burning non-HD content recorded on HD receiver

[kschwi]

I have a Toshiba DVD Video Recorder model DR410
http://reviews.cnet.com/dvd-recorders/toshiba-d-r410/4505-9141_7-32909146.html

I think that is the model. I think I remember reading it had some upconverting capabilities when I bought it. I just not upgraded my Dishnetwork satellite receiver from a SD 622 to a HD-722s receiver and now have HD programming and channles. I have a Sony Bravia HD-TV. Occassionally I will burn some sports games to DVD.

I was curious. There was a game I burned to DVD that I DVRed using my SD receiver. One of the Sports Networks replayed that game a month or so ago and this time I DVRed it using my HD receiver. The game was from Jan of 2005 so I assume it was in HD. Now even though my Toshiba DVD Recorder is not a HD recorder shouldn't there be an improvement over what I burned when I DVRed it using the SD receiver? Does the HD receiver use a higher resolution? I ask because I am not sure I notice a difference. They both look like they are widescreen and the quality looks similar. Do I lose all resolution improvements when I burn the recording using my Toshiba DVD recorder?

One more question. Now when I DVR shows that were broadcast in SD they are shown in pillar box with rectangles to each side on my widescreen HD TV. When I burn those recordings to a disk they look as they did when I would play back the program with the pillar box. I was actually surprised however, when I played that disk on an old non-HD TV that was not a wide screen TV it still had the pillarbox. Not sure why that was. Shouldn't the DVD recording fill an old TV screen?

[kschwi]

Did I place this in the wrong forum here? Was my question not clear? Do you need more information. I was wondering if there was something I need to fix.

I probably did mis-title my topic but that cannot be edited.

[usually_quiet]

I have a Toshiba DVD Video Recorder model DR410
http://reviews.cnet.com/dvd-recorders/toshiba-d-r410/4505-9141_7-32909146.html

I think that is the model. I think I remember reading it had some upconverting capabilities when I bought it. I just not upgraded my Dishnetwork satellite receiver from a SD 622 to a HD-722s receiver and now have HD programming and channles. I have a Sony Bravia HD-TV. Occassionally I will burn some sports games to DVD.

I was curious. There was a game I burned to DVD that I DVRed using my SD receiver. One of the Sports Networks replayed that game a month or so ago and this time I DVRed it using my HD receiver. The game was from Jan of 2005 so I assume it was in HD. Now even though my Toshiba DVD Recorder is not a HD recorder shouldn't there be an improvement over what I burned when I DVRed it using the SD receiver? Does the HD receiver use a higher resolution? I ask because I am not sure I notice a difference. They both look like they are widescreen and the quality looks similar. Do I lose all resolution improvements when I burn the recording using my Toshiba DVD recorder?

Recordings from your DVD recorder will never look the same as the original HD picture. The recorder only records in standard definition, from standard definition analog input. The recording mode you choose may also reduce quality. Upconverting makes the picture larger and perhaps sharper but can't add information that was not present in the original recording.

One more question. Now when I DVR shows that were broadcast in SD they are shown in pillar box with rectangles to each side on my widescreen HD TV. When I burn those recordings to a disk they look as they did when I would play back the program with the pillar box. I was actually surprised however, when I played that disk on an old non-HD TV that was not a wide screen TV it still had the pillarbox. Not sure why that was. Shouldn't the DVD recording fill an old TV screen?

It looks like you recorded an anamorphic 16:9 picture, and that is why you have pillarboxes on an old TV srcreen. The pillarboxes are a part of the picture, and the player squeezes the entire 16:9 picture into a 4:3 frame.

[sanlyn]

Can't answer all those questions, as I don't have your 722s. The SD pillarbox appears to be in the original recording, which is likely flagged for 16:9 playback.

Would also ask, how do you "burn" a DVD recording from your receiver using the Toshiba? Also, did you tell your Toshiba that your "old" SD TV was a 16:9 TV, a 4:3 TV, or is there a setting to automatically interpret the recording's playback image?

I'm surprised that the output from your DVR isn't encrypted as copy-once or never-copy in the first place. With the s-video or composite output from many HD boxes, SD shows up as pillared and letterboxed, with a tiny frame in the middle of the screen!!!

