big headache with capture card and new nxp chip

[mammo1789]

Hi guys just short history

As suggestion from member and after failure with asus es3 110 pci-e combo card( no dvb-s signal no mater what i did, jumpy capture in virtual dub and some kind of digital error like thin stripes over video tv and video in) I finally decided to replace my tv and sat card ( pinnacle 110i 7131e chip and skystar2 b2c chip) and to ad dvb-t int my pc. The card that i bought is aver media satellite trinity ( it had some good reviews from dvbs forums) is pcie and has the newer chip from Philips nxp 716x 10 bit ( i think the same as in asus card) and which by paper should be very good better than previous 9bit chips from 713x era. Satelite and dvb-t work good digital recording in dvbviewer progdvb or media center are excellent quality and very stable proc amp controls work in windows 7 64 bit.

The problem
I started vdub and connected vcr trough svideo dangle ( it has 9 pins svideo/video/audio/remote control) and the same song as with asus jumpy picture like fast zoom in zoom out thing, droped frames the same digital error thin stripes and so on. I entered setup and saw that it has "wrong" resolution of 720x480 and i live in pal land ( by the way the card says its worldwide standard meaning pal,ntsc,secam and so on) it always sets this resolution even in media center and other software. I opened the captured file in vdub it says vdub doesn't support non zero start ?! i don't understand what this is. I opened it in tmpgenc and it says bottom first ( should pal vcr capture lagarith analog be tff?) Even on tv capture from tv tuner the same thing.
I tough it is driver issue ( but two different cards with different chips except the main one saa716x showing the same errors in vdub hm ?!) and i started virtual vcr set everything manual 720x576 25 yuv2 lagarith, no jumpy picture from tv tuner at least no digital thin stripe error as in vdub ( probably wdm vs wfv thing) but some drooped 1-3 frames for 2 hours tv show ( from tv tuner ?! hm strange no tbc errors or such and dropping frames - high speed hdd 1tb defragmented by the way) And when i oppened in tmpgenc again it shows botom first ( is there anywhere where i can change this on older car it was tff ) why is that

Im assuming that

A -something really is fishy with the analog portion of the chip ( it says in philips ic sheme that it has some hevy filtering for vcr stabilization?! and so on noise reduction and it doesn't seem to do that )

B- the drivers are really fucked up ( i tried dozen for both cards asus and aver media ) or are bad implemented

It sad that all card manufacturers are more oriented toward pvr ( hdmi component HD consoles input) these days than on good capturing cards

What do you guys think about these problems

[mammo1789]

Is there way to set tff vs bff during capturing in vdub or virtualvcr ?

Another thing when i capture in vdub directly from vcr from video input the picture from time to time like fast zooms in out, but when i connect trough dvd recorder in pass trough no jumping zooms like it kind of poorly handles some sync signals from vcr ( where old card didn't had that kind of errors at all).

[Brad]

Don't worry about TFF/BFF. You just need to set it to whichever provides the correct display for any given capture when bobbing or compressing to another interlaced format.

Your post isn't easy to read. Pictures are worth a thousand words.

[themaster1]

Analog signals from vcr's are always top field first but the thing is avi files don't have an option to specify that explicitly to a third party app such as Tmpgenc, thus tmpgenc (by default) assume it is BFF.
You have to specify it manually in tmpgenc

For the "non zero start" thing i believe it's related to an option in Lagarith, probably the "null frames" option which should be disabled.For capturing i prefer huffyuv codec

[mammo1789]

I was busy these days so i didn't have time to do same samples i will post it tomorrow

Analog signals from vcr's are always top field first but the thing is avi files don't have an option to specify that explicitly to a third party app such as Tmpgenc, thus tmpgenc (by default) assume it is BFF.
You have to specify it manually in tmpgenc

The thing is that not just tmpgenc is assuming the same goes for every nle software as sony vegas and such so probably something is screwed. The other thing that's bother me is default resolution which is 768x480 I know that 768x576 is full pal but 768x480 i don't know.
The other problem is that when even viewing ( not just recording just overlay preview screen ) source material svideo( vhs) or tv tuner in vdub show some like digital errors( like computer generated thin lines) drop outs comets and such, witch are not showing at all in virtualvcr and also even in viewing vdub shows like fast zoom in zoom out flicker when i connect vcr directly but no zoom error when i connect it trough dvd recorder like some vsync error i dont know( although there is no such thing in virtualvcr but in virtualvcr I have drop frames small number but still ) the strange thing is that i got exactly the same results with the asus es3 110 triple combo card ( which i have returned by the way ) which has the same chip ( for analog i suppose philips (nxp) saa7162)
That's why I sad before that it's something fishy with this "new" chip from nxp ether driver or hardware issue or os issue
I will make some short clip examples tomorrow so you can judge for your self
Other than that i think it is a good card ( you should try to change the skystar2 themaster with this one it changes channels ultra fast and catches low signal tp's more stable )

For the "non zero start" thing i believe it's related to an option in Lagarith, probably the "null frames" option which should be disabled.For capturing i prefer huffyuv codec

yes its disabled in lagarith menu
The captures are bogusly reported in vdub

[themaster1]

stick with 720x576 for pal and 720x480 for ntsc or 704x576 704x480