Hank's Mpeg-2 Encoder

[unclescoob]

I find it quite amusing that most of you swear by this 'encoder', which clearly produces TONS of pixelation throughout an entire clip. Sure it's free....but then again, so is dog shit. (stupid, smiley emoticon left out purposely. I don't add 'smileys' at the end of antagonizing comments to sugar coat them).

And to add insult to injury, I have seen a relatively high number of threads (not just here) where people seek help in getting the best quality ever with Mr. Hankey's playset!. I laugh my ass off as I read throughout these particular threads because of the pathetic, sad attempts that EVERYONE makes to help the 'damsel in distress' get it right...yet, still: pixelation and blocky artifacts, even with high bitrates (way over 9000kbps) and 0 quantization, at that! So, who started this rumor about HCENC providing 'high quality video at low bitrates'??

Windows DVD Maker (yes, the free 'toy' that comes with Windows 7, which no 'self-respecting' video enthusiast would even CONSIDER utilizing) has been the only tool that has produced the BEST picture quality EVER. And forget Hank's crapcoder, this is even compared to TMPEG, Procoder and CCE! WDVD Maker gives me a movie IDENTICAL to the source, and no trouble playing in any DVD player. Wanna call my bluff?

In any event, my only dilemma is finding out exactly what type of encoder does Windows DVD Maker utilize? I'm just curious.

[El Heggunte]

Long answer: you still don't know how to use HCenc, alright.

Short answer: LOL

[zoobie]

It can be frustrating.
Have you tried the free AVStoDVD? Select the HCenc encoder then select the highest quality setting. It will practically do everything for you and probably come out beautiful.

[manono]

Just ignore the troll.

[aedipuss]

Just ignore the troll.

it's the only one on my permanent ignore list. quite a feat!

[chowmein]

I always have a giggle at unclescoob's "**** you" posts, very punk yessir, but I gotta disagree with regards HCenc - it is an excellent encoder. No I'm not a "fanboy", just the results I get speak for themselves. Maybe the OP's source files need some avisynth processing (deblocking/denoising/etc) before loading into HCenc?

Having said that, I have never used Windows 7 DVD Maker (I'm still using XP).

[unclescoob]

Right, because 'ignoring the troll' will help the situation out. Manono, let's be frank here. Most people know you come off like a complete dick 99.9% of the time in these threads.

aedipussy- for someone who has me on their 'ignore' list, you sure are doing a magnificent job at ignoring me by responding to my threads!

Zoobie- I'm defnitely going to give it a shot. Never hurts to try.

Chowmein, can I send you a PM later to discuss settings?

[hech54]

I'm personally waiting for UncleScoobENC to come out. You ARE working on a much better encoder aren't you genius?

[unclescoob]

Yes. I'm building it out of an old washing machine and FM radio.

[chowmein]

LOL sure unclescoob you can PM me whenever.

As for manono, I know you two don't get along too well LOL, but man, he's a cluey guy who has written some top-notch guides & stuff here. He's really helped me out with patching up DVD structures & stuff. Seriously, his contribution here is enormous! I think you are just caught his bad side HA HA!!! Manono's cool, man...

[fritzi93]

Manono's cool, man...

Manono doesn't suffer fools gladly. And Aedipuss is of course a "big meanie".

[Nelson37]

This reminds me of the guy who tried to tell Neuron that he didn't know anything about interlacing. Now THAT was funny.

Then there was the guy who had some personal vendetta against the author of Virtualdub and tried to convince everyone that it was a terrible program. It had the feel of some sort of lover's quarrel, maybe that's what we have here?

For the OP, if you can't get better results from HCENC than Windows DVD maker, then you are doing something wrong. It's really that simple, you can spout off all you want, but just about everybody except you knows better.

Also, there is just NO WAY that Manono comes off as a complete dick more often than I do, and I don't think I am anywhere near 90%. His number would IMO be something closer to 0.1%.

As for MS's encoder, they almost certainly licensed it from somebody else, and got a lesser, simplified version of a commercial program. That's how they get most of their utilities, so I would assume they got this one the same way. Just do some research, as I seriously doubt anybody here is going to make any major effort to find this out for you. As for the type of encoder, that would be an MPEG encoder. There, does that help out your situation?

[manono]

Also, there is just NO WAY that Manono comes off as a complete dick more often than I do, and I don't think I am anywhere near 90%.

We dicks gotta stick together, eh?

[unclescoob]

Windows DVD Maker results look PERFECT! That's actually exactly what I'm saying, Nelson. Have you ever put an AVI file through it? It looks IDENTICAL to the source. In HCenc, I see pixelation.

Oh and yes, I know it's an MPEG-2 encoder. You had already answered my question in terms of who they license their encoder from.

Low Quant, High Bitrate. TONS of pixelation.