[kschwi]

I have a Toshiba DVD Video Recorder model DR410
http://reviews.cnet.com/dvd-recorders/toshiba-d-r410/4505-9141_7-32909146.html

I think that is the model. I think I remember reading it had some upconverting capabilities when I bought it. I just not upgraded my Dishnetwork satellite receiver from a SD 622 to a HD-722s receiver and now have HD programming and channles. I have a Sony Bravia HD-TV. Occassionally I will burn some sports games to DVD.

I was curious. There was a game I burned to DVD that I DVRed using my SD receiver. One of the Sports Networks replayed that game a month or so ago and this time I DVRed it using my HD receiver. The game was from Jan of 2005 so I assume it was in HD. Now even though my Toshiba DVD Recorder is not a HD recorder shouldn't there be an improvement over what I burned when I DVRed it using the SD receiver? Does the HD receiver use a higher resolution? I ask because I am not sure I notice a difference. They both look like they are widescreen and the quality looks similar. Do I lose all resolution improvements when I burn the recording using my Toshiba DVD recorder?

Recordings from your DVD recorder will never look the same as the original HD picture. The recorder only records in standard definition, from standard definition analog input. The recording mode you choose may also reduce quality. Upconverting makes the picture larger and perhaps sharper but can't add information that was not present in the original recording.

Thanks for your reply. I do realize they won't look the same as on my HD TV but was curious if the quality would be better if I was using a HD receiver. I'm not sure that is the case here but perhaps I didn't compare the two long enough.

One more question. Now when I DVR shows that were broadcast in SD they are shown in pillar box with rectangles to each side on my widescreen HD TV. When I burn those recordings to a disk they look as they did when I would play back the program with the pillar box. I was actually surprised however, when I played that disk on an old non-HD TV that was not a wide screen TV it still had the pillarbox. Not sure why that was. Shouldn't the DVD recording fill an old TV screen?

It looks like you recorded an anamorphic 16:9 picture, and that is why you have pillarboxes on an old TV srcreen. The pillarboxes are a part of the picture, and the player squeezes the entire 16:9 picture into a 4:3 frame.

I have a choice whether to view in 16:9 or 4:3. The recording I was referring to was an SD recording so I believe if my understanding is correct the channel broadcasts it 4:3 with the pillar box. While that looks fine on my widescreen TV it looks pretty silly on an old TV that is not a HD TV (are those called analog TVs?). Maybe I should have asked if I should burn change to 4:3 before I burn to DVD or do I lose something even if it is in SD?

[kschwi]

Can't answer all those questions, as I don't have your 722s. The SD pillarbox appears to be in the original recording, which is likely flagged for 16:9 playback.

Would also ask, how do you "burn" a DVD recording from your receiver using the Toshiba? Also, did you tell your Toshiba that your "old" SD TV was a 16:9 TV, a 4:3 TV, or is there a setting to automatically interpret the recording's playback image?

I'm surprised that the output from your DVR isn't encrypted as copy-once or never-copy in the first place. With the s-video or composite output from many HD boxes, SD shows up as pillared and letterboxed, with a tiny frame in the middle of the screen!!!

I haven't looked at my setup in a few years but basically I believe my DVD Recorder is hooked up to my Dishnetworl receiver which has a DVR featue. I play the program I have DVRed using my satellite receiver and then insert a blank DVD-R into the DVD recorder and hit record. I can look at the cables when I get home if that is helpful. I think with the old setup I had a S-video cable connecting the DVD recorded to the receiver but might have a component cable now or even HDMI.

As to your last comment I think movies on HBO etc will not show in HD if the DVD recorder is on. I can DVR the movie or program if the input is set up to HDMI instead of component 1 which is the setting I use when the DVD recorder is playing a DVD.

[usually_quiet]

Can't answer all those questions, as I don't have your 722s. The SD pillarbox appears to be in the original recording, which is likely flagged for 16:9 playback.

Would also ask, how do you "burn" a DVD recording from your receiver using the Toshiba? Also, did you tell your Toshiba that your "old" SD TV was a 16:9 TV, a 4:3 TV, or is there a setting to automatically interpret the recording's playback image?

