An analysis of "static bars" error needed

[moxiecat]

I have a few VHS-C tapes I am transferring. All are SP and about 10 years old. And all of them display the same error on playback: 2 thick bars of noise/static across the top half of the picture. Here is a screenshot from the tape when played back with a motorized VHS-C adapter in a Panasonic AG-1980:



After playing the tape in the Panny, I played two other regular tapes in it, and they played fine (so the heads were not dirty or contaminated by the VHS-C tape). I also put the VHS-C tape in a different VHS-C adapter, but that did not make a difference either.

I have also tried the tapes in a JVC SR-S9911U, a JVC SR-W5U, and a Sharp VC-H810. They all display the same error.

Manual tracking makes no difference. I have also inspected the tapes visually and cannot find anything like visibly crinkled edges (but admittedly I'm not a tape repair pro).

One final note: when the tape is rewound or fast-forwarded while playing, the picture is perfectly clear. The noise bars disappear.

Has anyone seen anything like this before? I am really stumped. Is it possible that this is how the VHS-C camcorder recorded the tapes? (Since more than one has the same exact problem.) But then why would there be a clear picture when rewinding and fast-forwarding?

Any insight is most welcome. Thanks!

[NJRoadfan]

Have you tried the tape directly in a VHS-C camcorder to rule out the adapter causing playback problems? It could be the adapter, or the camcorder was misaligned when the video was recorded.

[moxiecat]

I don't have any "good quality" camcorders (all need work of one kind of another), so I haven't tried that yet because I thought the good VCRs were a better test. But I will try it and post back. Thanks.

Yes, one of my guesses is that the camcorder was misaligned. I've certainly run into that problem over the years with 8mm tapes! However, I've always been told that since 8mm cams/decks don't have tracking controls, there is no way to fix it. But VHS/VHS-C DOES have tracking controls. And yet that's still not fixing the problem here.

[moxiecat]

OK, I tried one of the tapes in a JVC GR-SXM920 VHS-C camcorder. The same static bars are there. Actually, the camcorder has a much tougher time stabilizing the video than the VHS decks did (but the camcorder might need cleaning, and I generally don't think those cams lock down VHS-C tapes as well as a good JVC or Panny deck).

[NJRoadfan]

Yes, one of my guesses is that the camcorder was misaligned. I've certainly run into that problem over the years with 8mm tapes! However, I've always been told that since 8mm cams/decks don't have tracking controls, there is no way to fix it. But VHS/VHS-C DOES have tracking controls. And yet that's still not fixing the problem here.

If you suspect a tracking problem, find a throwaway VCR and purposely mis-align it and see if the snow goes away.

[moxiecat]

LOL...that's a great suggestion, and I will definitely keep it in mind. It's just a little beyond my current technical capabilities.

[2Bdecided]

Has anyone seen anything like this before? I am really stumped. Is it possible that this is how the VHS-C camcorder recorded the tapes? (Since more than one has the same exact problem.) But then why would there be a clear picture when rewinding and fast-forwarding?

...because the tape/head angle is slightly different when fast-winding, and compensates for the misalignment of the original recording?

Though I don't think it's misalignment in any simple sense - it could be a tape transport error when recording which means the tape didn't sit across the heads quite right, so there's no single standard tracking setting that works. You could do worse than put objects in the tape transport path near the edge to bend the tape in the same way. At your own risk of course - you're just as likely to wreck the tape and/or recorder as to get a successful result.

Alternatively, it could be a faulty control track - check that head is clear - if it was dirty when recording, that's a whole 'nother problem - and may be a different explanation for why visual search works, while play doesn't. However, that normally affects the entire picture rather than bands of it, so I'm doubtful.

What you really need is the original camcorder.

Cheers,
David.

[olyteddy]

Is the tape physically damaged? Scratched or gouged or creased?

[moxiecat]

No, none of the tapes display any physical damage that I can see. (And there are at least 3 tapes that have the same exact error.)

David, thanks for the explanation on the tape transport error idea. That does seem like a good explanation.

I'll see if I can get ahold of the original camcorder.

Thanks again!

[vhelp]

I have similar noise on my 8mm tapes. they were fine when i first recorded them and later watched them on my tv back during the time i used to shoot home video '98 or so. but a few years later, a destroyed a lot of them when i was fast forwarding to different scenes. come on.. we all do that.. thats why they added the feature. anyway. i did a lot of that and sure enough, this added those staticky noise you see now. playing them on another 8mm recorder did nothing, infact i would say added worse. but each persons situation is different. so who knows.

so some how these f-fw and f-rw does damage to the tape. i am guessing that the speedy passing of the tape makes contact to the recording parts of the head and this happens, but i'm sure exactly.

so it seems you may have f-fw/rw on all your tapes which may indicate they all have this phenomina. lets just hope i'm wrong.

ether way, my suggestion is that this function should never be used. instead, just play through completely while capturing from it. don't worry so much about the capture quality just so long as you have a digitial copy that, now, you can use in place of the tape and then you f-fw/rw w/out damage and is much quicker. dump them all to a 1-T hdd to get it over with.

-vhelp 5482

[Cornucopia]

Just a guess, but I'm thinking that the tapes were stretched. This would mess up the alignment & tracking. For all purposes, the tape is "running slower" now.

If you could independently adjust the tracking angle & azimuth, the head speed and the tape speed, you SHOULD be able to find the right mix that TEMPORARILY puts this back into a good picture. And then it would be smart to IMMEDIATELY capture it to PC.

I'd suggest taking this to a lab that can do those kinds of adjustments rather than fart with it yourself and possibly further mess up the tapes and/or your decks.

Kinda kills the old analog nostalgia, doesn't it.

Scott