Hi, I have a WinTV-PVR-150 TV-Tuner and would like to use as a capture card.
Somehow I'm not able to capture successefuly to a lossless codec like huffyuv. It captures in a format I'm not able to playback (HCW2). And the capture software reports that there can't be an audio capture device found even though the TV-Tuner has an audio input.
I suppose it's not able to capture the video to Huffyuv because the TV-Tuner card has a hardware encoder. Is it posible to turn the hardware encoder off? And i have no idea why I'm not able to capture the audio.
I have also read something about vfw and wdm on google and one is not compatible with another. Is that relevant for my problem?
I would appreciate any help.
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What's your version of Windows? Is it 32 or 64 bit?
The PVR-150 is a very problematic card. For many people it worked perfectly. However, a noticeable minority of users had huge problems with it. Some never got it to work correctly. Basically either it worked perfectly for you or it didn't. Hauppauge's PVR-250 and PVR-350 cards used a different chip set and failures with this card were extremely rare.
Audio problems can be hard to diagnose and fix with capture cards. You have to check both Windows sound settings AND any sound settings connected to your audio card (if you have added an audio card to your PC - if you are using audio on the motherboard only then you need only check the Windows sound controls) and see if any inputs are muted. Sometimes either Windows or the sound card control panel (if you added a card) will call an input by a name that you would not use to describe it, so you have to be sure that EVERYTHING is unmuted for it to work. For example, you might see that something like "input 2" is muted and you think "Oh that's OK because I am using input 1" but in reality input 2 is what the system is using to get audio from your card.
The only really good thing about the PVR-150 besides its price was that it could do AVI captures and the PVR-250 and 350 could not. I don't know which codecs are supported but I would think that Huffyuv would be OK. I have no experience at all with this card as I used the PVR-350, which is completely different. You may just have to play with a lot of settings in the card's control panel GUI until get something to work. I do not know what HCW2 is as the PVR-250/350 just recorded to MPEG-1/2. Yes, VFW and WDM are not compatible but I'm hardly an expert at that. Others will have to help you there. Your OS is relevant to that question.
You are correct. The hardware encoding for the WinTV-PVR-150 can't be turned off. Hauppauge is clear about that in the card's FAQ's.
If you need to make losslessly compressed captures, you should look for a different TV card or capture-only device that uses software encoding.
[Edit]I don't have any advice to give you regarding the audio problem. If nobody here can help, this website is a good resource for Hauppauge users http://www.shspvr.com/
Last edited by usually_quiet; 5th Jan 2012 at 15:28.
Thanks for the quick replies!
My OS is Win7 Home Premium 64bit.
I have no software from the capture card. Only a driver Windows automaticly found when I looked for it with the device menager on win7.
I don't have any software because I borrowed the card from a friend who got the card with his desktop PC but he never used it. All software he got was already preinstalled and he says he doesn't have any CD('s) with the Hauppauge software on it.
So that's why I don't have any input controls you said I have to check, I suppose?
I don't know if I have an onboard sound card or an extra one. But I actually wanted to capture the sound with the wintv card.
It could be that I am able to record the audio when using VirtualDub but I'm not sure because I can't play the captured file. But I tried to capture with virtualVCR hoping to get a file I could play and then when I tried to configure the audio settings on virtualVCR I got this Error: "Get Audio Format: Cannot find Audio IAMStreamConfig interface: 0"
If you can't help never mind. I Need to capture losslessly so that won't work either way with this card. But if you can help it woud be interesting to solve this problem.
P.S. maybe you should know, I only need it for capture.
Do you by chance know any capture cards that use software encoding and are compatible with a capture software that can capture with a yuv lossless codec and afterwards edit with VirtualDub or VirtualDubMod?
ATI? Hauppauge? It won't work with any Pinnacle card, right?
And it should preferably be a card that isn't a grafics card or even a TV-Tuner card at the same time (to save money) (and have a s-video in and red white audio in).
Do you know anything about vfw and wdm? Vfw is old, right? And wdm is new?
Has that something to do with the drivers or with the actual video result?