I'm surprised that the output from your DVR isn't encrypted as copy-once or never-copy in the first place. With the s-video or composite output from many HD boxes, SD shows up as pillared and letterboxed, with a tiny frame in the middle of the screen!!!

The recording itself might only be flagged as 4:3, even if the recorded video is anamorphic 16:9. NTSC doesn't provide a way for the DVD recorder to know what aspect ratio it is receiving via its analog inputs. The aspect ratio flags assigned to recordings are controlled by settings, at best. Some recorders don't provide an option for flagging recordings as 16:9 during recording. Every recording is flagged as 4:3.

The aspect ratio flags don't matter much when using an HDTV, because they can override the aspect ratio. For correct display on an old analog SDTV, the aspect ratio needs to be changed to 16:9. This requires importing the DVD files and folders into a computer, using software to correct the flags, and burning a new DVD.

[usually_quiet]

I have a choice whether to view in 16:9 or 4:3. The recording I was referring to was an SD recording so I believe if my understanding is correct the channel broadcasts it 4:3 with the pillar box. While that looks fine on my widescreen TV it looks pretty silly on an old TV that is not a HD TV (are those called analog TVs?). Maybe I should have asked if I should burn change to 4:3 before I burn to DVD or do I lose something even if it is in SD?

Whether you realize it or not, you recorded a 16:9 aspect ratio picture. If the pillarboxes were not encoded part of the original picture, you wouldn't be seeing them now on your SD TV.

[sanlyn]

So, in fact you didn't "burn" (copy) from your DVR to your Toshiba. You recorded -- which means you re-encoded the program. Then, yes, you would lose quality by re-encoding. AFAIK you can't "copy" from a DVR to a DVD recorder. I'm surprised you can't see a difference.

[kschwi]

I have a choice whether to view in 16:9 or 4:3. The recording I was referring to was an SD recording so I believe if my understanding is correct the channel broadcasts it 4:3 with the pillar box. While that looks fine on my widescreen TV it looks pretty silly on an old TV that is not a HD TV (are those called analog TVs?). Maybe I should have asked if I should burn change to 4:3 before I burn to DVD or do I lose something even if it is in SD?

Whether you realize it or not, you recorded a 16:9 aspect ratio picture. If the pillarboxes were not encoded part of the original picture, you wouldn't be seeing them now on your SD TV.

Thanks again for your reply. Makes sense since my HD receiver is set to 16:9. So if I change the settings in my DVR receiver to 4:3 it will show up as full screen on the analag SD TV. However, is there a downside for doing so? Will the quality suffer if I view the DVD on the HD TV? Will the quality differ on the SD-TV? Part of the reason I was posting this was to determine what I should do in the future for burning Non-HD programming that a network broadcasts in pillarbox.

[kschwi]

So, in fact you didn't "burn" (copy) from your DVR to your Toshiba. You recorded -- which means you re-encoded the program. Then, yes, you would lose quality by re-encoding. AFAIK you can't "copy" from a DVR to a DVD recorder. I'm surprised you can't see a difference.

Yes, correct. I'll compare the recordings again later in the week when I have more time. Since my Toshiba is not an HD DVD recorder I knew I was going to lose some quality but still thought the disk burned/encoded from the HD receiver would be better than the same recording DVRed with my SD Dish receiver.

I probably should have had two threads since I have two different questions but thanks for your help.

[sanlyn]

Well, yes, different resolutions would be part of the effect (plus a tv upsampling on playback), and re-encoding compounds the loss.

[usually_quiet]

I have a choice whether to view in 16:9 or 4:3. The recording I was referring to was an SD recording so I believe if my understanding is correct the channel broadcasts it 4:3 with the pillar box. While that looks fine on my widescreen TV it looks pretty silly on an old TV that is not a HD TV (are those called analog TVs?). Maybe I should have asked if I should burn change to 4:3 before I burn to DVD or do I lose something even if it is in SD?

Whether you realize it or not, you recorded a 16:9 aspect ratio picture. If the pillarboxes were not encoded part of the original picture, you wouldn't be seeing them now on your SD TV.

