Looking to get a capture card

[Tafflad]

Another spanner is the works .... anybody any view on the Canopus ADVC-1394 PCI
http://www.dvfinland.com/canopus/pdf/advc1394.pdf

Would that be a good choice ?

[DB83]

This pre-dates the ADVC box. Win7 drivers ? Hardly.

[Tafflad]

OK ... thanks ... I suppose getting another ADVC box 55, 110 or 300 maybe be an answer ... so annoying that I only sold mine when we went through the Getting Dizzy tape .... had held it until then in case it was needed.

I had captured all of my tapes ....but it seems I could do better by redoing without TBC and save with different codec (Lossless)

There is an ADVC110 for sale at £99 .... think it's worth that ?
Obviously can always sell on later


So annoyed I sold my 300

[DB83]

Not sure what you mean here by 'save with a different codec'. Any ADVC will merely transcode that analogue signal from the VHS in to a digital DV file.

You could, I suppose, inter-convert that to a lossless format to do any restoration. But it still would not be as good as a direct to lossless capture.

The ADVC 300 also has a 'pass-through' mode where, if you have a capture card you can do some 'cleaning up' with the ADVC and export that as analogue into the capture card. Not sure whether the lower models support that.

£99 seems a fair price for a S/H 110. Don't know what you paid for your 300 but mine (and this was approx 7 years ago) was the better part of £400.

[PuzZLeR]

In the same thread I miss a question directed at me, and answer another question not directed at me. I shouldn't do this while at work.


As for the ADVC (55/110/300) - good reliable unit however grossly overpriced and limited. The ADVC only does DV, nothing else.


The ATI 600 USB, ezcap.tv and USB-Live2 all do DV too, as well as other formats like MPEG-2 and AVI lossless formats (such as HuffYUV, Lagarith, UT, etc).


Furthermore, DV is a fixed format not really recommended for VHS captures to begin with. As well, if you really want DV, that's fine. You can get better results capturing in HuffYUV, or similar lossless YUY2 format, and then re-encoding to DV, and working with that, which will be of higher quality, and even processed beforehand the way you like it (ready for archiving or for your editor, or playback, etc).


And you can buy the capture sticks for much, much less money too. The ADVC is hype-ware.

I have an ATI 600 USB, ... It is still reliable. I have 2 backups that haven't been called to duty yet, and likely won't be for another decade, or more, or ever(?).
.

Do you want to sell one ?

Nope.


However, I won't be cruel. First make sure you're confident it can work with your setup (region/OS) and shop around. If you still have problems getting one, email me at this Forum.

However, it's not expensive. I won this item here very recently.

Clearly you can see the price, under $30US at the going rate, is not that expensive. (Not sure if you can see under eBay's security blankets with winning bidder "puzzler00" - that's me. )

[Tafflad]

Thanks for comments ... I did buy an ADVC300 and external TBC on advice here and did all captures as DV. (and I have been told here the Sony codec was not a good choice - it was default)
Been advised (and partly educated) that it would be better to capture Lossless and without the full frame TBC.

Can't see any ATI TV Wonder HD 600 USB in the UK, maybe they were never popular this side of Atlantic.

The Hauppage USB-LIve 2 and ezcap.tv are both on sale here ..(and cheap) if I don't use any of their software am I correct in that you advise they provide good quality for capture.

[PuzZLeR]

Thanks for comments ... I did buy an ADVC300 and external TBC on advice here and did all captures as DV.

The ADVC is not a bad product, just limited/overpriced. You can still get good work done with it.

(and I have been told here the Sony codec was not a good choice - it was default)

Don't remember if you can change the DV codec on that unit. If you can, a good free one is the Cedocida DV codec.

Been advised (and partly educated) that it would be better to capture Lossless and without the full frame TBC.

Yes, lossless is the way to start. You get the full details this way, with least artifacts. You can edit, crop, filter and process with minimal penalty. You can always encode to other formats after for archiving/playback/etc.

But a full frame TBC is vital for many tapes. A TBC helps synchronize tape drift, stabilizes jitter, and other problems associated with analog tape and cleans the signal to your capture device so it can prevent dropped frames.

Can't see any ATI TV Wonder HD 600 USB in the UK, maybe they were never popular this side of Atlantic.

Shop on the .com or .ca version and you'll see them pop up from time to time. If the seller has local shipping restrictions just ask them ahead of time if they wouldn't mind shipping overseas. You will find many of them will be pleasant and agree, especially if you offer to help with the little bit extra S&H it may cost them.

