Severe ghosting when capturing from LD with Hauppague USB-Live 2 and VDub

[SegaSonic91]

Hello,
I recently went back to buying LDs about 4 months ago after not buying a single disc since 2001 and become addicted once again. I bought a Hauppague USB-Live 2 so I could convert the rarer and most loved discs to DVD (using VirtualDub) but I am having a lot of trouble. When I playback a captured AVI, the colour seems a little off (like it is compressed with fewer colours, like old video clips in Mega-CD games but obviously not as bad) and I getting severe ghosting. It's almost like the colour is bleeding from frames with movement and creating the ghost. I tried different colour methods but it seems this crappy USB thingy can only do YUY2.

I just realised that I have deleted the new tests I did earlier today so I will have to make a clip to upload. It is really frustrating me because having tried to do some research into the issue, "bad deinterlacing" keeps coming up as a cause. I am not using any de-interlacing when capturing though, unless I am missing a setting in VirtualDub? I just hope it is not something the Hauppague does automatically. I did try capturing with the ITVC filter on but it made no difference. Any help would be much appreciated! Thank you in advance.

[SegaSonic91]

Here is an AVI file showing the problems I have described. It is 20 seconds long and 133MB.

[SegaSonic91]

I also took some screen shots.

[jman98]

In general Hauppauge devices really do better with non-AVI captures. Most of them don't even support it. It gets into a religious area with some members, but I have my doubts about the usefulness of lossless AVI captures from standard def sources like VHS and laserdisc. If you use a sufficiently high bitrate on your captures, capturing to lossy formats like MPEG-2 and H.264 is fine.

I do laserdisc captures with their Colossus card and I don't get ghosting or color bleed. I'm not trying to offend, but the USB-Live 2 is a very low end and cheap product. You cannot expect Porsche performance from a cheap Smart car. And Hauppauge's few cards that have been capable of AVI capture have not been considered their best products. Is there a different software product you can use to do your captures? Maybe that would help.

[jman98]

Wow. That's awful in your screenshots. The only things I know to do would be to try another capture program or buy a better Hauppauge device. If you must have USB their HD PVR devices are in the same family of chipsets as the Colossus and as long as your PC isn't ancient (check their recommended specs) you could get a lot better results with one of those or the Colossus. The Colossus has a TBC that you can turn on with a registry hack - not sure if the HD PVRs have this too or not. I think they do, but I'm not sure. You can search and find out.

[jagabo]

Turn off any temporal noise filters. You may need to use a third party utility. Maybe here:

http://shspvr.com
http://shspvr.com/tools.html

[SegaSonic91]

Thanks for the replies. I didn't even think about the problem of using AVI with that el-cheapo card. I would love to buy a "proper" card but I only have a laptop and no PC. To be honest, I only bought the USB device I did because it was under $50 and I thought that if it didn't work properly, it would not be too much of a loss. Any sugestions for USB devices? I will also try a different capturing programe and see how it goes.

Thank you jagabo, I will try your suggestion.

[hech54]

I'm not sure what you are doing wrong....but this capture started out as a HuffyUV in VirtualDub via my Hauppauge USB-Live2. I posted a short AVI sample of it here over a year ago(the link is expired) and I remember several members positively surprised comments on how well the Hauppauge stick did.
http://youtu.be/1cxqbkctxlk

[jman98]

Any sugestions for USB devices?

I gave you some specific advice on this in my 2nd post. If you're not going to read your replies there's not really a lot we can do to help you.

[Cauptain]

Do you try capture using UT VIDEO CODEC ULY2??




Claudio

[themaster1]

Try with dscaler

[SegaSonic91]

I'm not sure what you are doing wrong....but this capture started out as a HuffyUV in VirtualDub via my Hauppauge USB-Live2. I posted a short AVI sample of it here over a year ago(the link is expired) and I remember several members positively surprised comments on how well the Hauppauge stick did.
http://youtu.be/1cxqbkctxlk

Funnily enough, it was your posts on this forum that I found when trying to research if the USB-Live2 worked with VDub. I did download the small file you posted in one of those threads which of course looks perfectly fine. It is really annoying me that I am having this problem. I tried doing a straight no compression capture and there was still ghosting but it did not seem as severe as the HuffyUV. Also tried a h.264 plugin but that just resulted in a green screen in tha outputted file. I don't know if it is something with the laptop I am using or if maybe there is a problem with the card itself.