Please explain this.

[AlanHK]

Just ignore the troll.

it's the only one on my permanent ignore list. quite a feat!

Unusual for me to agree with you.


Anyway, since I gather he's complaining about HCEnc, Hank hangs out at Doom 9 and has a support thread there.

If you have any real bug reports or questions you get a pretty quick and knowledgeable response.
Doom 9 has a low tolerance for trolls though.

[unclescoob]

Alan, sweetheart, how are ya buddy? I thought you had me on your ignore list buddy, what are you doing in my thread!

Can't get away from me, huh gorgeous? I figured.

[unclescoob]

Who in here is good with encoding cartoons?

[AlanHK]

PS: I see two posts following mine with
"This message is hidden because unclescoob is on your ignore list."
Just in case they were directed at me, don't bother.
Apologies if not the case.

I'll step away from this thread now.

[unclescoob]

Seems like you just can't get away from me, Alan. Aaaah, you miss the little farse we used to have when I needed help with Avisynth, don't you. Go ahead. Step away for your little break, sweetycakes.

You love me. You miss the **** too much. you'll be back

[HemLok]

I've read a lot of threads on a lot of forums about a lot of topics and the premise of this thread and the hooey is simply absurd. Unclescoob, if you honestly believe and want to sit here and state that Microsoft's work within the freeware product is better than HCEnc or CCE then that's certainly an opinion you are entitled to... but you are wrong. If your results from HCEnc and CCE are worse than Microsoft's free product then you are the problem and the reason why your supposed results/tests/data from other products than Microsoft are a result of user error. Bluntly stated the problem is between the keyboard and the user. I'll once again state that you are the problem.

Whether you are a troll or whatever doesn't matter to me. You posted BS and I've replied and I won't reply again. Your drivel definitely doesn't deserve it. Have fun with your cra**y outputs that you claim are flawless.

[unclescoob]

It's funny how alot of you have, in essence told me that there is NO POSSIBLE way that Windows can give me better results than HCenc. Yet none of you have even seen it. So you're judging based on product, and not the actual visual proof. Care for proof? Actually, I will provide it. When I get home, I am going to upload two short clips of each. I'm going to tell you what settings I'm using with HCenc, and you judge for yourselves.

If I tell you that there is absolutely NO pixelation in the Windows output, then how is it possible that I am the problem? Have any of you ever even used Windows? But you all have it set in your minds that this is an impossible task. Fine, I'll just provide the proof. You know what I've come to realize? It's not even about making a nice, good-looking video to most of you anymore. Now it's just about control. See, most of you can't bear the thought of software making a decision for you in terms of encoding, and actually (yes, it sometimes does happen!) giving you (gasp!)....GOOD RESULTS. Maybe even BETTER than when the uh *ahem* "problem" between the "keyboard and the (user?? Hemlock?)" I thought the cliche was that the problem lies between the keyboard and the chair. Oh well. Maybe you'll proofread before you hit "save" next time. But in any event, most of you can't bear that thought! It's all about control for most of you. So even if with your very eyes you see an unexpected software doing something unexpected...you wouldn't believe it anyway. Why? Because YOU didn't have control of it. What an ******* mentality.

Now let me be fair, I did take zoobie's advice and used it with AVStoDVD and the results were alot better (using HCenc). However, Windows results still look IDENTICAL to my source. But everyone is entitled to their opinions, of course.

Nelson and Co. think that by hurling insults at me, they're going to somehow make me walk out of this thread with my pixelated tail between my pixelated legs. The truth of the matter is that zoobie and chowmein, who were the only polite ones here who TACTFULLY dealt with my (I do admit) TACKYNESS are the only ones I respect. The rest of you are most likely very knowledgeable, sure. But useless for a help forum. Why? Because all most of you know how to do is tell someone that they're doing it wrong, and that they're "trolls" (whatever the **** that means), and that they have no knowledge. Yet, aside from zoobie and chowmein, none of you even take the time to actually explain what the individual is doing wrong.

You wanna shut me up? You wanna really make me look like a fool? Be like zoobie. He actually gave me concrete, practical and direct advice: Use it with AVStoDVD for beautiful results. I did just that. The results were definitely an improvement. Calling me names or making (hilarious, mind you) declarations about putting me on "ignore" (ain't it funny how most people online who state that they're "ignoring" you from this point on continue to pay attention to the ignoree even moreso than the rest?) doesn't chase me away. On the contrary, it amuses me that I have that much control over a group of "extremely knowledgeable" simpletons. If most of you here were women, I'd at least understand the cattyness.

In any event, I'm going to continue to post here. I really could give less of a shit who says what unless they're offering sincere assistance. And this applies to WHOMEVER, regardless of what "articles" or "help notes" they've published or what weight they hold here. I repeat again: If you're extremely knowledgeable but an *******, you're just as useless as someone who has no knowledge.

