I am trying to backup the WDT Complete Goofy 2-discs set.
I had troubles in ripping already: for Disc1 I used DVDFab, Disc2 gave me reading errors so I switched to RipIt4Me + DVDDecrypter.
It took about 1 hour and inserted a lot of "Dummy Sectors" so I don't know what I got exactly.
Now, back to Disc1, it is authored in a way that you have to select every single short manually.
There is a thread here and that's exactly what I need.
I don't want to reauhtor the disc, I want to have a continuous playback of all the shorts, no matter where I start from, up to the last one and then go back to the menu.
I am pretty sure this can be done with PGCEdit, I tried by myself but the DVD has a very complex/odd layout and I failed.
Anybody can help?
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First of all, you need to get a good rip. I am not sure that RipIt4Me + DVDDecrypter can do the job any more. DVDFab? It's currently in a weird state and I don't trust it. Disney uses its own internally developed bad sector copy protection for DVD. Try AnyDVD instead. It should work. The trial version should be able to rip it.
After you get a sensible rip, you can look into using PGCEdit.
PGCEdit can change commands but you'd have to publish codes first, that is not straightforward, all PGC's have their codes, you'd have to copy/paste lots of pages, and even that you need to troubleshoot it first, you could start uploading VIDEO_TS folder deleting all titles first, delete those _1 ,_2 files, so maybe someone would post back that VIDEO_TS or if re-writing is easy, he can go about to explain it.
Ok, here it is the folder.
As far as I can tell, the short are in titles 1 to 40, but with some titles that are not shorts. For example, the first short movie is title 1, but title 2 is not a movie. The second movie is title 3. So, to begin with, you will have to do a list of all titles you want to chain together, in the correct order. (The list will therefore be something like 1, 3, 4, ..., 40)
With that list, go to the first short (Title 1), and insert this at the beginning of the post-commands area:
[71 00 00 09 00 03 00 00] 1 Set gprm(9) =(mov) 3 [30 08 00 06 01 C0 00 00] 2 (CallSS) Call the VMGM PGC 6, resume cell 1
Repeat for all titles in the list, with the correct Title number in gprm(9). For example, in the post-commands of Title 3, you should insert this:
[71 00 00 09 00 04 00 00] 1 Set gprm(9) =(mov) 4 [30 08 00 06 01 C0 00 00] 2 (CallSS) Call the VMGM PGC 6, resume cell 1
I don't know if you want to include the bonus shorts in your Play All menu, but if it's the case, simply continue from Title 40 to the bonus, with the same logic. (That should work but I haven't tested.)
It's exactly like that, shorts are titles 1,3,...
Thank you for your help, really appreciated.
I will try as soon as I have the time.
Just one question: what do I do with the other post-commands?
Leave them or delete?
Ok, thank you.
Here I am again.
The title list is as follows:
1, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 27, 42, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 41, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40.
Titles 42 and 41 are intro clips to shorts 28 and 34.
I modified the post-commands as suggested, it plays up to title 9 then, instead of going to title 27 it returns to the menu.
I see. Look at the VMGM PGC 6. It's the dispatch PGC, that jumps to a specific title according to the content of gprm(9). For titles 1 to 9, the value to set in gprm(9) is the title number to jump to, as explained above. But I haven't noticed that, starting with Title 27, the value of gprm(9) is not the title number any more. For example, for title 27, the value to use is 10, as you can see in the commands 24 and 25. So, it's not as simple as I thought. You have to use the right value for each title. That should be easy if you print the content of VMGM PGC 6. Locate the Jump to the title you want to play, and the number to put in GPRM(9) is in the line just above it.
The Disney DVDs are very complex!
Disney DVDs are complex (e.g. Finding Nemo) but I suspect something related to protection is often involved.
I have all the WDT DVDs available here in Italy, one is from the first edition (tin box), some are simple amarays, a couple are steelbooks (with stacked discs, I hate them!).
The first ones that I bought have a much more simple authoring layout and I backed them up with no problem, the most recent ones have this complex structure and give troubles.
In this specific case it's a silly authoring choice too as all the other volumes play the shorts one after the other, in this one you have to select any single short manually (which I think is dumb).
I don't think the dispatch PGC is related to the protection. It is a standard dispatch PGC. But the title numbers of the movies are strange. It would have been much more logical to author them in the increasing order (1, 2, 3, ...). The current authoring has probably been made only semi automatically, and I suspect some silly human decisions.
And indeed, no Play All option for a collection of short is a stupid decision! Have you succeeded to create it yourself?
Ok, now it works.
