EZCap(S-Video) vs Firewire to capture VHS

[Pepepaco]

hello, I have been capturing uncompressed AVI using EZcap getting average noisy results, that I tought I could clean after using NeatVideo...
Just recently, I got another VCR with firewire output, the resulting MPEG2 file suffers from: very limited contrast, shifted colors, overall dark scenes, compression artifacts, etc., despite that, after applying post-prod filters on both files, MPEG2 video looks much better that the AVI.

it looks like behind all the dirt MPEG2 file carry there is a lot more information than in the uncompressed format..

my question is why is this happening, is this normal, have anyone else noticed the same,or it could be that I'm doing something wrong???

your help is very appreciated.

[hech54]

Just recently, I got another VCR with firewire output, the resulting MPEG2 file

What machine does this?

[Pepepaco]

I have a Panasonic 1980P -> EZCap S-Video, I get noisy, with lost of info captures. (tried using Huffyuv, Cedocida, uncompressed, same results )

If I connect the Pan 1980P S-Video->JVC SR-VD400U Firewire-> PC , I get compressed MPEG2 file, dark and low contrast file.

I play the VHS in the Pan 1980P becuase in this case, it corrects tracking issues better than the JVC.

[hech54]

That's a D-VHS machine. Pretty cool. There are some less than stellar MPEG2 encoding computer cards out there so I'd imagine it's the same with that VHS machine. It's a handy feature but there are better ways to get to MPEG2.

[edDV]

hello, I have been capturing uncompressed AVI using EZcap getting average noisy results, that I tought I could clean after using NeatVideo...
Just recently, I got another VCR with firewire output, the resulting MPEG2 file suffers from: very limited contrast, shifted colors, overall dark scenes, compression artifacts, etc., despite that, after applying post-prod filters on both files, MPEG2 video looks much better that the AVI.

it looks like behind all the dirt MPEG2 file carry there is a lot more information than in the uncompressed format..

my question is why is this happening, is this normal, have anyone else noticed the same,or it could be that I'm doing something wrong???

your help is very appreciated.

Easycap is a lowest level cheap A/D capture device. VHS is a lowest level noisy, jittery source. VHS first needs timebase correction and ideally line level noise reduction prior to capture. Digital filters assume that line to line objects align. With non-timebase corrected video this isn't the case. Each line is offset relative to the lines above and below.

Uncompressed source is the best there is. Mpeg2 video can be first class. DVD video is MPeg2. ATSC broadcast is MPeg2. Your issues are with low quality source.

the resulting MPEG2 file suffers from: very limited contrast, shifted colors, overall dark scenes, compression artifacts, etc.

These are either source or VCR issues. Severe compression artifacts mainly result from source noise or low bit rate.

I have a Panasonic 1980P -> EZCap S-Video, I get noisy, with lost of info captures. (tried using Huffyuv, Cedocida*, uncompressed, same results )

Again, VHS source is noisy and noise causes quantization errors during A/D. Your capture card (EZcap) may be compounding the errors. Huffyuv, Cedocida, uncompressed codecs should not be introducing any errors. They just record the digital stream.

If I connect the Pan 1980P S-Video->JVC SR-VD400U Firewire-> PC , I get compressed MPEG2 file, dark and low contrast file.

If the "dark and low contrast" is greater than directly playing the source, it is a VCR settings issue or a faulty VCR. Check for black level/stretch in/out setting in the menus.


*Cedocida does have settings that can shift levels. Make sure you encode to 16-235 YUV, not 0-255. 0-255 will crush blacks and may clip whites.

[Pepepaco]

thank you for your ample, well elaborated answer.

If the "dark and low contrast" is greater than directly playing the source, it is a VCR settings issue or a faulty VCR. Check for black level/stretch in/out setting in the menus.

It looks like a encoding issue, the VCR plays very well directly to TV, but, resulting MPEG2 file is overall greenish low contrast...

but what most intrigues me, is that despite how ugly the MPEG2 looks, after some filters I manage to extract much more information than from the uncompressed AVI.

why everybody prefer to capture uncompressed , when direct digital transfer (firewire) is preserving much more information?

[NJRoadfan]

Out of curiosity, play the tape on the 1980P and run your video into the SR-VD400 and then run its S-Video out to the Easycap (use the SR-VD400U as a pass-through).

Pana 1980P --> SR-VD400U --> EasyCap

This method bypasses the JVC's internal MPEG2 encoder, see if the output that way is still low contrast and tinted green. Also try doing both firewire and analog pass-thru captures with the 1980's TBC turned OFF. The SR-VD400U has a built in full frame TBC that is on at all times (works on all video inputs too) and the 1980's TBC might interfere with it..

[Pepepaco]

Out of curiosity, play the tape on the 1980P and run your video into the SR-VD400 and then run its S-Video out to the Easycap (use the SR-VD400U as a pass-through).

Pana 1980P --> SR-VD400U --> EasyCap

This method bypasses the JVC's internal MPEG2 encoder, see if the output that way is still low contrast and tinted green. Also try doing both firewire and analog pass-thru captures with the 1980's TBC turned OFF. The SR-VD400U has a built in full frame TBC that is on at all times (works on all video inputs too) and the 1980's TBC might interfere with it..

my SR-VD400U just died, R.I.P.

I remember I disabled everything on it to use it just as pass through to firewire. I also didn't notice any difference between enable or disable anything.
I never tried s-video to s-video as you suggest... I wish I could now...it makes a high pitch noise that cause interference on all the outputs..., i'll post screenshot of some captures i did. thanks

[NJRoadfan]

The next option would be to add a full frame TBC between the EasyCap and the AG-1980. The two popular models are the AV Toolbox AVT-8710 and the Datavideo TBC-100. Sad to hear the DVHS deck died, I wouldn't be surprised if it was bad capacitors. The SR-VD400U's MPEG-2 compressor wasn't a bad choice, its based on the LSI Dimension chipset that was also found on JVC's DVD recorders of that time period.

[Pepepaco]

I just figure out what was happening,by default EZCap video standard was set to NTSC_M, setting the capture filter to NTSC_M_J the video looks almost the same as when using JVC pass through.

also JVC was using a very good noise filter, it will be hard to accomplish the same without it. Ill try to fix the board, otherwise Ill follow your advice and ill get the AVT8710.

thank you!