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  1. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    I'm thinking of buying this: http://www.borisfx.com/sony/bccsvp/

    It's a set of plugins for Vegas Pro that seems to offer what AE has, but for 40% less moolah. I'm doing the trial now, and what impresses me is that it runs INSIDE Vegas and has the same functionality as the Vegas built-in plugs, i.e. you can call them up just like any other FX.

    I've been jealous of you AE people, but just don't like Adobe, or want to fork over a grand to them.

    Any comments will definitely be appreciated.
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  2. Member edDV's Avatar
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    Boris FX is more focused to instant template effects (that can be modified) vs. AE which is more general purpose.

    In other words, hours vs days to get an optimized result.

    In other words, one might use AE to prototype Boris FX.
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  3. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    What struck me about the plug-ins is that they are so finely detailed as far as sculpting exactly the effect you had in mind, rather than, as you say, a generalized effect that could be tweaked, but not fundamentally changed. It's VERY robust.

    EdDV, I value your input, PDR, Jag, and FB too, and would you say that the Continuum package would be roughly equivalent to AE?

    I don't mind building my own FX presets, in fact I prefer it because I want to do my own thing, not canned stuff.

    By prototype, do you mean "make a rough interpretation"? Like a prototype of a car looks great, but hasn't been fleshed out all the way.
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  4. Blender + built-in VSE = free!
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  5. I used to use an old version of Boris Continuum (v5 or v6 , can't recall) . This newest version looks improved, with GPU accelerated effects

    It has many similar plugins and effects that AE has, but AE is much more than just a collection of plugins - it has a lot more utility.

    If you're looking for "plugins", before you buy, "new blue fx" seem to be popular with Vegas users too . You might want to check that out as well

    The mistake in comparing AE as a $1K piece of software, is that nobody buys it alone. You buy it for ~$1500 as a Production suite but that INCLUDES Photoshop, Illustrator, Premiere, Encore , Flash, AME, Audition, a few other things. Each title alone is ~ $600-700 separately.... you do the math .

    Yes, Adobe is bloat ware, but the greatest thing about it is the intergration with dynamic link. You can make edits in photoshop and have them update in real time in premiere or AE; or make some changes in AE and have them update in Premiere etc... You get the idea... Very handy and timesaving
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  6. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by chowmein View Post
    Blender + built-in VSE = free!
    I tried Blender a couple times, and just couldn't get the hang of it. WAY too tough.
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  7. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    To PDR: The thing is, I'm a lone wolf, and I remember you saying that on TV you can recognize the AE motion graphics, and I don't want to be pigeonholed in that majority pipeline.

    I don't like NewBlue either, seems like that stuff is for newbies, and they charge too much too.
    Last edited by budwzr; 14th Jun 2011 at 22:38.
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  8. Originally Posted by budwzr View Post
    To PDR: The thing is, I'm a lone wolf, and I remember you saying that on TV you can recognize the AE motion graphics, and I don't want to be pigeonholed in that majority pipeline.
    Maybe you got the wrong impression. I'm not saying everything is generic , I was saying you recognize how that could be done in AE, and most likely it was done in AE. Some 3rd party plugins are way overused, and some techniques are way way overused too.

    AE isn't responsible for canned graphics, it's up to you - the artist - to make it spectacular and unique. AE is just a tool; an enabler. But the accessibilty and (relative) ease of use of AE combined with the rise of video tutorials (look at videocopilot.net, some of the tutorials have millions of views), makes it possible for your "average joe" to do the fancy stuff you see on TV that was virtually impossible to do just a few years ago. I would say 90-95% of the fancy motion graphics you see on TV are done in AE. It's that popular for pro VFX artists. Most of the good ones combine it with true 3d programs (3DSMax, Cinema4D, etc....)
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  9. Originally Posted by budwzr View Post
    Originally Posted by chowmein View Post
    Blender + built-in VSE = free!
    I tried Blender a couple times, and just couldn't get the hang of it. WAY too tough.
    Did you look at 2.5+ versions? Because it's totally revamped and streamlined. YES it is difficult to get that initial "foot in the door" (like, say, Photoshop - but worse)... but once you do, it all starts making a lot of sense.

    This is very good for beginners (combined with his youtube videos chapter by chapter).

    (By "VSE" I meant "NLE". Blender has a very sophisticated built-in NLE.)

    But yes, I do agree, it is a steep learning curve. But well-worth the initial pain!
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  10. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    Whoever can use Blender, I give them a lot of respect. When I tried to learn it, I found out you HAVE to use keyboard shortcuts, no way around it.

