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  1. Member
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    I already try convert use eac3to + surcode but no luck, can anyone help?

    i want to convert it to 16 bit because it's compliant dvd.

    thanks
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    If no one else comes up with a better idea, I suggest this.

    1) Convert from DTS to WAV with each DTS channel in a separate WAV file. eac3to may be able to do this.
    2) Convert the 24 bit WAV files to 16 bit.
    3) Encode to 16 bit DTS using the 16 bit WAV files.
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    [ e d i t e d ]
    Last edited by El Heggunte; 16th Jul 2012 at 14:00.
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    Originally Posted by jman98 View Post
    If no one else comes up with a better idea, I suggest this.

    1) Convert from DTS to WAV with each DTS channel in a separate WAV file. eac3to may be able to do this.
    2) Convert the 24 bit WAV files to 16 bit.
    3) Encode to 16 bit DTS using the 16 bit WAV files.
    thanks, i will try it.

    Just wondering, does surcode support output 16 bit? because i already try over & over again but the output files still 24 bit. only separate channel 16 bit (mono).
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    I had an, ahem, "evaluation" copy of Surcode some years ago on a PC I no longer use, but I never really used it. As best I could tell at the time it produced DTS files with the same bits as the input. You may have to play with the settings. 24 bit DTS is a little unusual and it really should not be the default setting of Surcode. If you see something called DTS 96/24 in a setting, this is 24 bit DTS.

    DTS 96/24 on DVD Audio is legal and I've seen a few music DVDs that used it, but my understanding is that technically speaking it's outside the supported specs of DVD although many receivers and DVD/BluRay players can handle it.
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    Originally Posted by jman98 View Post
    If no one else comes up with a better idea, I suggest this.

    1) Convert from DTS to WAV with each DTS channel in a separate WAV file. eac3to may be able to do this.
    2) Convert the 24 bit WAV files to 16 bit.
    3) Encode to 16 bit DTS using the 16 bit WAV files.
    I already trying what you say, but after encode to 16 bit DTS using the 16 bit WAV the output DTS is 24 bit AGAIN
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  7. Originally Posted by axl70 View Post
    I already trying what you say, but after encode to 16 bit DTS using the 16 bit WAV the output DTS is 24 bit AGAIN
    Can You write what decoder is used by You to verify those result?
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  8. Originally Posted by axl70 View Post
    I already trying what you say, but after encode to 16 bit DTS using the 16 bit WAV the output DTS is 24 bit AGAIN
    Does it necessarily follow all 24 bits are used? You may have to specify a 16 bit DTS output even if the wave file used as the source is 16 bit. I've not converted to DTS at all, but when converting audio to FLAC you can specify a bit depth, but it doesn't increase the audio bit depth when converting.... as best as I can tell. For example:

    Converting a Bluray 24 bit DTS audio stream to 16 bit FLAC results in a 410MB file.
    Converting a Bluray 24 bit DTS audio stream to 24 bit FLAC results in a 1100MB file.

    Converting the 16 bit FLAC file to 24 bit FLAC still only results in a 410MB file (well it was actually 0.4MB larger than the 16 bit version). Therefore I assume the audio is really only 16 bit, however the FLAC file is identified as 24 bit.

    Maybe the same thing happens when converting to DTS?
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    This is the original file:


    Audio
    ID : 2
    Format : DTS
    Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
    Format profile : MA / Core
    Muxing mode : Header stripping
    Codec ID : A_DTS
    Duration : 2h 15mn
    Bit rate mode : Variable
    Bit rate : 1 576 Kbps / 1 510 Kbps
    Channel(s) : 6 channels
    Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
    Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
    Bit depth : 24 bits
    Compression mode : Lossless / Lossy
    Title : DTS-HD MA 5.1
    Language : English

    Downconvert to 764kbps Bit depth : 24 bits.