[SegaSonic91]

Try with dscaler

Thank you, I just tried this program and it looks fantastic BUT it just gives an error when trying to record sound with the capture device as the source, grrrr!

[SegaSonic91]

Do you try capture using UT VIDEO CODEC ULY2??




Claudio

Thank you, I downloaded it and will give it a test run.

[hech54]

I don't know if it is something with the laptop I am using or if maybe there is a problem with the card itself.

This is based on my pure and mostly unfounded bias....but I would always blame a laptop. I know there are now laptops technically more powerful than my PC....but I really do detest laptops.

[SegaSonic91]

Well I am stumped, after adding the suggested codecs and programs etc, it now seems to be capturing perfectly with HuffyUV as well as the ULY2 codec. I will have to try capturing a full LD to see how it turns out before getting too happy.

[jagabo]

The Hauppauge USB Live 2 is a decent card. The ghosting was caused by the device's temporal noise filter being cranked all the way up. And YUY2 isn't a bad thing. It's the closest color format to what's in an analog video signal. It's what you want to capture. Use the capture device's video proc amp settings to adjust levels and colors.

One way to get at all the devices controls is to use GraphStudio. Add the capture filter then right click on it and select Properties. You can then run through the tabs and adjust all the settings. For real time feedback, you can do this "live" while previewing or capturing in another program.

[SegaSonic91]

The Hauppauge USB Live 2 is a decent card. The ghosting was caused by the device's temporal noise filter being cranked all the way up. And YUY2 isn't a bad thing. It's the closest color format to what's in an analog video signal. It's what you want to capture. Use the capture device's video proc amp settings to adjust levels and colors.

One way to get at all the devices controls is to use GraphStudio. Add the capture filter then right click on it and select Properties. You can then run through the tabs and adjust all the settings. For real time feedback, you can do this "live" while previewing or capturing in another program.

Ha, the noise filter is exactly what it was! How stupid do I feel for missing your first reply about that? It's a shame the noise filter causes problems because the picture looks so much better with it on. Even when using a noise remover plugin for post processing it gave some ghosting so I will just do it during the TMPEGenc process. I do know that YUY2 is the correct colour space for LD but I wanted to try others to see if I had the weird colour compression, just as a process of elimination. It seems that it was just another artifact from the noise reduction. Thank you again!

[manono]

It's a shame the noise filter causes problems because the picture looks so much better with it on.

Sure, when nothing's in motion. If you want to noise-filter your videos well, you'd better learn some AviSynth. It has a number of good denoisers that don't cause ghosting. I doubt TMPGEnc has anything good, but I could be wrong as I don't use it.

[SegaSonic91]

It's a shame the noise filter causes problems because the picture looks so much better with it on.

Sure, when nothing's in motion. If you want to noise-filter your videos well, you'd better learn some AviSynth. It has a number of good denoisers that don't cause ghosting. I doubt TMPGEnc has anything good, but I could be wrong as I don't use it.

I have been thinking about getting to know AviSynth but so far I have only briefly looked into it. I am sure it seems more complex than it is and simply a matter of learning how it works and how to make scripts etc. It does seem quite daunting though. I ran a sample capture through TMPGEnc last night and the "precise noise remover" worked quite well but was very slow. It also started to blur background details if it was over 160 or so.

The LD player I am using at moment to do the captures needs a lot of help in the post-process stage to look good. Once I get my CLD-D99 back from being repaired in a month or 2, it will not be as important Once I get back to Japan and buy a LD-S9, it will be even less important again!

[sanlyn]

I doubt TMPGEnc has anything good, but I could be wrong as I don't use it.

It ha some nice RGB color correction filters, but its denoiser is an ancient simple temporal blur job that causes ghosting.

[SegaSonic91]

I doubt TMPGEnc has anything good, but I could be wrong as I don't use it.

It ha some nice RGB color correction filters, but its denoiser is an ancient simple temporal blur job that causes ghosting.

No kidding. The "precise noise removal" just blurs out background details and some forground details if the default is moved even slightly. I really do have to look at AviSynth for this process. What would be the best and/or most used plugin? Also, how much better is AviSynth for y/c seperation/chroma noise reduction, dotcrawl and rainbow removal? Kind of a silly question because I know AviSynth is considered the best program of its kind, but I am wondering if there is a significant improvment or if VDub is "good enough"

I have seen some amazing things done with LD "rips" from downloading MKV files, I just wish I could find a script that could give me those results.