Mixing different kinds of HD video in one project with Sony Vegas Pro 11

[liberty610]

Hi guys,

I have a question/issue with my current HD video editing in Sony Vegas Pro 11 (64bit - Windows 7 Ultimate 64bit).

I currently have 2 different kinds of HD video I am editing. I have files from a Samsung Galaxy S3 smart phone, and files from a Cannon HV30 cam corder.

The Galaxy S3 files, in the details section of the file, says it is a 1920 by 1080 video with a frame rate of 30 frames/second. Audio is at 125kbps at 48kHz. My Canon HV30 video camera files say they are at 1440 x 1080 at 29 frames/second. Audio is at 384kbps at 48kHz. These are what the windows basic file properties say.

Now, in Vegas, I get something some what different.

Galaxy S3 files say:
Streams
Video: 00:00:43.575, 120.000 fps progressive, 1920x1080x12, AVC
Audio: 00:00:43.691, 48,000 Hz, Stereo, AAC

While the Cannon HV30 files say:
Streams
Video: 00:03:06.086, 29.970 fps interlaced, 1440x1080x12, MPEG-2
Audio: 00:03:06.086, 48,000 Hz, Stereo, MPEG Layer 2


Now, I have tried render tests on these, and for the most part, if I render the HV30 files alone, they are fine. I match all the file settings to my project, and have no issues with playback.

However, I rendered a couple files together with the Glaxy S3 files, and I am not sure if I rendered it wqith the right settings. The Vegas details say they are 120fps and are progressive. I tried a couple render tests, and they start out playing ok in both VLC media player and Windows Media Player, but when you scrub ahead or backwards, the video freezes or lags really bad. This is when i rendered them using the Vegas template of AVCHD 1920x1080 60i. Any ideas why they don't play back as smoothly as the original files?

Also, if I have a project with both file types, how would I go about rendering them with one being 1490x1080 interlaced frames and the other being 1920x1080 progressive?

Thanks in advance for any help!

[aedipuss]

looks like vegas can't handle the s3 files. no way are they 120p. you may need to convert them to something else before using in vegas.

hv30 files work fine. use the project settings for hdv 30i.

or shoot with the hv30 in progressive mode for 30p. unless you are shooting for output onto dvd in which case leave it set to 30i.

use the free program mediainfo in text mode and paste the results from an s3 video.

[Cornucopia]

While it is POSSIBLE to have both items on a single timeline, you won't get OPTIMAL output doing that.

In EVERY scenario, if you are combining the 2 types of camera outputs, you will HAVE to match one to the other (or vice-versa). BTW, it is a very good idea to use Mediainfo like aedipuss suggests, as it gives you more and clearer (and usually more accurate) info than Vegas (and certainly moreso than Windows!).

Your choice is: which is the best to reference to? Galaxy S3? or Canon HV30? or something else? I think this depends on your output. As aedipuss says, DVD would probably best be served as Interlaced, thus reference with the Canon footage. I would also add broadcast 1080i to this category. Is this going to film/cinema projection output? If so, that will make things more difficult and you'd probably have to do a Telecine from the Interlaced reference. Otherwise, 1080p probably makes sense.

BTW the HDV from the HV30 shows 1440x1080, but those are anamorphic (wide) pixels, so the image should fill a standard 1920x1080 screen.

How to match these is another matter: Vegas is good, but not nearly the best at processing video. For times like this, Virtualdub & AVISynth are much better suited for hi-quality conversion. IIWY, I'd convert both from their original formats to either a Lossless (Like HuffYUV, Lagarith) or "Visually Lossless" Lossy AVI (Cineform, DNxHD), both for their generational robustness, but also because they are Intra-frame only options (compared to either your AVC or your HDV material which are Interframe-based). In AVISynth or Vdub, there are a number of more capable ways to either convert to interlace or to de-interlace, compared to Vegas's 3 so-so choices. Similarly with resize and colorspace conversion options.

That's a start...

Scott

[liberty610]

Thanks for the amazing replies guys. I'll download these right away and see what I can come up with. If I have any further issues, I'll post another response! Thanks again so much!

[liberty610]

Ok, so I downloaded virtualdub and AVIsynth and I am totally confused as to how they work together. I am use to more of a standard program type of thing, to where this seems a little more open source style and confusing to me. Can anyone point me to a youtube video or an online instruction manual as to how to use these together to convert mu videos?

I have never done anything like this before.

[liberty610]

Any direction to help me out?

[TreeTops]

Posting the Mediainfo would allow the experts here to maybe help you. But you aren't listening.

[liberty610]

No one ask me to post the details from Mediainfo. The suggestions that where made, where to use AVIsynth and Virtualdub to convert the mp4s into a lossless file. In which I replied my confusion with using those two programs to do the conversion.

[TreeTops]

Re-read post #2 & #3. Look carefully for the word mediainfo. On my browser those words are in RED.

[liberty610]

Wow.

General
Format : MPEG-4
Format profile : Base Media
Codec ID : isom
File size : 89.0 MiB
Duration : 43s 691ms
Overall bit rate : 17.1 Mbps
Encoded date : UTC 2012-11-06 13:47:31
Tagged date : UTC 2012-11-06 13:47:31

Video
ID : 1
Format : AVC
Format/Info : Advanced Video Codec
Format profile : High@L4.0
Format settings, CABAC : Yes
Format settings, ReFrames : 1 frame
Format settings, GOP : M=1, N=30
Codec ID : avc1
Codec ID/Info : Advanced Video Coding
Duration : 43s 591ms
Source duration : 43s 594ms
Bit rate : 17.0 Mbps
Width : 1 920 pixels
Height : 1 080 pixels
Display aspect ratio : 16:9
Frame rate mode : Variable
Frame rate : 30.000 fps
Minimum frame rate : 27.616 fps
Maximum frame rate : 31.024 fps
Color space : YUV
Chroma subsampling : 4:2:0
Bit depth : 8 bits
Scan type : Progressive
Bits/(Pixel*Frame) : 0.273
Stream size : 88.4 MiB (99%)
Source stream size : 88.4 MiB (99%)
Title : VideoHandle
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2012-11-06 13:47:31
Tagged date : UTC 2012-11-06 13:47:31
mdhd_Duration : 43591

Audio
ID : 2
Format : AAC
Format/Info : Advanced Audio Codec
Format profile : LC
Codec ID : 40
Duration : 43s 691ms
Bit rate mode : Constant
Bit rate : 128 Kbps
Channel(s) : 2 channels
Channel positions : Front: L R
Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
Compression mode : Lossy
Stream size : 675 KiB (1%)
Title : SoundHandle
Language : English
Encoded date : UTC 2012-11-06 13:47:31
Tagged date : UTC 2012-11-06 13:47:31

[Cornucopia]

Well, that covers one clip (but which one?), but not the other...

Already I see a problem with handling VFR in the works.

Scott

[liberty610]

That clip is from the galaxy S3.

[smrpix]

Cel phone videos aren't optimized for editing (understatement.) Their target is quick sharing.

My 2 cents: do as aedipuss says and set up your project to match the HDV footage.
Avisynth and Virtualdub are the "best" way to do it but the VFR handling as Cornucopia notes will be a bigger ride than you appear to want to deal with just now.

You also don't state what your non-HDV render settings were or more importantly, how you intend to view the finished project.