I read multiple times that you should avoid vfw.
You are correct, VFW is an older standard for capture device drivers, and WDM is the newer one. However, I believe Virtualdub and most other free software uses VFW codecs as compressors. VFW is not all bad, just not the type of device driver used most often for Windows 7.
Last edited by usually_quiet; 5th Jan 2012 at 19:12.
Try these webpages and see if it might help you.If it feels good, do it.
Hauppauge doesn't go into detail about their drivers for the card, so while Win 7 is supported it may only be 32 bit Win 7. You should probably send email to Hauppauge and see if 64 bit Win 7 is a supported platform or not. If not, then that's why it's not working.
You really need to get to the point where you can tell if you have a special sound card installed or if you're just using motherboard sound. Not being able to tell for sure does limit your ability to fix this issue and may ultimately mean that you'll never get it to work. But you really need to see first if 64 bit Win 7 is officially supported or not.
[Edit] I meant that rudolf016 is correct. If you look at the timestamp, jman98 and I posted within the same minute, and that is why I didn't quote the OP.
Last edited by usually_quiet; 6th Jan 2012 at 00:24.
I believe jman98 is correct about the 150 being able to capture raw YUV video as AVI. But you have to use 3rd party software. I don't know if drivers for Vista and Win7 include the function.
Actually, the PVR-250 can capture raw YUV as AVI too. But you have to use a GraphEdit script to route the preview pins rather than the capture pins to the output file. Unfortunately, the preview pins have the chroma channels slightly messed up (I forget what the problem is exactly).
I did some research.
It appears the Windows XP drivers available for the PVR-150 in 2004 and early 2005 allowed uncompressed capture with DScaler and Virtualdub.
...but by the end of 2005, the PVR-150's Windows XP drivers didn't allow it. At that point uncompressed video output was still available using GraphEdit, but audio capture was a problem.
...and DScaler doesn't work with the PVR-150 using Windows 7 64-bit.
The OP is using Virtualdub, and that doesn't work either.
...so the answer is that uncompressed capture with both video and audio using Windows 7 64-bit is likely going to be impossible, unless GraphEdit or GraphStudio can be made to work.
I did a little more looking around in the DScaler user forum and found a post where someone was able to get the PVR-150 working with DScaler using Windows 7 64-bit. I understand correctly, S-Video was used for video capture and audio was captured in good quality through the PC's line input. http://www.dscaler.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=9087
So with a little bit of luck, and extra effort, the card PVR-150 may work with DScaler.
If that is the case, what Hauppauge's FAQ's said about the PVR-150 not working with software that needs uncompressed input from the PVR-150 is only partially true.
I'm capturing sVHS tapes.
"Hauppauge USB-Live-2 Analog Video Capture USB 2.0 (Haup610)" won't work since it's USB and I need lossless.
Isn't their ANY capture card that you can use how you want? If their is none without a TV-tuner than it can also be one with. Hasn't ATI have such ones? Do you know any thing about that?
The method you said won't work because the zip file that is linked at that forum isn't available any more. And if the link would be still available, wouldn't the card first encode the video with the hardware encoder and that encode it again to huffyuv? So than it would be mpeg2 with the size of huffyuv.
The tapes are very impotent and I already did a quick bad quality trancefare of them with a other capture device from pinnacle and now I wan't to make a perfect one that I can enhance using virtualdub and then encode with x264 and encode to mpeg2 for DVD's.
So I'm ready to buy a new capture card providing it will work without any "hacks".
MCE. I suspect Hauppauge had enough problems supporting the device when it was used with their software or MCE, let alone anything else.
The software that has the best chance of making the PVR-150 work probably is GraphEdit or GraphStudio. Looking over posts on the subject it seems to me like it wasn't easy at best (and not possible at worst) to get the PVR-150 working with DScaler, Virtualdub, and a few other capture programs after the drivers were changed in 2005.