The Hauppage USB-LIve 2 and ezcap.tv are both on sale here ..(and cheap) if I don't use any of their software am I correct in that you advise they provide good quality for capture.

Yes. They are good products and they will work with VirtualDub and lossless formats. And yes, avoid their software. Like most capture stick bundled software it's usually buggy, limited and can produce bad quality. It's sad because the software can make the product look bad actually.

[Tafflad]

Interesting on your comment " full frame TBC is vital for many tapes"
I did use one of these the capture chain was VCR > TBC >ADVC300 >(firewire) PC capture with WINDV

On restoration forum guys are advising the TBC is over softening the capture, and putting too high a gamma level, so having done all captures ... need to start again and do them without a TBC. (have sold ADVC300 so need to buy some h/w)
Only use a DVR as pass through to get Line TBC

[sanlyn]

But capture VHS to lossless AVI. Use Lagarith or huffyuv losssless compression and a YUY2 colorspace, which is a closer match to the way VHS is stored as YCbCr. Capturing to DV-AVI presents colorspace problems, as well as being lossy encoding. Most YUV colorspaces are similar, but they're not identical. DV was designed for DV, not for analog VHS.

[Tafflad]

OK have just bought a replacement ADVC (110 this time)
As far as I know ... from ADVC I can only convert to DV, which means I would capture the DV stream in AVI container.... using WINDV ... or am I missing the point ?
I have no problem using some alternative to WINDV ... but the output form ADVC110 will be still be DV.

What would set up be on PC for capture ? ...........

All my tapes are non commercial PAL colour, apart from 2 'Professional' tapes which are VHS (non macrovision), the rest are off my own S-VHS camcorders, have read that DV-AVI is not good for NTSC source, but nowhere near as much of an issues for S-VHS

[PuzZLeR]

AVI is a container that can store many formats, such as DV, HuffYUV, Lagarith, even compressed formats like DivX, Xvid. It's what you put in the container that makes a difference.

As for DV in NTSC Nation, it uses a 4:1:1 color space. This is great for editing, and re-editing, which was the reason for its color space design, but comes out weaker in capturing than using HuffYUV at 4:2:2.

I find for most captures, it's perfectly fine to encode to DV for editing and archiving after the lossless capture. I see little difference this way, despite all the debate about it - even if I then shift to a 4:1:1->4:2:0 format, such as DV->DvD from it later.

Sometimes we get a bit too picky. It is really only VHS after all, which is roughly a 4:0.33:0.33 (more or less) color space.

Having said that, for passive captures that are not high in importance that I wish to keep, I have no issue archiving in the smaller DV format. It's for the very precious stuff, home movies, irreplaceable content, I will only archive in lossless and recommend lossless to others in the Forum for such content.

[Tafflad]

appreciate the container aspect of DV ... what I was trying to explain is that I will be using an ADVC110 .... as far as I know this device will only capture in DV format.
So any discussion on Lagarith or HUFFY is academic at the point of point/
It could be used for any intermediate processing files, but to convert DV to Lagarith just to get the file into VD has no benefit.

[sanlyn]

I think you need to find out what you're doing. You don't have to "convert" a video to Lagarith to open it in VirtualDub or any other processing app. You're missing the point. As it is, you will be processing lossy encoded DV and then re-encoding it again to get DVD.

[Tafflad]

understand what you are saying, I'm taking DV ..but as I see it ... capture is fixed, , ADVC will only provide DV.
Capturing as DV-avi is therefore the only practical option I have.
I will be dropping into VD, ...... after processing will end up with a compressed file of some description.
Whatever the output (assume Lagarith-avi)
These are dropped into Vegas for final edit and rendering as MPEG2 for DVD creation. Of course if I could capture as lossless it would better, but no option to do so.

[PuzZLeR]

Yes, there is no way, AFAIK, to get lossless AVI out of the ADVC, unless you use another capture means, such as a new capture device that can, and redo the whole thing.

Converting to lossless, from your DV, (such as via VirtualDub, or your editor) as you likely know, will not restore any lost details. However, if you wish to do some processing on the files, such as filters, etc, and you intend to end up with MPEG-2/DvD, then yes, use a lossless intermediate file. That would be the best solution. If it's only cuts, joins and some cross-fades, stick with the DV.

You can then make a decision if you wish to keep the original DV, or the processed lossless AVI (if you're filtering, and are satisfied with the results). Both can be valid Source.