Still there are two issues I'd like to fix:
1) if I hit the "Next" button on the remote I can go from one short to the next one. If I hit the "Previous" button I don't go to the previous short (as I would like) but return to VTSM 9, which is the very first menu played (languages for menus and audio tracks).
2) At the end of Title 40 playback the player returns to the Episode List menu. I would prefer it to go to the main menu with the extra button highlighted.
Is it possible to fix these things?
How can I achieve such level of knowledge to understand how to do this "magic" by myself?
1) Short answer: you can't. Al least easily.
Long answer: That's theoretically possible, but MUCH complicated. The structure of the titles is complicated, because they are protected. There are several useless short cells before the cell containing the movie. Normally, when the cell containing the clip is playing, pressing back should return to the previous program (or chapter) but unfortunately, all cells have the same program/chapter number (except the tiny chapter AFTER the clip). So, to jump, say from title 3 to title 1, you will have to do something like this:
- Double-click the Title 3 PGC to open the PGC editor.
- Click once on the empty button in the "Prog. (PG)" column and in the Cell 6 line. The previously empty button should now contain a 2.
- Click the "Edit Chapter (PTT) Table" button, then Add Chapter and OK the dialog.
- Change the cell command number of that cell 6 from 0 to the number of the next available cell command (in this case, it's cell command #7).
- OK the PGC editor and add cell command #7 with this:
[30 08 00 00 01 86 00 00] 7 (CallSS) Call the VTSM Angle menu of the current VTS, resume cell 1
- Right-click the new menu PGC, select "Set Menu Entry Type", select "Angle Menu" and OK the dialog.
- Replace the NOP command with this:
[71 00 00 09 00 01 00 00] 1 Set gprm(9) =(mov) 1 [30 06 00 06 00 C0 00 00] 2 (JumpSS) Jump to VMGM PGC 6
Now, the hard part: You must do the same thing for all shorts! (With the right value in gprm(9) to call the previous title, of course.) It's a lot of work.
2) It's relatively simple:
- Right-click on any VMGM PGC and select "New Dummy PGC".
- In the new PGC (VMGM PGC 13), replace the NOP command with this:
[30 06 00 01 01 83 00 00] 1 (JumpSS) Jump to VTSM 1, Root menu (TTN 1)
[71 00 00 03 00 03 00 00] 1 Set gprm(3) =(mov) 3 [71 00 00 0A 80 07 00 00] 2 Set gprm(10) =(mov) 32775 [30 08 00 0D 01 C0 00 00] 3 (CallSS) Call the VMGM PGC 13, resume cell 1
I have had to create the new PGC in the VMGM because it is impossible to jump directly to the main menu AND highlight a different button than button 1 with the original authoring.
Note that the nav will always return to the main menu when Title 40 has finished playing, unless you press the Menu button during the playback of that title.
Your last question is interesting!
You should study the basis of the DVD authoring with a book or at DVD Replica. Use also the Trace mode of PgcEdit a lot, and be sure to understand everything. Begin with simple DVDs. Disney DVDs are not easy to understand, and I must confess that I'm often lost.
Trials and errors are a good approach. Test in Trace mode, and try to modify the value of the GPRMs on the fly (with the Watch window) to see what will be the effect and how the navigation will be affected. Also, read the forums, here and at Doom9.
Last edited by r0lZ; 6th Aug 2014 at 09:25.
It is like a programming, question should be:, How do I learn to program DVD structure. You need to know what GPRM, SPRM, PGC, WMGM, that PGC has pre and post command section. Codes are similar to assembler. Basic commands. You can move numbers to a cell (GPRM), compare them and jump accordingly to other PGC etc., etc. GPRM are user "memory cells" SPRM are cells that return values, you can read those values. Like what subtitle track is selected, what button was selected as last etc... Very similar like programming in assembler long time ago, basic codes , something like first programming on Atari computers, those 8bit computers with whooping 64kB memories (32kB user available or so). So for nowadays very archaic like.
The best learning tool is combination of DVDLabPro+PgcEdit. First creates DVD, second reads it and changes, adds commands, because working with commands in DVDLabPro directly is very cumbersome.
I have to take my time and read your last reply carefully.
Book? What book?
I use "Trace" but most of the time I have no idea what is going on. I don't know what all those GPRMs, SPRMs, etc... are.
You got my point.
I can use DVD-Lab becuase it has a graphical approach to DVD authoring but I don't get the "programming" stuff.
Let me rephrase the question:
is it possible for somebody (like me) who has no programming background whatsoever to understand this stuff or is it a lost cause?
