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  1. Member
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    Good day everyone.

    My Goal: Backup Blu-Ray discs to my desktop computer's hard drive (2TB) for streaming to my TV via XBox and TVersity on a 100Mbps wired home network (or some other method if one is suggested). (REVISED 5/24/2011)

    Requirements:
    1. Keep Blu-Ray quality @ 1080 resolution & 5.1 channels of audio for my surround sound system.
    2. Reasonable file size. Preferably 10GB each (REVISED 5/24/2011), but I'm not sure if that is realistic or even possible given the above. File size preference is flexible; resolution and audio format is not.
    Software: Willing to use any free or commercial software. Already have AnyDVD HD to rip. Encoder is up for debate, but I'd prefer not to have to use six different programs.


    Questions:
    1. Can XBox (Arcade) connected to network via Cat 5e wire (100Mbps) handle Blu-Ray quality (1080 & 5.1 audio) streaming video from my computer using TVersity?
    2. If not, what other methods are there for streaming video to my TV in the quality I'd like to?
    3. What software encoder should I use, and what bit rates and other settings should I use within that software to attain the above desired results (retain 5.1 channels of audio and minimal loss in quality)?
    Thanks,

    eaglenebula5
    Last edited by eaglenebula5; 24th May 2011 at 21:12. Reason: Revised Goal and Requirements
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  2. aBigMeanie aedipuss's Avatar
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    a blu-ray 1080 movie at 2gb is going to look like crap. if you downsize to 720p a filesize of 5-8gb is ok depending on the movie. for 1080 you'd need more like 15-20gb.

    cat5e is a cable type. the network itself would be either 10, 100, or 1000mbps. the later 2 can work.

    i use a dedicated nas dlna file server box with 2-2tb hard drives, over gig-e(1000mbps) and wireless n. for 1080p only the wired gig-e works.
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  3. Member
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    Okay, so 2GB isn't realistic. What software do you use? And what settings would you use?

    You mentioned some type of hardware item. Do you use this versus an XBox 360 for any particular reason?

    Thanks!

    Let me rephrase one of my questions: Can an XBox 360 (Arcade, if that matters) handle 1080 and 5.1 audio? If so, in what container and what codec? If not, what is the next best thing it can handle, AND what are my other options to getting the 1080/5.1 setup I want?

    P.S. I understand networking. I should have been more clear about that part. It's a 100Mbps wired network where all devices are connected via in-wall wiring. Cannot get a Cat 6/1000Mbps setup due to the in-wall wiring.
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  4. Member
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    New information...

    Just read: http://www.digital-digest.com/articles/Xbox_360_MKV_Playback_Guide_page1.html

    In it, it says:

    The "High@4.1" indicates that the H.264 High Profile was used with Level 4.1 decoding. This is excellent, as the Xbox 360 supports High Profile up to level 4.1. Any higher (for example 4.2, or 5.1), and the Xbox 360 might struggle to play the file or play it with a blank screen. Any lower is no problem at all. The third piece of information is the number of audio channels. The Xbox 360 will only support 2 channel audio, so anything higher will automatically be downmixed by GOTSent to 2 channels, so be aware of this limitation before proceeding.
    It sounds as if the XBox 360 cannot handle surround sound--only stereo? If so, then I am confused. Games I have played on it have made sounds come from behind me (and only from behind) on my two rear speakers.
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    Some people have used BD Rebuilder to compress blu ray video down to the 4.3gb size needed to fit onto a single layer dvd. I've done it myself on a test encode and the results weren't too bad. Going to the 7.9gb size to fit a double layer dvd gives a much better quality output.

    BD Rebuilder also has the ability to output as .mkv or .mp4 files (more limited options for mp4).

    Handbrake and Ripbot264 are two other programs you should look at for compressing and changing formats.

    Sorry can't advise you on networking or Xbox 360, as I don't work with either.
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  6. Originally Posted by eaglenebula5 View Post
    It sounds as if the XBox 360 cannot handle surround sound--only stereo? If so, then I am confused. Games I have played on it have made sounds come from behind me (and only from behind) on my two rear speakers.
    The 360 can only stream 5.1 audio in AVI (Xvid/Divx) and WMV formats. With MP4 files you are limited to 2 channel audio.

    Most software will downmix 5.1 audio to 2 channel Dolby Surround, this of course not as good as true 5.1 audio.