I don't blame you if you don't want to buy another capture stick and (re-)capture all your tapes if you've already invested in an ADVC. I wouldn't recommend it either at this point, since it's just so time consuming when you've already done it and have to redo it, when the ADVC was not a bad solution to begin with.

[Tafflad]

Yes, there is no way,...
when the ADVC was not a bad solution to begin with.

Thanks for the confirmation.

[Tafflad]

As an aside ... what is the view of the Pinnacle
700 usb*"
See these going frequently on eBay, Digital FAQ seems to rate them for raw video capture. Don't see then mentioned here.

[usually_quiet]

As an aside ... what is the view of the Pinnacle
700 usb*"
See these going frequently on eBay, Digital FAQ seems to rate them for raw video capture. Don't see then mentioned here.

The device is old enough that there may not be drivers available for any Windows OS other than Windows XP.

[Edit] Most people here would tell you to avoid Pinnacle products like the plague. When I did a search I could not find any information about the Pinnacle 700 USB at digitalfaq.com or find many user reviews that said it was any good.

[Tafflad]

My mistake .. it was onn this forum .... (https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/233140-Pinnacle-PCI-or-USB-700)
In any event your comment about age is valid.


One card I do see advertised a lot is "http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VIDEOMATE-C100-Capture-Card-Video-Pci-COMPRO-/200971361134?pt=UK_Computing_Other_Computing_Netwo rking&hash=item2ecad39b6e"

I have been Googling about and can't find out if I can capture Lossless, this is a current card on sale at a lot of locations.
It maybe it is a hardware MPEG2 encoder but can't confirm.

[PuzZLeR]

Most people here would tell you to avoid Pinnacle products like the plague. When I did a search I could not find any information about the Pinnacle 700 USB at digitalfaq.com or find many user reviews that said it was any good.

I diss Dazzle - alot. Burnt twice, 1999-2000, again in 2004-ish, on their "capture" products - horrible nightmare. Should have had better habits then of checking boards and reviews online to save much agony.

It's not the money (although they were expensive). It was the torture of working with a product that was already a proven failure before purchase (without knowing it then).

However, somewhere around the midway point of the 2000s' first decade they were bought out by Pinnacle (in fact, "rescued" from disgruntled customers is more accurate). Since I have not touched them since, I can't comment on Pinnacle-ware, however, I do see the warnings here.

[usually_quiet]

My mistake .. it was onn this forum .... (https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/233140-Pinnacle-PCI-or-USB-700)
In any event your comment about age is valid.


One card I do see advertised a lot is "http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/VIDEOMATE-C100-Capture-Card-Video-Pci-COMPRO-/200971361134?pt=UK_Computing_Other_Computing_Netwo rking&hash=item2ecad39b6e"

I have been Googling about and can't find out if I can capture Lossless, this is a current card on sale at a lot of locations.
It maybe it is a hardware MPEG2 encoder but can't confirm.

I can't find any information about the Compro VideoMate C100 other than what is at Compro's website, which doesn't mention hardware MPEG-2 encoding.

There is nothing wrong with using one of the reasonably priced USB 2.0 devices already recommended to you. USB 2.0 has enough bandwidth to provide uncompressed video for lossless SD capture.

[usually_quiet]

Since there are settings for PAL analog capture in the drivers, I decided to see if I could capture PAL video with the TV Wonder HD 600 USB, just for fun. I was able to locate a 2-minute segment of DVD-compatible SD PAL video and authored a PAL DVD for test purposes, but I was thwarted by a lack of hardware that outputs a PAL video signal. None of the three disc players I have access to that can play the DVD can be configured to output PAL video. They can only convert from PAL to NTSC for output.

After some thought, I think the reason why the TV Wonder 600 HD USB is so difficult to find in the UK is that it's possible the device I have for N. America with an ATSC/QAM/analog tuner is the only version that was made, and no version was made with DVB-T tuning for Europe.

[Brad]

Lordsmurf has said that the ATI 600 USB can capture PAL to AVI, but can't capture it to MPEG-2. I don't know whether that's a limitation of the DirectShow MPEG-2 encoder included with the software, or just the software interface.

I think you're correct that there was never a DVB-T version. Some of the other devices that used the EM2883 + TVP5150 combo used a different ATSC demodulator, but I couldn't find any that use that particular USB bridge with the TI chip and a DVB-T demod. The closest is this: http://www.linuxtv.org/wiki/index.php/TerraTec_Cinergy_Hybrid_T_USB_XS