    I tried Bryce and Daz too, no go.
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    I think if I were in your shoes, I’d go with the Boris plug-in. AfterEffects is a lot like the full-blown version of Photoshop; almost limitless capabilities, but only a few of which most of us will actually use on a regular basis. Boris FX products have always been good, and they tend to be much better at streamlining the FX process, while giving you plenty of customizing leeway to tweak things your own way.

    Like Avid NLE software, AE is widely used by corporate and independent “pro” shops, simply because project work tends to pass through many hands, and software universality is needed. Also, to some degree, it offers a certain bit of snob appeal among peers in the indie and corporate video realm. And obviously, AE would be the way to go if clients demand it, and if you have a burning enthusiasm (and ample time) for all-things-FX. There are so many tutorials out there that the learning curve is not too bad.

    But the most important thing is the end result. Ultimately, no viewer will care what tools you used to get there.

    Back when I was running a video department for the corporate moneybags, I always demanded top-of-the line tools. But when I went into business for myself--bankrolling hardware and software out of my own pocket--I had to focus on what worked and what was practical, without emptying my bank account. You may want to employ a similar approach. Ask yourself if there is something your videos need that only AE can provide. Chances are, the makers of Continuum have likely already anticipated most of your needs.

    These days, I fully concur with your opinion of Adobe. The only reason I still use some of their products is longtime familiarity. (Back in the late ‘90s, Premiere offered the biggest Windows-based NLE bang for the buck. These days, that honor goes to Vegas—all the way. Similarly, the Boris plug-ins focus on the things you need most, without all the bloat.)

    In the end, neither choice will be wrong. Both products offer tons of support and tutorials. You just have to go with what’s the best fit--and value--for you.
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  12. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by filmboss80 View Post
    These days, I fully concur with your opinion of Adobe. The only reason I still use some of their products is longtime familiarity. (Back in the late ‘90s, Premiere offered the biggest Windows-based NLE bang for the buck. These days, that honor goes to Vegas—all the way. Similarly, the Boris plug-ins focus on the things you need most, without all the bloat.)

    In the end, neither choice will be wrong. Both products offer tons of support and tutorials. You just have to go with what’s the best fit--and value--for you.
    Yeah, ditto, I already have an intelligent timeline and excellent editing framework, I just want the robust tools of AE without the Adobe extra baggage weighing me down.

    Thanks for the opinion(s)
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  13. I guess it also depends just what you want to achieve? Do you want to model 3D objects and composite them into real-life video? Machstudio Pro is now free (!), and there are free camera tracking apps now also.
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  14. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by chowmein View Post
    I guess it also depends just what you want to achieve? Do you want to model 3D objects and composite them into real-life video? Machstudio Pro is now free (!), and there are free camera tracking apps now also.
    I just bought a cheapee 3D program, but I'm going to check that out.

    I want to move into motion graphics, because it's the new language that speaks to anyone regardless of culture. I made this simple animation http://youtu.be/m_En_2M7Kv0 from 10 lower case ells typed together saved as a PNG, and I was thinking, HEY, this is unique, so I caught the fever.
    Last edited by budwzr; 15th Jun 2011 at 13:13.
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  15. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    No luck with MachStudio, it won't run and complains about my graphic card.

    UPDATE: I dumped that basterd.
    Last edited by budwzr; 15th Jun 2011 at 15:33.
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  16. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    Well, I'm not so hot on Boris now.

    In regards to the "EPS Extrude" filter, it only takes .ai or.eps files, not .png or .svg. So since I use CorelDraw, I exported to both formats to test. The 32 bit version (of Boris) chokes on the .ai file, but the 64 bit version takes it fine. The 32 bit version doesn't like either one, and fails to display anything in the preview window.

    Seems like it's "Adobe-centric" in that everyone surely must be using AI.

    So Boris fails to get my $600, because their 3D Vector Extrusion is not as good as the $39 Aurora 3D Animator I bought not too long ago. (And who wants to sit there adjusting 100 different sliders) The Aurora software creates keyframes on the fly while you manipulate the object with your mouse.
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  17. Look I know you aren't necessarily enthused about Blender, but check out this brand new video tutorial series about rotoscoping in Blender. I haven't watched all the way through yet, but it seems to cater for folk new to Blender.
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  18. Member budwzr's Avatar
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    OK, I'll give it another try.

    I'm going to watch the tutes at blendercookie first so I don't get frustrated trying to do things, but can Blender output to something with a transparent alpha? Like .png still image sequence? Because I want to composite in Vegas.

    I see it takes .svg, so that's good.
    Last edited by budwzr; 16th Jun 2011 at 18:18.
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