Converting subtitles to closed captions

[ROBO731]

Does anyone kn ow how I can convert ass subtitles to closed captions and then attach them to an mkv file for playback?

[Baldrick]

Do you mean http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Closed_captions ?

Such closed captions are not muxed in the mkv container but is a part of the video data stream.

[ROBO731]

That's what I meant. I don't really know much about closed captions. Do you know how I can add them to the video stream?

[Baldrick]

Do you really need such captions? The wikipedia page mentions vegas....not exactly free.

[ROBO731]

I need them because I just found out through panasonic tech support that my TV doesn't support subtitles (contrary to what it says in the manual). Anyway he said that it only supports closed captions. If here's no free way to do it, then forget about it.

[Baldrick]

Have you tried with external srt subtitles?

Like name the files like video.mkv and video.srt and put them in same folder and play on panasonic. Convert the ass to srt with subtitle workshop.

[ROBO731]

Yeah I already tried it, but it didn't work either.

[usually_quiet]

I need them because I just found out through panasonic tech support that my TV doesn't support subtitles (contrary to what it says in the manual). Anyway he said that it only supports closed captions. If here's no free way to do it, then forget about it.

My LG TV has a USB interface for video playback and does not decode closed captions from files played from a USB stick. Your Panasonic TV might be different, but I have my doubts. External .srt subtitles are probably your best bet, or if your TV supports that option, muxed subtitles in .mkv files.

As far as I know, closed captions can only be added to an SD MPEG-2 video stream (mainly for DVD video) with a few fairly high-end consumer tools. There are no good free tools available for it. Although McPoodles tools (free) has a command line tool for adding closed captions to a MPEG-2 video stream, it never really got past the beta stage and it never worked for me. I have not seen any consumer tools for adding closed captions to HD MPEG-2 video streams because closed captions are strictly a broadcast format when applied to HD video.

[ROBO731]

Oh well. I wasn't that crazy about it anyway. I was told by tech support that it doesn't play subtitles at all, only closed captions. That's why I asked. I've already tried the external srt method, but it doesn't work. looks like my only option once again is to hardsub.

[usually_quiet]

I looked at the Wikipedia article, and it appears that for a few years now both Vegas and Final Cut Pro have allowed the addition of broadcast style N. American closed captions to both SD and HD video . I wasn't aware of that, only DVD authoring software that could add closed captions.

Even if you could add closed captions there would likely be problems decoding and displaying them when using the USB port. There are only three video sources on a TV that are processed by closed caption decoders: video from the tuners (obviously), plus video input from the S-Video connection and video input from the composite connection. The other sources are not processed by a closed caption decoder, because closed captions are either not possible to receive that way, or not expected.

[Cornucopia]

Also, while closed captions were previously expected to be decoded & composited/overlaid by the display device (or sometimes an interim box in the chain), now the expectation is for CC and subs to be decoded & composited by the "player", whether that be DVD/BD, Tuner, or general media player.

If what I think is happening, you TV's internal "player" app doesn't support subs like you said, then you option COULD be to go to CCs, but it could just as easily be solved by using a separate player (such as a general media player) that supports subs.

Scott

[handyguy]

I'm not sure what you are trying to do. I'm Deaf & this kind of thing doesn't seem to make sense to me.
Best thing for you to do is just connect your computer to your TV. Use VLC to play anything with subs & CC's.

[jman98]

I'm not sure what you are trying to do.

Basically he's another person who didn't know or realize that his TV's media player capabilities were a LOT more limited than he thought they would be and he was hoping for an easy work around to the problem of not being able to use subtitles with it.

The fact is that TV media players are basically crap and you're better off to just buy some kind of small form factor player like a Western Digital or similar model and leave the crap media player in the TV alone.

[ROBO731]

Also, while closed captions were previously expected to be decoded & composited/overlaid by the display device (or sometimes an interim box in the chain), now the expectation is for CC and subs to be decoded & composited by the "player", whether that be DVD/BD, Tuner, or general media player.

If what I think is happening, you TV's internal "player" app doesn't support subs like you said, then you option COULD be to go to CCs, but it could just as easily be solved by using a separate player (such as a general media player) that supports subs.

Scott

Well I'm looking for a free solution. By "using a separate player (such as a general media player) that supports subs" are you referring to something like western digital?

I'm not sure what you are trying to do.

Basically he's another person who didn't know or realize that his TV's media player capabilities were a LOT more limited than he thought they would be and he was hoping for an easy work around to the problem of not being able to use subtitles with it.

The fact is that TV media players are basically crap and you're better off to just buy some kind of small form factor player like a Western Digital or similar model and leave the crap media player in the TV alone.

Basically your wrong. I was surprised by how much the media player could actually do. It does everything I need except for displaying subtitles, which was implied that it could. It's a great media player, It supports every codec and format that I use/need. The only problem is that it doesn't display subtitles.

[poisondeathray]

EDIT: nevermind, I just repeated above suggestion with SRT subs (<= me stoopid)

[Cornucopia]

Also, while closed captions were previously expected to be decoded & composited/overlaid by the display device (or sometimes an interim box in the chain), now the expectation is for CC and subs to be decoded & composited by the "player", whether that be DVD/BD, Tuner, or general media player.

If what I think is happening, you TV's internal "player" app doesn't support subs like you said, then you option COULD be to go to CCs, but it could just as easily be solved by using a separate player (such as a general media player) that supports subs.