    Another fly in the ointment is the fact that the 360 can only stream files of 4 gigabytes or less. The only exception is with WMV files, which have no such size limit.
    Last edited by mh2360; 21st May 2011 at 17:25.
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  7. aBigMeanie aedipuss's Avatar
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    it's a dedicated fileserver. nothing else has to be on to stream files to any device on the network. like this
    http://us.zyxel.com/Products/details.aspx?PC1IndexFlag=20050125090459&CategoryGroupNo=...7-1BF2BB2F6875
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  8. Member
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    Originally Posted by mh2360 View Post
    Originally Posted by eaglenebula5 View Post
    It sounds as if the XBox 360 cannot handle surround sound--only stereo? If so, then I am confused. Games I have played on it have made sounds come from behind me (and only from behind) on my two rear speakers.
    The 360 can only stream 5.1 audio in AVI (Xvid/Divx) and WMV formats. With MP4 files you are limited to 2 channel audio.

    Most software will downmix 5.1 audio to 2 channel Dolby Surround, this of course not as good as true 5.1 audio.

    Another fly in the ointment is the fact that the 360 can only stream files of 4 gigabytes or less. The only exception is with WMV files, which have no such size limit.

    Let me make sure I understand this...

    You're saying XBox 360 can do the following:

    ...in MP4: 2 audio channels, file size limited to 4GB. (Doesn't match my specifications.)
    ...in AVI (Xvid/Divx): 5.1 surround sound, file size limited to 4GB. (Doesn't match my specifications, but closer.)
    ...in WMV: 5.1 surround sound, no file size limit. (Matches my specifications, except that I have no idea how large the movie would be in WMV format.)

    Is this accurate?

    If so, then I have a few questions:
    1. Is the 4GB file size limit applicable to files on the XBox's hard drive only? That is, can I use TVersity to stream the files from my computer to XBox, and then XBox to TV? I have already streamed files larger than 4GB this way, so I think I already know this answer. But I would like to be sure.
    2. It sounds like the WMV format is my best choice. However, can the XBox stream (via the above mentioned setup using TVersity) files in Blu Ray quality (1920x1080), or is it limited to 720?
    3. Are WMV and Xvid/DivX compatible?
    4. You mentioned most software only give you the choice of 2 channels. I believe you as this has been my experience. So, what software can convert raw blu-ray files into WMV format with 5.1 audio channels?
    Thanks!

    eaglenebula5
    Last edited by eaglenebula5; 24th May 2011 at 21:16.
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  9. Originally Posted by eaglenebula5 View Post

    Let me make sure I understand this...

    You're saying XBox 360 can do the following:

    ...in MP4: 2 audio channels, file size limited to 4GB. (Doesn't match my specifications.)
    ...in AVI (Xvid/Divx): 5.1 surround sound, file size limited to 4GB. (Doesn't match my specifications, but closer.)
    ...in WMV: 5.1 surround sound, no file size limit. (Matches my specifications, except that I have no idea how large the movie would be in WMV format.)

    Is this accurate?
    100% Correct.

    Originally Posted by eaglenebula5 View Post
    If so, then I have a few questions:
    1. Is the 4GB file size limit applicable to files on the XBox's hard drive only? That is, can I use TVersity to stream the files from my computer to XBox, and then XBox to TV? I have already streamed files larger than 4GB this way, so I think I already know this answer. But I would like to be sure.
    2. It sounds like the WMV format is my best choice. However, can the XBox stream (via the above mentioned setup using TVersity) files in Blu Ray quality (1920x1080), or is it limited to 720?
    3. Are WMV and Xvid/DivX compatible?
    4. You mentioned most software only give you the choice of 2 channels. I believe you as this has been my experience. So, what software can convert raw blu-ray files into WMV format with 5.1 audio channels?
    Thanks!


    eaglenebula5

    1. The 4GB limit applies when playing videos from a USB device, an optical disc or streaming via Windows Media Player. I don't think the 4GB limit applies when transcoding with something like TVersity.
    2. The 360 can handle 1080p WMV files just fine.
    3. Not sure what you mean.
    4. Microsoft Expression Encoder comes with fully functional WMV encoding in the free version, you may just have to make sure your Directshow filters are set up correctly. Tmpgenc Mastering Works does a fine job encoding WMV with 5.1 audio, but isn't free.
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  10. Member yoda313's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by mh2360
    1. The 4GB limit applies when playing videos from a USB device,
    For the xbox 360 the workaround is to use the MAC HFS format. You can buy the software macdrive plus for windows so you can format a usb drive and load files > 4gb like you would with a ntfs drive. I've done it myself on windows and my xbox 360. I have a wdtv media player so I don't need to do this anymore but it does work.