    This is when downconvert using eac3to to 16 bit:

    DTS, 5.1 channels, 2:15:13, 24 bits, 755kbps, 48khz
    The ArcSoft and Sonic decoders don't seem to work, will use libav instead.
    Decoding with libav/ffmpeg...
    Remapping channels...
    Reducing depth from 64 to 16 bits...
    Writing WAVs...
    Creating file "C:\Documents and Settings\SANDS DJ TEAM\Desktop\COWBOYS AND ALIENS.C.wav"...
    Creating file "C:\Documents and Settings\SANDS DJ TEAM\Desktop\COWBOYS AND ALIENS.R.wav"...
    Creating file "C:\Documents and Settings\SANDS DJ TEAM\Desktop\COWBOYS AND ALIENS.L.wav"...
    Creating file "C:\Documents and Settings\SANDS DJ TEAM\Desktop\COWBOYS AND ALIENS.LFE.wav"...
    Creating file "C:\Documents and Settings\SANDS DJ TEAM\Desktop\COWBOYS AND ALIENS.SR.wav"...
    Creating file "C:\Documents and Settings\SANDS DJ TEAM\Desktop\COWBOYS AND ALIENS.SL.wav"...
    Encoding DTS <768kbps> with Surcode...
    Found Surcode DTS Encoder version 1.0.29.0.
    Surcode encoding successfully started. Please wait...
    Closing Surcode...
    eac3to processing took 10 minutes, 14 seconds.
    Surcode encoding took 18 minutes, 46 seconds.
    Done.


    Result:


    General
    Complete name : C:\Documents and Settings\SANDS DJ TEAM\Desktop\COWBOYS AND ALIENS.dts
    Format : DTS
    Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
    File size : 730 MiB
    Duration : 2h 15mn
    Overall bit rate mode : Constant
    Overall bit rate : 755 Kbps

    Audio
    Format : DTS
    Format/Info : Digital Theater Systems
    Duration : 2h 15mn
    Bit rate mode : Constant
    Bit rate : 755 Kbps
    Channel(s) : 6 channels
    Channel positions : Front: L C R, Side: L R, LFE
    Sampling rate : 48.0 KHz
    Bit depth : 24 bits
    Compression mode : Lossy
    Stream size : 730 MiB (100%)

    Need help
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    My setting in eac3to:


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  11. Nope, You don't need a help. If audio was reduced to 16 bit before encoding then it is 16 bit audio - however decoder can be designed in a way that decoded samples are 24 bit even if they are 16 bit before encoding - especially this is valid for LOSSY encoders.
    This can be simple 16 bit samples multiplied by 8 bit fixed coefficient or even 16 bit sample with 8 bit set as 0 (null).

    Decoder can produce samples to achieve BEST results (with assumed final audio renderer device) - to avoid quality loss (intermediate operation) they can be converted to 24 bits.

    And DTS is DVD compliant not 24 or 16 bit (internally, inside codes there is no 16 or 24 bit samples) - same rule is for all LOSSY encoders - they not operate in PCM world after encoding and before decoding.

    DTS have field PCMR (Source PCM Resolution) however this field can be 16,20 or 24 bit and seems that is only informative. ANY certified DTS decoder MUST support ANY valid combination for PCMR field.
    Check ETSI TS 102 114 V1.3.1 page 23.
    Last edited by pandy; 17th Jul 2012 at 12:25.
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    Yes, similar to the way 10bit color can be used for efficiency & quality when using lossy compression instead of 8bit color (although this one also seems to have compliance problems).

    Scott
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    Originally Posted by pandy View Post
    Nope, You don't need a help. If audio was reduced to 16 bit before encoding then it is 16 bit audio - however decoder can be designed in a way that decoded samples are 24 bit even if they are 16 bit before encoding - especially this is valid for LOSSY encoders.
    This can be simple 16 bit samples multiplied by 8 bit fixed coefficient or even 16 bit sample with 8 bit set as 0 (null).