Thanks again for your reply. Makes sense since my HD receiver is set to 16:9. So if I change the settings in my DVR receiver to 4:3 it will show up as full screen on the analag SD TV. However, is there a downside for doing so? Will the quality suffer if I view the DVD on the HD TV? Will the quality differ on the SD-TV? Part of the reason I was posting this was to determine what I should do in the future for burning Non-HD programming that a network broadcasts in pillarbox.

If this is an SD channel with a 4:3 aspect ratio, the picture could look a little better than it did when you used 16:9 output from the receiver. The black pillar boxes did consume some pixels. Using a 4:3 aspect ratio for the output, all the pixels will now be allocated for the picture.

[Edit]I think I missed something in your post. If the network is broadcasting an old 4:3 SD TV show, lets say "Cheers", with pillarbox bars added to pad the picture to 16:9, you are stuck with them in the recording the DVD recorder makes. I don't think your DVR will do pan-and-scan output to remove pillarbox bars from its standard definition output. What it will probably do instead is add letterbox bars to the top and bottom to make the picture 4:3. For this situation, stick with 16:9 output from the DVR.

[kschwi]

I have a choice whether to view in 16:9 or 4:3. The recording I was referring to was an SD recording so I believe if my understanding is correct the channel broadcasts it 4:3 with the pillar box. While that looks fine on my widescreen TV it looks pretty silly on an old TV that is not a HD TV (are those called analog TVs?). Maybe I should have asked if I should burn change to 4:3 before I burn to DVD or do I lose something even if it is in SD?

Whether you realize it or not, you recorded a 16:9 aspect ratio picture. If the pillarboxes were not encoded part of the original picture, you wouldn't be seeing them now on your SD TV.

Thanks again for your reply. Makes sense since my HD receiver is set to 16:9. So if I change the settings in my DVR receiver to 4:3 it will show up as full screen on the analag SD TV. However, is there a downside for doing so? Will the quality suffer if I view the DVD on the HD TV? Will the quality differ on the SD-TV? Part of the reason I was posting this was to determine what I should do in the future for burning Non-HD programming that a network broadcasts in pillarbox.

If this is an SD channel with a 4:3 aspect ratio, the picture could look a little better than it did when you used 16:9 output from the receiver. The black pillar boxes did consume some pixels. Using a 4:3 aspect ratio for the output, all the pixels will now be allocated for the picture.

[Edit]I think I missed something in your post. If the network is broadcasting an old 4:3 SD TV show, lets say "Cheers", with pillarbox bars added to pad the picture to 16:9, you are stuck with them in the recording the DVD recorder makes. I don't think your DVR will do pan-and-scan output to remove pillarbox bars from its standard definition output. What it will probably do instead is add letterbox bars to the top and bottom to make the picture 4:3. For this situation, stick with 16:9 output from the DVR.

For some odd reason there are two 4x3 settings on the Dish Receiver. The first one leaves the screen with the pillarbox bars. The other setting 4x3 #2 does fill a wide screen TV. Any idea if it is zooming or stretching the picture to do so?

[kschwi]

So, in fact you didn't "burn" (copy) from your DVR to your Toshiba. You recorded -- which means you re-encoded the program. Then, yes, you would lose quality by re-encoding. AFAIK you can't "copy" from a DVR to a DVD recorder. I'm surprised you can't see a difference.

I checked again and I do see a difference on my HDTV. The disk burned that was DVRed with the HD receiver does look better than the one DVRed with a SD receiver.

[sanlyn]

Because my cable company now requires a digital box for all cable reception, I'm stuck with recording only 4:3 thru the boxes. There was a time when I could record right off the cable line (getting only non-scrambled channels, of course) and everything was 4:3 off the box with letterbox on 16:9 broadcasts. The RD-XS34 is a competent machine, so zooming a letterboxed 16:9 to display full screen was not that much of a problem. From 7 feet away, I saw ittle difference. But that's a signal straight off the line, not thru the box.