Two good books: DVD Demystified by Jim Taylor and DVD Authoring and Production by Ralph LaBarge. There are certainly other good books, but I don't know them.
The web sites are a good source of information too, like The Unofficial DVD Specifications by DVD Replica (containing large excerpts from the book of the same name) and, mainly for programmers, the DVD-Video Information site of mpucoder.
Understanding the DVD structure is not really easy, especially for someone without basic programming knowledge, but it's possible. The language itself is somewhat abstract and very silly, but it can be used and understood. Keep in mind that the graphical interface of DVD-Lab Pro has a direct counterpart in the DVD organisation. For example, when you create a menu, you add the VMGM or a VTSM "domain" to the DVD, that you will see in PgcEdit. The arrows in Lab are symbolic ways to show what the post-commands or button commands are supposed to do (jump to another part of the DVD). Of course, in PgcEdit, the organisation of the GUI follows more closely the internal organisation of the DVD, and the commands are shown as they are, and for that reasons, it's a better tool to learn the theory. But, as suggested by _Al_, you can build a simple DVD with DVD-Lab, and then examine its structure with PgcEdit, and experiment with the commands. Then, add or modify some things in DVD-Lab and see how the DVD has changed with PgcEdit. Finally, the trace mode allows you to understand what's going on when the DVD is actually played.
Last edited by r0lZ; 7th Aug 2014 at 12:11.
Two good books
They both are a little... pricey, can't afford them.
Would "Unofficial DVD Specifications Guide" be an option? Or does it contain pretty much the same things one can find around the Web?
The web sites are a good source of information too
Keep in mind that the graphical interface of DVD-Lab Pro has a direct counterpart in the DVD organisation.
I'll get back to update as soon as I am done with the Goofy DVDs.
P.S.: just out of curiosity, DVD and BD are two completely different things? I mean, can one be a master of DVD authoring and a total ignorant about BD authoring?
The books exist in PDF/ebook formats, and should be less pricey. I don't know if they are legal copies, though.
DVD-Replica has been a very good site (although it contains some minor errors), and it's why when you click on the flat button with the command in the command editor, PgcEdit opens the page about that command at DVD-Replica. But unfortunately, the author has removed many parts of the online guide (to sell the book), and the guide is not really complete now. The links in PgcEdit are often broken too.
But the site is still a good introduction to DVD authoring and the VM commands.
DVD-Lab doesn't require to write the commands, that's right, but it converts the simple authoring you make with the GUI to a list of complex commands. If something goes wrong, or if you cannot do something specific with the GUI, you're stuck. PgcEdit is harder to learn, but it gives you the full power, without restriction. And trust me, when you redo the whole authoring of a DVD with PgcEdit, you can obtain something very simple, and easy to understand. Unfortunately, all authoring programs (including Fab) generate very complex structures, because they use complex algorythms that must work in all cases. In fact, instead of trying to understand very complex DVDs such as your Goofy DVD, I prefer usually redo the whole authoring from scratch. That takes some time, but at least, you get something that you can understand easily.
Yes, DVD and BDs are totally different. (The HD-DVD was relatively close to the DVD-Video, but it is now abandoned.)
I think we are saying the same thing with different words.
I consider PGCEdit one of the most useful and powerful piece of software around (I think I already told you that).
Unfortunately I don't have the skills to use it at its full power. I know how to do some simple things but when the going gets tough I'm lost.
About reauthoring vs. "fixing", I understand your point, I have even done it sometime.
But you have to demux all the stuff etc..., lot of work. It's the last resort.
Some theory, if it is going to help.
DVD you can split into VMG and VTS . VMG is at the beginning of DVD, (in theory used for main menus) it can have lots of PGC's. Then there is VTS on DVD, in theory for storing titles with movies and title menus. You can place menus at the beginning for a title.
Any PGC can have pre-command section, content (muxed video, audio, subtitles) and post-command section. Imagine that there can be no content , only pre and post commands. You can call that dummy PGC, empty PGC. Think of it as a empty paper sheet where you can write VM commands - program, codes to run DVD as you wish.
You can jump between those PGC's. Your DVD navigation starts in "first play". It jumps to some PGC from ever there. For example, you cannot jump from VTS title to another VTS title, you need one VMG PGC to run it through. DVD navigations have some restrictions. Usually you do not need to know such a things. Using DVD Lab Pro, you desire a jump, but DVDLab Pro in a fraction of a second writes those commands and manages all that, even creating empty VMGM PGC to enable that. DVD authoring does that behind your back , only for you to see that in PGCEdit. Writing those codes behind your back is called creating "abstract layer". Every DVD authoring software does things differently, meaning it can create the same thing jump from the end of one title to the beginning of another title, BUT creates totally different codes, creating different PGC's, shortly - writes that abstract layer, code, differently.