    Decoder can produce samples to achieve BEST results (with assumed final audio renderer device) - to avoid quality loss (intermediate operation) they can be converted to 24 bits.

    And DTS is DVD compliant not 24 or 16 bit (internally, inside codes there is no 16 or 24 bit samples) - same rule is for all LOSSY encoders - they not operate in PCM world after encoding and before decoding.

    DTS have field PCMR (Source PCM Resolution) however this field can be 16,20 or 24 bit and seems that is only informative. ANY certified DTS decoder MUST support ANY valid combination for PCMR field.
    Check ETSI TS 102 114 V1.3.1 page 23.
    so, you mean is impossible for me to change 24 bit to 16 bit?
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    You're not really doing what I intended, but it's my fault for not explaining it more accurately. Let me try this.

    1) Convert from DTS to WAV with each DTS channel in a separate file. Use eact3to to do this conversion if necessary. You should end up with 6 WAV files. Once you have 6 WAV you are done with eac3to. Do NOT use it again!
    2) Check your WAV files. Convert to 16 bit if necessary using something like Auacity. DO NOT use eac3to!
    3) Encode to DTS directly with Surcode. DO NOT use eac3to! The Surcode version I had years ago was for audio CDs and it had a GUI interface. Your version of Surcode should have its own GUI.

    Note that in your screen capture the following option in eac3to:
    Override Auto Detection With Manual Values
    and under that is:
    16 Or 24 Bit
    You might also try doing an encode after you set this value to 16 bit and see if then eac3to really produces 16 bit output. If not, you will HAVE to do this by the manual process I suggested to try to force it to 16 bit.
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  15. Originally Posted by axl70 View Post
    so, you mean is impossible for me to change 24 bit to 16 bit?
    So i mean if this is really necessary to have in PCMR field 16 bit instead 24 then set value in this field 0b001 and nothing more... reencoding is not required
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    Thanks all...
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    Originally Posted by axl70 View Post
    Thanks all...
    Did one of the suggestions fix your problem or not? If yes, then which suggestion worked?
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    Originally Posted by jman98 View Post
    Originally Posted by axl70 View Post
    Thanks all...
    Did one of the suggestions fix your problem or not? If yes, then which suggestion worked?
    It didn't work at all.
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  19. Ok, let start everything form beginning.

    You insist to have DTS, (qulity for 768kbps is quite low when compared to AC-3 448 - 640kbps but OK, some can prefer DTS due Cinavia),

    Your DTS file can't be used by Your DVD authoring tool? Or there is different reason why You must have 16 bit PCMR?

    Did You try use to encode DTS with dcaenc http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1570689#post1570689 ?
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    Originally Posted by pandy View Post
    Ok, let start everything form beginning.

    You insist to have DTS, (qulity for 768kbps is quite low when compared to AC-3 448 - 640kbps but OK, some can prefer DTS due Cinavia),

    Your DTS file can't be used by Your DVD authoring tool? Or there is different reason why You must have 16 bit PCMR?

    Did You try use to encode DTS with dcaenc http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?p=1570689#post1570689 ?
    Yes,AVStoDVD won't accept 24 bit...too bad i can't use that encoder because i'm not a linux user.

    thanks anyway
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    Originally Posted by axl70 View Post
    ......

    too bad i can't use that encoder because i'm not a linux user.
    Lord Mulder's builds of dcaenc are for Windows, not for Linux.
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    Originally Posted by El Heggunte View Post
    Originally Posted by axl70 View Post
    ......

    too bad i can't use that encoder because i'm not a linux user.
    Lord Mulder's builds of dcaenc are for Windows, not for Linux.
    I'm starting to suspect that the real issue here is PEBKAC.
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  23. So if this is true (PEBKAC) - anyone with AVStoDVD experience can confirm that DTS with 24 bit in PCMR is treat as invalid? Is there any reasonable explanation for such misbehavior?!?
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    Try TFM Audio Tool ,maybe it can help.
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