For a few years I had an expensive HD cable tuner with a nifty feature. It allowed me to send out a 16:9 image thru s-video, but I could squish the image into a 4:3 frame. I'd record the squished guy on my Toshiba, but I set the recording flag for 16:9. Voila! On an HDTV it played back 16:9 full screen and looked pretty darn good. Alas, Cablevision encrypted all their channels, so the $280 tuner is now useless. I now have to record only thru my old SD digital box or the new HD box. I posted images of what I used to get be able to record, compared to what I'd record now with wide-screen thru that HD box: https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/340688-YAVHSR-%28Yet-Another-VHS-Restoral%29-LILI?p...=1#post2120833

I'm still pissed about it. My new PC and HD PVR will solve that problem, but it was a pain the neck....and in the wallet.

[usually_quiet]

I have a choice whether to view in 16:9 or 4:3. The recording I was referring to was an SD recording so I believe if my understanding is correct the channel broadcasts it 4:3 with the pillar box. While that looks fine on my widescreen TV it looks pretty silly on an old TV that is not a HD TV (are those called analog TVs?). Maybe I should have asked if I should burn change to 4:3 before I burn to DVD or do I lose something even if it is in SD?

Whether you realize it or not, you recorded a 16:9 aspect ratio picture. If the pillarboxes were not encoded part of the original picture, you wouldn't be seeing them now on your SD TV.

Thanks again for your reply. Makes sense since my HD receiver is set to 16:9. So if I change the settings in my DVR receiver to 4:3 it will show up as full screen on the analag SD TV. However, is there a downside for doing so? Will the quality suffer if I view the DVD on the HD TV? Will the quality differ on the SD-TV? Part of the reason I was posting this was to determine what I should do in the future for burning Non-HD programming that a network broadcasts in pillarbox.

If this is an SD channel with a 4:3 aspect ratio, the picture could look a little better than it did when you used 16:9 output from the receiver. The black pillar boxes did consume some pixels. Using a 4:3 aspect ratio for the output, all the pixels will now be allocated for the picture.

[Edit]I think I missed something in your post. If the network is broadcasting an old 4:3 SD TV show, lets say "Cheers", with pillarbox bars added to pad the picture to 16:9, you are stuck with them in the recording the DVD recorder makes. I don't think your DVR will do pan-and-scan output to remove pillarbox bars from its standard definition output. What it will probably do instead is add letterbox bars to the top and bottom to make the picture 4:3. For this situation, stick with 16:9 output from the DVR.

For some odd reason there are two 4x3 settings on the Dish Receiver. The first one leaves the screen with the pillarbox bars. The other setting 4x3 #2 does fill a wide screen TV. Any idea if it is zooming or stretching the picture to do so?

I downloaded a Dish Network DVR manual. It says the following:

While in this menu, select the Aspect Ratio option that matches your TV:
• 16x9 is the setting for a wide-screen HDTV display.
• 4x3 #1 is the setting to use on a 4x3 TV which uses vertical compression. When
viewing a 16x9 program using this setting, a compatible TV automatically makes the
picture in letterbox format (with black bars across the top and bottom of the screen), to
preserve the correct horizontal and vertical proportions of the wide-screen HD image.
• 4x3 #2 is the setting to use on a standard 4x3 TV which does not use internal vertical
compression. When viewing a 16x9 program on such a TV, black bars at the top and
bottom will not be displayed, and a high-definition image will appear tall and skinny.

4x3 #2 squeezes the picture horizontally. Since it looks like 4x3 #2 would produce output equivalent to anamorphic widescreen for 16:9 recordings, you should use it when capturing a DVR recording made from an HD channel with your DVD recorder.

I'm not certain what will happen when you are viewing an actual standard definition channel using setting 4x3 #2. I have no way to test it.

[sanlyn]

If you get the squished 4:3 recording, it has to be flagged for 16:9 playback. Unfortunately, the HD from my cable company won't perform that little squishing job. Bummer. But that's what my expensive HD tuner used to do.

[kschwi]

Still trying to rap my head around this. I understand why in normal mode it shows up pillarboxed on a HD TV. Then when I burn it to DVD it shows up pillarboxed as well. What confuses me most is that if I were to watch one of these recordings I ripped to DvD on a non-HD TV (Which sometimes SD recordings look better on non-HD TV) the picture is still pillarboxed. I guess because that is how it was initially burned but it would be nice if somehow that was not the case. I did not have that problem with my old SD DVR using the same HD TV.