Another code creation example, you can create dummy PGC (empty PGC) even in DVDLabPro, in a VTS title, mark it as title menu, placing some codes in it in pre-command section, sorting out what menu should DVD navigation jump into, using some multi language menu if pressing title menu button on DVD remote control (that language you have already chosen at the beginning of DVD for example). You use some commands using conditions. And only after that there is appropriate jump to "your" language menu with video and audio or just some static picture menu. Somewhere after "first play" , using some VMGM menu, you might ask user to choose language and mark the selection in memory (writing something in user available memory cell GPRM). Point is you can have title menu marked as empty menu with codes only etc., etc., All kinds of tricks, you start to realize, after using "trace" mode in PGCEdit.
But using Scenarist (like in a case of your DVD maybe or other authorings, not sure what is being used nowadays) not having abstract layer - automatic script creation available , all codes were written manually perhaps, which should in theory mean that codes would be more straightforward and easier, .. in theory.
Sorry but I am a little busy so I have to postpone the project for some days.
Thanks for what? Appreciating a great software?
I thank you for having made it available (and for your kind help).
Thanks to you too, some of the things you wrote I did know, some I didn't.
I have read some theory here and there but I feel like I want to solve a differential equation only being able to count to 10.
Besides, the fact that DVDs and BDs are totally different isn't much "motivational".
I mean, if you start now (with the BD becoming the new standard) it's frustrating to know that, no matter how hard you will work to learn DVD you still will be at square one with BD.
Expanding on _Al_'s post.
Although this Disney disk is beyond my level, I had something similar with a DL disk that I had authored with a custom menu and three titles.
I forgot to add a 'Play All' button, so instead of trying to splice into the existing structure which was out of the question at my level, I modified the menu image to show a new 'play all' button and used VobBlanker to place it in the original disk.
In PgcEdit I added the new menu button and cloned the Titles, deleted their existing commands and added a dummy pgc for each new title.
The' play all' button set to jump to the first dummy pgc which in turn opened the first new title.
That title's post command jumped to the next dummy pgc, which opened the second title - which called the third dummy pgc which called the third title.
Finally that title called the first play pgc which got me back to the menu.
I find PgcEdit can make these simple changes relatively easy and there is no need to keep track of register values because the changes really don't interact with the existing structure.
But why did you have to use dummy PGCs?
I do not understand the purpose of dummy... "things" in a DVD.
I figure they are used as a "neutral" space for placing commands.
For example, for stupid reasons, it is not allowed to jump directly from a title or menu in a specific VTS to a title or menu in another VTS. Therefore, if you want to play, say, title 2 right after title 1 and the two titles are in different VTSs, you have to jump to the VMGM, and from the VMGM, jump to title 2. The simplest way to do that is to add a new dummp PGC in the VMGM, with the command to jump to title 2. In the post-commands area of Title 1, you should add a call to the dummy PGC. When title 1 has finished playing, the nav will be redirected to the dummy, that doesn't play anything, but jumps directly to title 2. (BTW, I could have used that technique to create the Play-All feature of your Goofy DVD, but that would have required to create a lot of dummy PGCs in the VMGM. Since there was a simple way to do it with the original authoring, I have preferred that way. It consists in setting a GPRM value to a specific value, and then jump to an unique dummy "dispatch" PGC in the VMGM, that jumps to the right title according to the value in the GPRM. In your DVD, GPRM(9) and the VMGM PGC 6 are used exactly for that purpose. Do you understand better why you had to add the two commands with a different value in the GPRM for each title to call?)
"Bouncing" through the VMGM to jump from a VTS to another VTS is only an example. Dummies are used for a variety of purposes. They are extremely frequent in the VMGM and in the VTSM domains. (Note however that you cannot create a dummy "alone" in a VTST domain. It must be "attached" to a specific title. But doing so makes the title "not_one-sequential", and that has many drawbacks. Therefore, I recommend to avoid creating dummy PGCs in the Title domains.)
Thanks for your reply, complete as usual.
In the case of the Goofy DVD I prefer the method you suggested me, sambat's tips could be useful in the future.
Do you understand better why you had to add the two commands with a different value in the GPRM for each title to call?
I am sorry I haven't kept you posted about the Goofy DVD, I haven't had the time to work on it again.
Last edited by Instant Martian; 12th Aug 2014 at 15:52.
I was thinking about sambat's method last night and now I have a question:
does cloning titles increase the size of the disc? Or is it like having reused cells?