Indeed, the PVR-150 was INCREDIBLY problematic. This is hardly scientific and I'm just pulling this stuff out of the air, but based on the various posts I saw in various places on the internet, I would guess that maybe 30% of the people who bought the card NEVER got it to work for them. NEVER. I do believe that most buyers did get the card to work fine for their needs, but I would discourage people here from buying it over the PVR-250 and PVR-350 as the chance of a horrible problem that couldn't be resolved was just too high. The PVR-250 and 350 cards were outstanding cards. The number of people who had issues where it just didn't work at all were quite low. Basically if you bought the card, you could expect it to work without too much fuss. But cheap people preferred to gamble on the 150. Some folks bought it hoping to capture directly to Divx. My opinion was that you were just better off to use the 250 or 350 and re-encode. As long as you were OK with MPEG-1 or MPEG-2 and standard definition video, the 250 and 350 were excellent cards.
Hauppauge is kind of infamous for poor support of their own products. But to be fair, they are not alone. ATI has basically responded with "Huh?" for years to any video capturing questions. Honestly, I'm surprised they even support it at all given their focus on gamers who care nothing about recording video. And MyTV was pretty much the same as ATI.
Virtualdub for lossless capture. I even checked to make sure that the Hauppauge USB-Live-2 Analog Video Capture can be used with Virtualdub.
There are more USB capture devices than internal capture-only cards these days. All the small USB-stick like devices I have seen use software encoding, rather than hardware, which means they provide uncompressed output, and Virtualdub works with many of them. (Hardware encoding chips produce a lot of heat, so putting one in a tiny enclosure isn't feasible.)
As for VHS, there are few (if any) capture devices supported by Windows 7 that are optimized for VHS capture like some of the 2005 era devices were. Today's capture devices are more likely to need additional equipment between the VCR and the PC for successful VHS capture than some of the capture devices that were sold in 2005.
I have a Diamond TV Wonder 650 card, and it can provide uncompressed output or hardware encoding. It did work with Virtualdub, but required the use of specific settings. I found DScaler easier to use with it. The problem is that the card's AGC causes the video to "flash" intermittently when capturing VHS, due to false Macrovision detection. A Macrovision remover helps with that problem, and so might some TBCs that remove macrovision. The card is discontinued, but may turn up on eBay.
The Diamond TV Wonder 750 devices only use software for encoding, but have the same AGC issue.
There may be "pins" on the crossbar filter that provide uncompressed output, so using GraphStudio and GraphEdit might still work, but I'll agree that solution doesn't appeal to everyone.
Last edited by usually_quiet; 6th Jan 2012 at 15:12.
My tapes are homevideos only! So I won't have that problem!?
I Googled the filename and found the pvr150_20_35_23348.zip drivers mentioned in this thread http://www.dscaler.net/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=9087 at http://www.megaupload.com/?d=MTG497MD I downloaded and scanned the archive with Malwarebytes and SuperAntiSpyware. They didn't find anything suspicious, but I can't guarantee there is nothing dangerous hidden in it or that it will actually work for Windows 7-64 bit as was claimed.
Last edited by usually_quiet; 7th Jan 2012 at 09:14. Reason: Fix link for drivers
Shouldn't their be a pvr150_20_35_23348.exe in it? Is this really the right thing? That's AverTV something.
Well for what it's word i have a pvr 150 card and it works fine.
At the uk site you can find the drivers needed. but only version 6 of the application is free to use, version 7 you must have or buy the software cd.
On the american site you can find the older software pakkage
For what i know is that this card has a hardware mpg2 encoder so i would think that it only can capture in this format.
This card works on windows 7 32 bit WITH LESS THEN 4 GB RAM!
This card works on windows 7 64 bit WITH LESS THEN 4 GB RAM!
If you have more ram installed the card don't work. this is a problem in the driver that nor Microsoft nor hauppauge want's to solve. They blame each other for it.
I use the wintv7 application and it capture's in .ts streams. It works and the results are reasonably good (not perfect)
On their website is a forum for 3rd party application use
Using a PVR150 to capture uncompressed video is something like using a locomotive to pull a shopping trolley. Having said that, if you run the card's MPEG-2 encoder at a high bit rate and then edit / recompress you can get quite good results.