Scott

Well I'm looking for a free solution. By "using a separate player (such as a general media player) that supports subs" are you referring to something like western digital?

I'm not sure what you are trying to do.

Basically he's another person who didn't know or realize that his TV's media player capabilities were a LOT more limited than he thought they would be and he was hoping for an easy work around to the problem of not being able to use subtitles with it.

The fact is that TV media players are basically crap and you're better off to just buy some kind of small form factor player like a Western Digital or similar model and leave the crap media player in the TV alone.

Basically your wrong. I was surprised by how much the media player could actually do. It does everything I need except for displaying subtitles, which was implied that it could. It's a great media player, It supports every codec and format that I use/need. The only problem is that it doesn't display subtitles.

1. Yes (I was referring to WD or similar device)

2. I wouldn't go so far as to say they're "crap". But if it can't do subs, and you NEED subs, it's insufficient for your needs, right? Media players these days have better support for subs than they do for CCs, so I doubt going that route would work out best for you. That's another reason why I suggest a dedicated media player box. You could always go with an HTPC...

Scott

[usually_quiet]

Basically your wrong. I was surprised by how much the media player could actually do. It does everything I need except for displaying subtitles, which was implied that it could. It's a great media player, It supports every codec and format that I use/need. The only problem is that it doesn't display subtitles.

Out of curiosity, what model of Panasonic TV are we talking about here? It seems strange that it does not allow subtitles but plays many types of media files.

I'm happy with my LG TV as a media player too, but I tested it before I bought it to make sure it could play what I needed it to, .wtv files that I edited and converted to .mpg or .ts, as well as .srt subtitles. (It won't play Unicode encoded .srt subs, but ANSI works.).

Even a good stand alone media player like the latest WD model can't do it all. People who want a media player that plays everything need to use a computer as their media player.

[usually_quiet]

I just took a look at a manual for a Panasonic plasma TV, model TC-P42X5, to see what it said about file playback. It doesn't support subtitles of any kind.

The only explanation I can come up with is that Panasonic expects the USB connection to be used only for watching home movies, which rarely use subtitles.

If you have or are are in the market for a Blu-Ray player, some of them play media via USB. That would be another option if you need a multi-purpose device. They too are less versatile than dedicated a media player, so you will need to verify that a given model can play what you need it to play.

[ROBO731]

It's a Panasonic TC-L42E50 It specifically says that it doesn't support subtitles for mkvs. That kind of inplies that it supports subtitles for other formats. Maybe I will go with a western digital type of solution.

[usually_quiet]

It's a Panasonic TC-L42E50 It specifically says that it doesn't support subtitles for mkvs. That kind of inplies that it supports subtitles for other formats. Maybe I will go with a western digital type of solution.

Although the PDF manual for the plasma TV I looked at also says "Subtitles are not supported in MKV file", it never mentions the word "subtitle" anywhere else. Neither does the manual for your TV.

Comparing that to the the manual for my LG TV, which does support subtitles, I didn't come away with the same conclusion that you did. I concluded that Panasonic does not support subtitles. The manual for my LG TV mentions subtitles in several places, and spells out what kind of subtitles it supports, just like it spells out what kinds of video and audio it supports.

[ROBO731]

I never said you were wrong. I did completely assume that it supported subtitles in other formats based on the information it gave me.

[usually_quiet]

I never said you were wrong. I did completely assume that it supported subtitles in other formats based on the information it gave me.

We've all made equally bad assumptions ... At least you have decided on a work around now. Good Luck

[ROBO731]

Thanks.

[handyguy]

It is interesting that Blu Ray doesn't do CC's only subtitles.

[usually_quiet]

It is interesting that Blu Ray doesn't do CC's only subtitles.

That is because laws in N. America only require CCs for broadcast TV. CCs on VHS, and DVD were always optional. Plus, everyone else in the world has relied on subtitles for the Deaf and hard of hearing on DVD for a long time, and manages fairly well with that.

Including closed captions in the Blu-Ray spec would require that the player add captions to the picture, instead of the TV. Line 21 closed captions as we know them from DVD, which the TV displays, won't work for Blu-Ray. Line 21 captions are strictly analog, so HDMI can't support them. Progressive analog video (from component video connections) doesn't support them either. The only connections on a Blu-Ray player that do support Line 21 closed captions are Composite, and S-Video, but they won't be allowed on Blu-Ray players much longer. ALL analog connections on Blu-Ray are to be removed by 2014 per AACS licensing.

[ROBO731]

It is interesting that Blu Ray doesn't do CC's only subtitles.

That is because laws in N. America only require CCs for broadcast TV. CCs on VHS, and DVD were always optional. Plus, everyone else in the world has relied on subtitles for the Deaf and hard of hearing on DVD for a long time, and manages fairly well with that.

Including closed captions in the Blu-Ray spec would require that the player add captions to the picture, instead of the TV. Line 21 closed captions as we know them from DVD, which the TV displays, won't work for Blu-Ray. Line 21 captions are strictly analog, so HDMI can't support them. Progressive analog video (from component video connections) doesn't support them either. The only connections on a Blu-Ray player that do support Line 21 closed captions are Composite, and S-Video, but they won't be allowed on Blu-Ray players much longer. ALL analog connections on Blu-Ray are to be removed by 2014 per AACS licensing.

That's interesting. I didn't really know any of that.