[Bjs]

Think one should put things into perspective

The fact is much happens under the cover in windows dvd maker that very few are privy too ... pre-processing, filter, tweaks, own proprietary encoder.

Then there's using hcenc ... much has to be done sometimes (not always) before encoding takes place and the right settings ... the same settings almost always require adjustment given the source of input may be unique.

Unique includes "I have the complete series dvd ... of what ever" ... they are similar and not exact and may very well be encoded using the same settings ... or need tweaking to correct common issues.

Rather than getting into a twist, how about you provide an original segment which has proven to show pixel issues using hcenc but none in windows dvd maker ... and allow us to show you hcenc at it's best.

Would also like to see mediainfo output from the samples produced where you made you first statement regarding the issue with hcenc's ouput in comparison to windows dvd maker ... this tell's a fair amount of what went in or rather not ... for given output

Then this post might be a little more helpful to those that search the forum in the future for help and guidance.

[unclescoob]

Bjs, you are on point, dude. Now THIS is what I'm talking about. Yes, I'm going to provide results with mediainfo (I believe g-spot does the same thing)?

I have the feeling that I'm going to be proven wrong about Hcenc (and I actually do hope that I am!) as this would end my quest for the perfect encoder. Now, regarding Windows: You stated that Windows does it's own thing when converting, yet much has to be done with Hcenc.

Here's my question (yes, a complete n00b one at that, but here goes): If I achieve the same results with both, Windows and Hcenc, but in Hcenc, I have to do extra work, is there any other reason, why I should NOT utilize Windows? No trick question, no taunt. I am really curious as to why, if the picture looks great, would I be advised against using it? You see, I have asked this before, but the answer never goes any further than (in a New Jersey truck driver's voice) "well D-uuh, you shouldn't let that Windows piece of crap make decisions for you because..uh....d-uh...it's not good".

And thanks, by the way. You made an excellent point.

[usually_quiet]

I have tried Windows DVD Maker, plus AVStoDVD with HCEnc for encoding. I almost never work with AVI files, so I can't comment on how any of these programs handle them. I wanted something that was easy to use for converting some of my HDTV recordings to regular DVD format. With the settings I'm using and MPEG-2 files as input, I don't see pixelation in the output from AVStoDVD, unless it was there to begin with.

Windows DVD Maker is easy to use and provides a variety of menu templates, some with flashy video effects but it lacks some features I need or want. I prefer AVStoDVD.

AVStoDVD allows me to adjust the color using Avisynth. I can also crop pillarboxes from 4:3 content that is aired on a 720p or 1080i channel. Using windows DVD Maker, I have no way to do either of these things.

What I found was any time I converted from 1080i or 720p recordings to 720x480 for DVD, the converted video was too red, or not green enough, depending on how someone wants to think about the problem. This was true for both of these DVD converters. The output from Microsoft's encoder may or may not be acceptable. I didn't use it long enough to say. It isn't acceptable to have light-skinned people look sun-burnt and other similar color defects when compared to the original recording, and have no way to correct the problem.

[Cornucopia]

If you really want to put your money where your mouth is, in addition to posting samples of Output1 (HCEnc) and Output2 (W DVD M), you would also post the same length clip of the Input (source), along with those parameters you chose for the prep and execution of those encodings.

Then, others could choose to verify (positively or negatively) the truth of your assertion, and possibly give (BETTER) alternatives.

Scott

[unclescoob]

Great input guys, thanks alot for your contributions. No further comments on my part. My next posting will be the video clips along with all the encoding information.

[jagabo]

What I found was any time I converted from 1080i or 720p recordings to 720x480 for DVD, the converted video was too red, or not green enough, depending on how someone wants to think about the problem.

You need to convert from rec.709 to rec.601, basically HD color to SD color. ColorMatrix("mode="Rec.709->Rec.601") in AviSynth.

Example:
https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/329866-incorrect-collor-display-in-video-playback?p...=1#post2045830

[ron spencer]

Entertaining thread....I remember when I first used HCEnc....got it right the first time, but then again I read a guide or two first. I suspect the OP did no such thing in the first place.

[_MrC_]

What I found was any time I converted from 1080i or 720p recordings to 720x480 for DVD, the converted video was too red, or not green enough, depending on how someone wants to think about the problem.

You need to convert from rec.709 to rec.601, basically HD color to SD color. ColorMatrix("mode="Rec.709->Rec.601") in AviSynth.

Example:
https://forum.videohelp.com/threads/329866-incorrect-collor-display-in-video-playback?p...=1#post2045830

Using AVStoDVD, go to 'Edit Title'/'AviSynth' and use 'ColorMatrix' option with default settings.



Bye

[Baldrick]

Restoration? No. Moving to our video conversion section.