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  1. I have just transferred about 25 VHS-C tapes filmed with the same camera bought in the early 1990s. The owners used it until about 2003 when they bought a new one.

    Two tapes I've found with similar problems. On the tapes where the problems appear they are not there on all scenes recorded on the tape.

    Every scene or group of shots taken during the same day act as one of the following:

    1. Looks like any other material recorded with the camera on any of the other ~25 tapes.

    2. Have these fading black horizontal streaks around high contrast edges.
    Click image for larger version

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    or...
    3. Looks like this with the black horizontal streaks and something that looks like black or white flames coming from some areas.
    Click image for larger version

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    The problems appear on all machines I've tried so far. they look about the same on my Sony, Panasonic and Philips VCRs On two Philips machines the scenes were these artefacts appear also have tracking and colour issues.

    As it seems to be problems with the recording or the tape and I don't have the money to get professional equipment to combat the issues on these 2 tapes I'm trying to find a filter solution to mask these artefacts. I know it won't be pretty in the worst scenes but at least some scenes will look quite okay especially the ones with just the black streaks.

    Any idea on filters that might fix this without altering too many "good" pixels

    [EDIT] Forgot to say that one of the problematic tapes were made in 1995 and the other in 2000 and all tapes were made with the same camera and it were never repaired and the tapes made between the tapes with errors played fine.
    Last edited by MadMax_911; 20th Jun 2011 at 14:05.
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  2. If you can't do a better transfer or a hardware fix , or the problems are on the tape recording themselves, a software method will depend on the distribution of artifacts. If the distribution is random and differ between fields or frames then you can use motion compensated scripts and filters to fill in the defects. Most of the avisynth methods will be based on mvtools/mvtools2 . Persistent defects that exist on adjacent fields or frames won't be detected or treated

    Some functions like removedirtmc may work , or even more complex ones like one in this thread by "yup" specifically for black lines and dropouts. Of course, you would have to adjust the settings for your specific source
    http://forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=121197&page=3


    Yup's example


    Uploaded with ImageShack.us



    An example with stacked filters



    Uploaded with ImageShack.us



    Your 2nd problem is probably more difficult to treat. Maybe if you could upload a sample or describe how the distribution you might get better suggestions
    Last edited by poisondeathray; 20th Jun 2011 at 14:45.
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  3. Here are three files 1 and 2 are clips of around 2 sec of 2 clips with the different artefacts encoded with lagarith.
    the third file is a mjpeg of the same two clips (both).
    Image Attached Files
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  4. I'm trying to wrap my head around yup right now. it looks like it may help with the black streaks
    Last edited by MadMax_911; 20th Jun 2011 at 16:24. Reason: baad spelling
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  5. Yup filterchain does remove some lines but does not work where more than two lines are adjacent. I'll have to continue tomorrow after some work and some sleep.
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  6. As mentioned earlier, none of the Motion compensated filters will work well when the defects are persistent (in the same spot on every frame or adjacent even fields or odd fields). Only defects that are randomly distributed are detected and treated , so you'll find only those random peripheral dropouts will be filled in fairly well.
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  7. Member 2Bdecided's Avatar
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    Someone posted something very similar recently, but without the certain knowledge that other scenes from the same machine were just fine.

    In that case, I was 75% sure that the weird content was really S-VHS on VHS tape. But here it can't be, so I'm stuck.

    ...unless all scenes except these ones work OK with Quasi-S-VHS playback, and these two fail - so, as a mad idea, have you tried an S-VHS machine?!

    Or LP/EP?

    Cheers,
    David.
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  8. I havn't tried a svhs deck because I don't seem to know anyone that owns one. But I have tried a vhs deck that claims to play svhs.
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  9. I have also the same issues. Have you find any solution how to remove those annoying black lines ?
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  10. Originally Posted by htlecso View Post
    I have also the same issues. Have you find any solution how to remove those annoying black lines ?
    Have you already tried the S-VHS solution?
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  11. Originally Posted by smrpix View Post
    Originally Posted by htlecso View Post
    I have also the same issues. Have you find any solution how to remove those annoying black lines ?
    Have you already tried the S-VHS solution?
    I have a brand new LG VHS player and a Samsung, too. Both produces the same issue.. Bad VHS-C playback using a JVC adaptor.
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  12. Why do we see those black lines ? Low casette quality? Bad recording device? Or those black linees are not present on the casette because the problem is with the playback devices ?
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  13. S-VHS uses a higher signal strength than regular VHS and those lines are essentially the video being too visually "loud" for the standard player. You need an S-VHS player.
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  14. i'd need to copy these recordings to my desktop DVD recorder. So there is no workaround or any settings modification that could help at least to reduce this "noise" ? The only solution is to get an svhs casette player ?
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  15. That's the only solution that won't further damage the image. It's been covered fairly well earlier in this thread.
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  16. I'm sad to say that in my case neither the use of a player with quasi svhs playback OR an actual svhs-player did any help. There were some improvements but the combo of svhs-player and recorder I tried the tape on used quite heavy filtering. I didn't bother to tinker with the settings since it didn't fix the bad tape.
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  17. Member PuzZLeR's Avatar
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    Three things I can suggest. Maybe no promise in either, but worth trying.