[yoda313]

I ripped to DvD on a non-HD TV (Which sometimes SD recordings look better on non-HD TV) the picture is still pillarboxed.

That might be a function of the dvd player itself. Since you are using a non hdtv for this the dvd player is driving the picture source.

Look for something in the menu to change it from widescreen to full screen. There might also be some "pan and scan" jargon depending on the lingo your dvd player manufacture uses.

In any event this will be driven by the dvd player and check for the full screen/widescreen settings.

Good luck.

[kschwi]

I ripped to DvD on a non-HD TV (Which sometimes SD recordings look better on non-HD TV) the picture is still pillarboxed.

That might be a function of the dvd player itself. Since you are using a non hdtv for this the dvd player is driving the picture source.

Look for something in the menu to change it from widescreen to full screen. There might also be some "pan and scan" jargon depending on the lingo your dvd player manufacture uses.

In any event this will be driven by the dvd player and check for the full screen/widescreen settings.

Good luck.

I want to clarify. My new HD-DVR is attached to an HD TV. I had a SD DVR that was attached to the same HD TV. I like to burn these old SD recordings of shows/games from the 70s and 80s to DVD and then watch then on a different DVD player attached to an old SD TV because it seems to me SD recordings often look better on old SD TVs.

So are you saying to look for something on the DVD player attached to SD TV's settings to adjust? I don't want it full screen on a SD TV if that will stretch or zoom the picture. I was able to do this before (watch without pillar boxes on the SD TV)when I burned to DVD with the SD DVR and I don't think it stretched or zoomed anything.

[sanlyn]

DVD players usually have a setting for "TV display size" or similar words. Usually I see only 2 choices: 4:3 or 16:9 -- or sometime they call it "square" and "wide", or some such nonsense. Then they sometimes complicate matters with a second setting for "output format", just to make things difficult. Mainly, you want to tell your DVD player that it is NOT playing to a wide-screen TV.

But I suspect that many broadcasters today are sending a 4:3 image inside a 16:9 image (pillarboxed). So your 4:3 image is inside a 16:9 frame and is being recorded that way by your HD-DVR. So, if you play that 16:9 frame into an SD TV, the 16x9 frame gets letterboxed in the 4:3 TV.

Now, consider how an SD DVD recorder would record the same image-within-a-box thru your HD box's analog outputs! Problems galore.

[kschwi]

DVD players usually have a setting for "TV display size" or similar words. Usually I see only 2 choices: 4:3 or 16:9 -- or sometime they call it "square" and "wide", or some such nonsense. Then they sometimes complicate matters with a second setting for "output format", just to make things difficult. Mainly, you want to tell your DVD player that it is NOT playing to a wide-screen TV.

But I suspect that many broadcasters today are sending a 4:3 image inside a 16:9 image (pillarboxed). So your 4:3 image is inside a 16:9 frame and is being recorded that way by your HD-DVR. So, if you play that 16:9 frame into an SD TV, the 16x9 frame gets letterboxed in the 4:3 TV.

Now, consider how an SD DVD recorder would record the same image-within-a-box thru your HD box's analog outputs! Problems galore.

I think HD channels send a 16x9 image pillarboxed but SD channels don't. I tried messing around with the DVD player connected to the SD TV and I couldn't make it change to full screen. Once it gets burned in pillarbox on DVD burner connected to the HD TV it must burned the pillarboxes to the image.

I have a third TV that is an old SD TV hooked up to our satellite and when I watch these programs I DVRed they aren't pillalboxed. Unforuntately there isn't a receiver attached to it so I can hook up my DVD recorder to it. How does it know to show those full screen?

[Mike.H_DISH]

DVD players usually have a setting for "TV display size" or similar words. Usually I see only 2 choices: 4:3 or 16:9 -- or sometime they call it "square" and "wide", or some such nonsense. Then they sometimes complicate matters with a second setting for "output format", just to make things difficult. Mainly, you want to tell your DVD player that it is NOT playing to a wide-screen TV.

But I suspect that many broadcasters today are sending a 4:3 image inside a 16:9 image (pillarboxed). So your 4:3 image is inside a 16:9 frame and is being recorded that way by your HD-DVR. So, if you play that 16:9 frame into an SD TV, the 16x9 frame gets letterboxed in the 4:3 TV.

