Previously working VHS capture method now fails... (crappy tape?).

[rusmichal]

Hello,

a month ago, I was able to successfully capture from my VCR (Sanyo VHR-7100EE) using Somagic SMI Grabber (aka EasyCAP DC60+ chinese clone) with SMI-2021CBE chip on Windows XP 32-bit, using VirtualDub and HuffYUV codec. Quality was pretty decent, no stutter etc. After removing certain frequency peaks from the picture and using QTMGC deinterlacing script it all looks really great.

Today I've found some other family tapes in the attic (in small VHS-C casettes). These play fine on Samsung Smart TV using composite out of Panasonic RX11 VHS-C camcorder. They also play quite fine in mentioned VCR (with VHS-C adapter). In both cases video sometimes "jumps" in Y axis or some noise is visible at the bottom of the screen. It might be worth noticing that in camcorder's display, the text with playback info is a bit messy (that messiness stops when video stops jumping).

However, I tried to capture them the same way as before. Video from camcorder is of *great* quality -- that is until I press play. Then, there's a second of two/three still frames and after that... a black screen, two stills again, and black screen, and so on. When it comes to capturing from VCR (using the adapter), SMI Grabber displays nothing.

The tapes I captured a month ago won't capture either. (While, obviously, they play fine on the TV).

I also have a 10-year-old card, Excalibur Radeon 9200 ViVo (ATI Rage Theater Video Capture) which captures video of great quality from the camcorder... again: until I press play and treat it as VHS-C player. System is Windows XP 32-bit. On the other hand it won’t capture anything from that standalone VCR (only noise).

USB SMI Grabber behaves in the same way on my notebook with Windows 7 64-bit (64-bit drivers downloaded from here)...

What’s wrong?... Could it be because I installed 64-bit driver and it uploaded invalid firmware to the capture card, rendering it unusable? But firmware should be uploaded during every plug-in of the card, though... I don’t know.

Confused,
m.

[DB83]

Why did you install a 64-bit driver ? That will never work on a 32-bit system.

As for the video grabber >> easycap clone it has probably died. A common garden newt would probably have a longer life-span.

[rusmichal]

Why did you install a 64-bit driver ? That will never work on a 32-bit system.

Because I have also tried to use it on my 64-bit notebook:

USB SMI Grabber behaves in the same way on my notebook with Windows 7 64-bit (64-bit drivers downloaded from here)...

As for the video grabber >> easycap clone it has probably died. A common garden newt would probably have a longer life-span.

Died and still able to produce good results with clean signal from camcorder (live, not playback)?

[Brad]

You're concerned that the 64-bit driver affected your hardware. Drivers aren't firmware, so nothing to worry about there.

I don't have any ideas for you though.

[DB83]

The way I read, you can not capture with this device PERIOD It is not working. Dead as a dodo

[pandy]

Macrovision? At least this sounds like Macrovision.

[DB83]

Macrovision? At least this sounds like Macrovision.

Including those tapes previously captured OK ?

There can be 'fake' MV usually caused by a weak signal but my last shilling is on the capture device itself.

[pandy]

Macrovision? At least this sounds like Macrovision.

Including those tapes previously captured OK ?

There can be 'fake' MV usually caused by a weak signal but my last shilling is on the capture device itself.

Most capture chips is able to detect Macrovision (same can be even in not working/partial failure mode).
Even high pro equipment have issues with Macrovision as Macrovision add fake sync pulses preventing correct synchronization acquisition. Use different capture card or verify signal from VCR against Macrovision (some scope however most od modern digital scopes have same problem - they can't correctly trig on Macrovision and if they trig then usually fake sync pulses are counted as normal one).

But perhaps there is no Macrivison and reason is more trivial.

[rusmichal]

You're concerned that the 64-bit driver affected your hardware. Drivers aren't firmware, so nothing to worry about there.

I don't have any ideas for you though.

Yes, but for this particular device, the driver loads firmware every time the device is connected. Some USB devices (and drivers) work like that.

The way I read, you can not capture with this device PERIOD It is not working. Dead as a dodo

I certainly can capture some material (live stream from camcorder) in good quality. Capturing from the tapes stopped working though.

Macrovision? At least this sounds like Macrovision.

Including those tapes previously captured OK ?

Good point... I've got tapes that perfomed OK a month ago. Now they won't capture.

There can be 'fake' MV usually caused by a weak signal but my last shilling is on the capture device itself.

So the previous tapes degraded sufficiently in a month time, to weaken the signal enough? I'd say it's the device, too.

Use different capture card or verify signal from VCR against Macrovision

First of all, these are home-made family tapes, so there can't be any real Macrovision, I guess. And I've already used another card:

I also have a 10-year-old card, Excalibur Radeon 9200 ViVo (ATI Rage Theater Video Capture) which captures video of great quality from the camcorder... again: until I press play and treat it as VHS-C player. System is Windows XP 32-bit. On the other hand it won’t capture anything from that standalone VCR (only noise).

And what is really strange to me, the other card behaves likewise... It captures good quality "live feed" from camcorder. But it can't capture any VHS-C tape (neither from camcorder nor from VCR through cassette adapter).

[danno78]

And what is really strange to me, the other card behaves likewise... It captures good quality "live feed" from camcorder. But it can't capture any VHS-C tape (neither from camcorder nor from VCR through cassette adapter).

The issue is caused by time base errrors found on tape. Vertical synch signal it is in bad shape and the capture cards can`t follow. In "live feed" the signal is good and capture go fine. On Samsung TV it also work because the TV can fix the time base error with TBC built inside. TV can tolarate a high level of jitter but capture cards can`t.

In both cases video sometimes "jumps" in Y axis or some noise is visible at the bottom of the screen.

Even the TV can`t fix all the time the errors.
You need one vcr with TBC or standalone TBC to fix the errors and then will be able to capture those tape.
Another explanation is this unstable vertical synch trigger the MacroVision protection circuit. For ATI VIVO (Rage Theater chip) there are Macrovision Remove tool/drivers that ignore MV signal but will not clean the synch signal.

[pandy]

If TV can sync to video, display correct picture (particularly modern LCD/PDP TV) then i don't see any reason why you can't capture such signal except DRM (unknown type - Macrovision/CGMS) - alternatively something was changed in your PC during this time and this prevent to make copy.


Connect VCR to TV, play signal if it sync OK then issue is on PC side.

[vhelp]

i suspect that in your earlier attempt to install the 64bit drivers, it installed a macrovision feature (maybe a 32bit version auto-detected and that portion of driver installed) and now your poor vhs/vhsc/etc will not capture properly again with this capture device. i would suspect thAT other capture devices may suffer from this glitch as well though it may be hit or miss.

i don't think that removing the driver will clear the problem. drm/macrovision is not something anyone (the manuf) wants you to remove from an uninstall process. it is like a install once and it stays forever, like when you install certain m$ apps, they never remove unless you reinstall windows form scratch again. anyway. i would suggest that you roll back to a restore point if possible. otherwise, you may have to reinstall windows from scratch to remove this drm/macrovision bug, unless you can't do that for personal reasons.