    1) Least likely to solve the problem since I personally think the signal the tape is giving is too strong for the VCR(s) you're using, but, ... manually clean the VCR(s). Many YouTube videos show you how to do this. I doubt it's The Solution, but just a suggestion.

    2) Can I get you to try something? Can you capture a small part of the tape, like 2 seconds, but capture the same segment three times under the same settings, and upload the clips? If such streaks are random on playback, then median methods will reduce them significantly. Some of us, including me, would love to try this for you.

    3) I have a JVC SR-V101US deck, an "S-VHS Professional" unit. I personally never really liked it as it "over-processed" too much of my content, giving it that look of an artificially sharpened over-smooth feel. (Kind of what you talked about of another.)

    However - ONE advantage it has, and one reason why I keep it around to some extent, was that it seemed to be better than most with some problem tapes like this. I'm not saying you should buy and try, but, if you like, you can feel free to P/M me here and arrange for me to try maybe one of the tapes on this VCR and let you know how it goes, and we can take it from there.

    I will also be happy to send the tape back for free, regardless of how it goes.

    That "over processing" that this JVC does may very well be for tapes like this. It completely cleared such artifacts on one particular tape I remember.
    I hate VHS. I always did.
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  18. Originally Posted by MadMax_911 View Post
    I have just transferred about 25 VHS-C tapes filmed with the same camera bought in the early 1990s. The owners used it until about 2003 when they bought a new one.

    Two tapes I've found with similar problems. On the tapes where the problems appear they are not there on all scenes recorded on the tape.

    Every scene or group of shots taken during the same day act as one of the following:

    1. Looks like any other material recorded with the camera on any of the other ~25 tapes.

    2. Have these fading black horizontal streaks around high contrast edges.
    Image
    [Attachment 7490 - Click to enlarge]

    or...
    3. Looks like this with the black horizontal streaks and something that looks like black or white flames coming from some areas.
    Image
    [Attachment 7491 - Click to enlarge]


    The problems appear on all machines I've tried so far. they look about the same on my Sony, Panasonic and Philips VCRs On two Philips machines the scenes were these artefacts appear also have tracking and colour issues.

    As it seems to be problems with the recording or the tape and I don't have the money to get professional equipment to combat the issues on these 2 tapes I'm trying to find a filter solution to mask these artefacts. I know it won't be pretty in the worst scenes but at least some scenes will look quite okay especially the ones with just the black streaks.

    Any idea on filters that might fix this without altering too many "good" pixels

    [EDIT] Forgot to say that one of the problematic tapes were made in 1995 and the other in 2000 and all tapes were made with the same camera and it were never repaired and the tapes made between the tapes with errors played fine.
    I believe that this may be either a faulty sensor or recording function in the camera - the overscan shows no issues yet the issues seem to happen in the same places. I believe a line TBC with noise reduction will help straighten the image and eliminate some noise but the damage is definitely done.

    My suggested fix would be following as a quick fix, though I would keep master copies as tech/avisnyth improves:

    1. crop the bad portion out on the left and balance with right
    2. deinterlace
    3. light denoise
    4. descratch/devhs
    5. resize as needed

    I am not naming specific filters because I haven't seen this before, but that corner is more or less gone. This is far from perfect and somewhat of an ugly way to do it but it will get rid of most of that issue on the first clip.

    This might be best done frame by frame.
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  19. Video Restorer lordsmurf's Avatar
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    Software can't fix this.
    You need a better capture.
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  20. Member SHS's Avatar
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    The only way I can think as long it play on TV set is DYI Flat Screen CRT or Projection TV + Black Box + VCR and Camcorder to re-capture footage
    Image Attached Thumbnails Click image for larger version

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  21. Member
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    Originally Posted by htlecso View Post
    Originally Posted by smrpix View Post
    Originally Posted by htlecso View Post
    I have also the same issues. Have you find any solution how to remove those annoying black lines ?
    Have you already tried the S-VHS solution?
    I have a brand new LG VHS player and a Samsung, too. Both produces the same issue.. Bad VHS-C playback using a JVC adaptor.
    The ragged left edge in Sample #3 suggests timing problems. My guess is that your adaptor is bogging down the transport. You may get a better result playing back in a VHS-C camera without the adaptor.
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