Now, consider how an SD DVD recorder would record the same image-within-a-box thru your HD box's analog outputs! Problems galore.

I think HD channels send a 16x9 image pillarboxed but SD channels don't. I tried messing around with the DVD player connected to the SD TV and I couldn't make it change to full screen. Once it gets burned in pillarbox on DVD burner connected to the HD TV it must burned the pillarboxes to the image.

I have a third TV that is an old SD TV hooked up to our satellite and when I watch these programs I DVRed they aren't pillalboxed. Unforuntately there isn't a receiver attached to it so I can hook up my DVD recorder to it. How does it know to show those full screen?

If you are having issues with the picture fitting to the screen and it is connected to the DISH receiver you can use the * button to change the size of the picture. If you are not connected to the DISH receiver you will need to change the screen format through the TV our unit you are playing the recording through.

[kschwi]

Yes, but that zooms or stretches the picture. What I want is to able to burn these recordings to DVD and them watch them on an old non-HDTV and not have them pillarboxed or stretched or zoomed.

Somehow on my 2nd TV which is not HD non-HD programming shows up without being pillarboxed and thus is full screen. Unfortunately, there is no receiver with that TV to connect my DVD burner to.

It appears as if somehow the Dish receiver knows the type of TV being used and pillarboxes non-HD content on a HD TV but doesn't pillarbox with a Non-HD TV.

[Mike.H_DISH]

Yes, but that zooms or stretches the picture. What I want is to able to burn these recordings to DVD and them watch them on an old non-HDTV and not have them pillarboxed or stretched or zoomed.

Somehow on my 2nd TV which is not HD non-HD programming shows up without being pillarboxed and thus is full screen. Unfortunately, there is no receiver with that TV to connect my DVD burner to.

It appears as if somehow the Dish receiver knows the type of TV being used and pillarboxes non-HD content on a HD TV but doesn't pillarbox with a Non-HD TV.

I will forward this question to my engineers, thanks for the information today!

[kschwi]

Your engineer ever get back to you?

[kschwi]

Thought Dish would help

Maybe the better question is how to get the DVD recorded to burn what is playing on TV2 which is my non-HD TV. THe format comes out fine when it plays on that TV. There is not a DISH receiver hooked up to TV2 just a cable so I can't connect the DVD recorded to a different receiver. Is there anyone to get the DVD recorder to burn what is playing on TV2?

[usually_quiet]

Thought Dish would help

Maybe the better question is how to get the DVD recorded to burn what is playing on TV2 which is my non-HD TV. THe format comes out fine when it plays on that TV. There is not a DISH receiver hooked up to TV2 just a cable so I can't connect the DVD recorded to a different receiver. Is there anyone to get the DVD recorder to burn what is playing on TV2?

I assume the cable hooked up to the non-HD TV is just a simple coax cable and the TV receives programming on channel 3 or channel 4. Does your DVD recorder also have a coax connection and an analog tuner so it can tune analog signals? If so, connect the DVD recorder between the TV and the cable from the wall and try recording something.

[Edit] Never mind. I forgot the DVD recorder that you have is tunerless. Do you still have an old VCR with RCA out? Hook the cable up to that, tune the VCR to channel 3 or channel 4, and connect the RCA connections to the DVD recorder to record.

[sanlyn]

I thought that after the broadcasting "digital transition" there were no analog signals over cable. I could be wrong there, but aren't cable companies sending digital-only? OR is that cable antenna ? (still, I thought today's programming is digital, not analog). Two years ago I was able to able to pick up non-encrypted cable with a digital HD tuner that let me convert that signal to a "squished" 4:3 frame that I could record with 16:9 DAR. Then the cable outfit cut that by encrypting everything and requiring either an SD or HD box (phooey). But some of those digital-SD stations are copy-once only. I can still record with my Toshiba DVD recorder from the digital SD box at 4:3. But the Toshiba no longer picks up a signal directly off cable.

Methinks something like the Hauppauge HD PVR and a 'puter is still the O.P.'s only choice. Open to suggestion, though.