway.

[jman98]

Some cheaper authoring programs simply will not allow MPEG-1 for DVD output, even if the MPEG-1 video is within DVD specs. I've seen this happen first hand. I have a DVD that I made as a test many years ago with MPEG-1 video. The video is within DVD specs (valid resolution and bit rate for MPEG-1 on DVD) and the audio was re-sampled to 48 KHz. I made it using an old version of Scenarist. I've yet to find a player that won't play it. Even my Samsung BluRay player, which adamantly refuses to play VCD or any file format (ie. MPG, MKV, etc.) using MPEG-1, plays it without a hitch. I'm not seeing a compelling reason to be married to Authoring Works so if the OP can live without a menu, I'd use Muxman as roma_turok suggested.

[Mr Chris]

AW5 don't have option to skip reencoding if its marked to encode
I tested with Muxman and its make DVD without reencoding
I not tested how its play on DVD player
but Muxman more hard to use and missing menu option

better reencode on AW5 and make DVD
you trying to save time or quality ?

Thank you very much again, roma_turok.

So that seems to suggest that my file is indeed DVD-compliant - and it's a quirk of Authoring Works that's causing my problems. I still find it odd that AW5 supports importing MPEG-1 VBR videos and encoding to MPEG-1 VBR for the creation of DVDs, but won't just pass my MPEG-1 VBR video directly through the process. But, if that's the way it is, I suppose I'd better look for other options. What would you recommend if I really don't want to re-encode the video?

[manono]

Both the audio and video are perfectly compliant for authoring. I just tested with Muxman which is very strict in this regard and had no problem making a DVD from the sample. If TMPGEnc Authoring Works 5 won't do it without reencooding, the obvious answer is to use something else.

Edit: Only now I see roma-turok said pretty much the same thing.

What would you recommend if I really don't want to re-encode the video?

Muxman is the best if you don't need menus. For menus, I might suggest the freeware GUI4DVDAuthor. Or, make a 'dummy' DVD with TMPGEnc Authoring Works and the menu you like and then replace the video later with the Muxman authored one using PGCEdit. That's what I often do.

[Mr Chris]

Both the audio and video are perfectly compliant for authoring. I just tested with Muxman which is very strict in this regard and had no problem making a DVD from the sample. If TMPGEnc Authoring Works 5 won't do it without reencooding, the obvious answer is to use something else.

Thanks for confirming that. To be honest, I thought the obvious answer was that I was doing something wrong in Authoring Works!

I'm not seeing a compelling reason to be married to Authoring Works so if the OP can live without a menu, I'd use Muxman as roma_turok suggested.

I'm seeing less and less reason to stick with it as this thread goes on, too. Can anyone recommend something that does allow simple menu creation, as well as directly outputting MPEG-1 files? If not, I'll try my hand at Muxman...

Edit: Just seen manono's edit - thanks for those recommendations.

[LMotlow]

Odd goings on, I've never had that problem with TAW5. It's been maybe 10 years since I made a VCD, back then it was Author v1. GUI for DVDAuthor might just take the video as-is.

[Cornucopia]

@LMotlow, the OP is NOT trying to make a VCD. The OP has VCD-sourced material and is trying to make a DVD. This has been stated a couple of times.

Seems clear to me that the problem is not with authoring to DVD in general, but rather authoring WITH AW5. As stated on the above-referenced page:

2. MPEG-1 VBR (variable bitrate) file import is not supported.

And since the original "sample.mpg" as uploaded is VBR (which BTW, you are right LMotlow, that is not VCD-compliant, but yet I can attest to easily being able to make VBR-type VCDs in the past), the 2 seem to be incompatible.

So, yes, choice would be to either use a different authoring app (such as Muxman) or re-encode the source first. I'd use the former if maintaining existing quality was a high priority as long as the material was uncorrupted. If the material had some corruption, I'd bite the bullet and re-encode.

Scott

[LMotlow]

@LMotlow, the OP is NOT trying to make a VCD. The OP has VCD-sourced material and is trying to make a DVD. This has been stated a couple of times.

I know, I saw it posted.

[Mr Chris]

Seems clear to me that the problem is not with authoring to DVD in general, but rather authoring WITH AW5. As stated on the above-referenced page:

2. MPEG-1 VBR (variable bitrate) file import is not supported.

Thanks, Scott - it does indeed seem to be a "feature" of Authoring Works 5 rather than my file or user error. (The baffling thing is that it actually can import MPEG-1 VBR files, or transcode any video to MPEG-1 VBR and build a DVD from that - which is why I was left scratching my head over its refusal to just pass a DVD-compliant one straight through...)

Veering from the subject a bit, what's the "go-to" DVD authoring software these days? I'm stuck in my habits of using AW5 because I've been with TMPGENC since the days of TDA, and also an ancient copy of Adobe Encore 1.5. Exploits like these make me wonder whether I'm missing out on anything far better, easier to use, or more versatile - am I?