There's no need to use Hauppauge's crapware, nor Microsoft's MCE to record with it. Some time ago the GBPVR author released a standalone command line tool, a copy of which can be found here > http://www.users.on.net/~alfalfa/files/GBRecord92.zip.
Even though the card will output > 20Mbit/sec there's no point in doing it as it maxes out (or should that be mins out) the compression somewhere between 15 and 20Mbit/sec.
The issue with > 4GB RAM relates to DMA operations. The card can only do DMA to < 32 bit addresses. Since a 64 bit driver has been released it would be comparatively trivial for Hauppauge to compile it to be 32 bit safe (using the PAE directive) or build in double buffer DMA operations but Hauppauge wants you to buy a new device rather than offer decent support for their hardware.
DMA problems aren't anythig new. The same thing happened during the transition from 16 bits to 32 bits. Its not a Windows specific issue, it applies to PC hardware in general.
@jan5678 & LightWeightProducer I suspect the OP has already tried using the card's hardware encoding for VHS capture and didn't like the results. The OP specifically said that he wants to use lossless compression for capture, and will use a different device instead if he can't do that with the PVR-150.
GBRecord is probably more useful for recording TV than capturing VHS tapes. GBRecord uses a timer and shutting it down manually requires using Task Manager, or similar software. There are instructions for GBRecord here http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=111272 just in case someone else runs across this thread and wants to try it.
By the time Windows 7 arrived in 2009, the countries where most of Hauppauge's customers reside had either already switched to digital OTA broadcasts or were about to so. Since the PVR-150's tuner is strictly analog, many who had one needed to replace it anyway. Only those with analog cable or a set-top receiver of some kind could still use their PVR-150 for watching/recording TV. Given that, it is a miracle that Hauppauge released Windows 7 drivers for the PVR-150 at all. Many hardware manufacturers did not release Windows 7 drivers for any of their discontinued products.
Last edited by usually_quiet; 8th Jan 2012 at 12:14.
GBRecord does need a time limit, but given that its tape and probably and attended recording session, just set it to say 3 hours and when playback is finished press CTRL+C. The documentation even says CTRL+C is a completely acceptable way to terminate it. Want to see what it records? Open the recording file, while its being produced, with VLC.
Who releases drivers for their discontinued products for Win7? Its quite a long list but even the obscure ones like X-HOME do it. Heck, even Hauppauge does it when it suits them.
Given that the existing Windows 64 bit driver for the card makes it 95% of the way to full functionality under Win 7 64 bit with more than 4Gb RAM, its quite annoying that Hauppauge decided to not make that wee little bit extra effort of using the PAE directive when compiling. With a bit more effort, driver based double buffering could be implemented. Other capture card manufacturers can do it. I have a positively ancient CX based PCI card from Leadtek (Winfast TV2000 XP, released in 2003) that has Win 7 64 bit drivers that allow the card to work correctly with more than 4Gb RAM.
All up grabbing with gbrecord is not going to be any more complex, arguably easier, then trying to force the PVR150 to do something that it was never intended to. Not to mention that its hardware MPEG-2 encoder automatically maintains audio sync. Most of the frame grabber devices out there do not, requiring considerable tinkering even with virtualdub, to get it right. If one forces the PVR150 to be a frame grabber, the audio sync issues raise their head.
Last edited by LightWeightProducer; 8th Jan 2012 at 14:39.
As far as TV tuners go, I was shopping for one in early 2010, and I know that ATI didn't release any new drivers for TV-tuner products that were discontinued before Windows 7 came out, and I recall there were some other fairly good digital TV tuners that I looked at which didn't have Windows 7 drivers either.
IMO, reading between the lines of what the OP has written, he would be happier with something other than the PVR-150, that can be used with the software he wants to use, instead of resorting to command line software that requires using other software to view the capture. If you like command line interfaces, good for you, but you are in the minority. In 2012 relatively few people will gladly use command line programs.
Last edited by usually_quiet; 8th Jan 2012 at 15:56.