    edit - above number 3 - the 360 does play xvid, wmv and divx. I believe it plays high def for all 3 - though not a 100% sure - sd for sure.
    Donatello - The Shredder? Michelangelo - Maybe all that hardware is for making coleslaw?
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  11. I tried to go the whole video streaming to the 360 and just gave up on it. The 360 is too limited on its video formats and I did not want a PC transcoding. The best HD quality you can stream will be a Blu-Ray to WMV-HD conversion. I tried some of that, but encoding to that format seemed much slower than going a h.264 route.

    My advise, get a streamer or Blu-Ray player that can stream. There are tons out there that can play just about every format under the sun plus get access to Netflix, Amazon VOD, Hulu, ect. Handbrake and Ripbot can convert BR to MKV much faster than trying to go WMV-HD.

    Leave your 360 to gaming.
    For the love of God, use hub/core labels on your Recordable Discs!
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  12. Member
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    Originally Posted by mh2360 View Post

    1. The 4GB limit applies when playing videos from a USB device, an optical disc or streaming via Windows Media Player. I don't think the 4GB limit applies when transcoding with something like TVersity.
    2. The 360 can handle 1080p WMV files just fine.
    3. Not sure what you mean.
    4. Microsoft Expression Encoder comes with fully functional WMV encoding in the free version, you may just have to make sure your Directshow filters are set up correctly. Tmpgenc Mastering Works does a fine job encoding WMV with 5.1 audio, but isn't free.
    1. Thanks. That confirms what I had already been doing. It does, however, appear through some testing, that trying to play an M2TS Blu-Ray file on XBox 360 through TVersity doesn't work so well. It plays, but is choppy even on a wired connection. I do not know what the cause is, but I suspect it's either the 30Mbps bit rate, or the shear file size (was playing a 16.7GB file). On that note, I did get an Xvid 21Mbps bit rate video with stereo sound to play. It was 14.1GB.

    2. Great. I tested this out last night. I managed to get a video editor (Pinnacle--meant for making home movies) to encode my M2TS file into a 1080 WMV file with 6 channels of audio, but at only 5MBps. If you had never seen the original movie at Blu-Ray's 30Mbps, you probably wouldn't notice a slight color variation (more red) or the slightly grainy-er picture. I had to put a frame capture side by side in Photoshop to be able to see the subtle differences. The file size was significantly smaller, but it did take several hours for just 5 minutes of video. I left it to do it's thing after I went to bed so I don't know how long it took exactly. I've put in a support request at Pinnacle to see how to up the bit rate in this format as it shows you a greyed-out text box containing the bit rate. So, it seems like it ought to be able to be changed, but I haven't been able to figure out how to "un-grey" it.

    3. I was asking if .wmv files can be in Xvid or DivX codec. But, I'm guessing not...

    4. Thanks, I will check those programs out and post back with my results.

    Originally Posted by jntaylor63
    The best HD quality you can stream will be a Blu-Ray to WMV-HD conversion. I tried some of that, but encoding to that format seemed much slower than going a h.264 route.
    Okay, so that's two votes for best quality being WMV-HD on XBox. Having done some fiddling with it last night, so far, I'd have to agree. And I agree on the speed issue. As I said above, it took a long time for just 5 minutes of video. I'd be willing to go that route if it can finish encoding over 1 night while I'm asleep and if I can figure out how to increase the bit rate in Pinnacle. Maybe the two programs mh2360 just mentioned will do the trick.

    My problem with H264 is that I have yet to be able to find an encoder willing to do more than 2 channels of audio.

    Originally Posted by jntaylor63
    My advise, get a streamer or Blu-Ray player that can stream. There are tons out there that can play just about every format under the sun plus get access to Netflix, Amazon VOD, Hulu, ect. Handbrake and Ripbot can convert BR to MKV much faster than trying to go WMV-HD.
    I do own a Blu-Ray DVD player, but I don't have it in my home right now. The wife has it with her and the baby until the fall when she moves up to where I live. (Just got a new job and had to move before the rest of the family.)

    The player is a Sony BDP-S570, and I can watch all those services you mentioned. I've done an internet search, but cannot find any mention of whether or not it will stream video from my PC to the TV. Can anyone confirm or deny this?


    Thanks!

    eaglenebula5
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